The classic Detroit Diesel has become not just legendary, but iconic. Thanks to its two-stroke design, it always sounds like its revving twice as fast as it really is, and that along with its blower resulted in its nickname “Screaming Jimmy”. The -71 family—named after the number of cubic inches per cylinder—firstfound its way into the 1938 GM/Yellow Model 719 coach and in 1939 was regularly available on mid and heavy-weight GMC trucks, which also got a handsome restyle that year too.
The Detroit Diesels were exclusive to GMC for its trucks and buses for almost two decades, giving them a competitive advantage. Although the two-stroke DD engines are no longer available for trucks and highway equipment, they are still being built new 85 years later by Detroit Diesel/MTU for military applications. Factory rebuilt units, parts and service are also widely available, so expect to hear the unmistakable scream of the Jimmy well into its second century.
These two engines are the Adam and Eve of all Detroit Diesels. They were the first two-stroke diesels built by GM’s Winton Engine subsidiary, for the 1933 Chicago Century of Progress Fair, where they powered GM’s large exhibit. They were the result of a lengthy effort by Charles Kettering, director GM’s Research Laboratory, to develop a lighter, faster-running diesel engine with an eye to railroad and marine use.
There were a number of obstacles, including the requisite high-pressure unit injector and adapting a suitable type of blower (Roots), which was necessary for the two-stroke diesel cycle to blow in fresh intake air and force the exhaust out through the valves all in within just about half or less of one stroke. The result was the 600 hp eight cylinder engines as used at the 1933 exhibit, which were essentially test units as there were still considerable reliability issues to resolve.
Burlington Railroad President Ralph Budd, who was in the early stages of developing a radical new lightweight streamlined train, had heard about their development. Despite GM’s reluctance, he convinced them to sell him one of the first of these engines, which powered his 1934 Zephyr to unheard of levels of efficiency and speed. The GM/Winton 201 engine would soon be powering a number of locomotives, and its successor engines gave GM’s EMD division practically a monopoly on diesel electric locomotives for decades to come. Here’s a more detailed look at the development of GM’s first generation of these large diesels.
Step two was to create a family of significantly smaller engines utilizing the same basic operating principles, for transport use as well as many other applications. The development of what became the -71 family began in 1934, and by 1937, it was ready. It offered unparalleled power-to-weight ratios compared to the larger, heavier and slower-running four stroke diesel engines of the time.
Some 400 units were built in 1938, with GM’s very advanced Yellow Coach Model 719 being the primary recipient. Its rear-mounted 6-71 DD made 165 hp—also available in GM’s transit buses—making it the first truly competitive diesel coach engine against the popular Hall-Scott gas powered buses. In terms of fuel economy there was no comparison. The DD-powered GM coaches quickly came to utterly dominate a market that had been very fragmented, with dozens of medium and smaller bus builders. By the late ’50s, GM highway and transit coaches practically owned the market.
In 1939, the Jimmys were available in a wide range of GMC trucks, from 3.5 to 8 ton ratings. There were two versions each of the 3-71 and 4-71, with 83.5 and 110 hp respectively, as well as economy versions with smaller injectors, rated at 65 and 86 hp respectively. The 165 hp 6-71 with a very stout 525 ft.lb. torque rating was also available on special order, and then standard on all 900 series trucks starting in 1940. All of them made their maximum rated hp at 2,000 rpm.
It’s helpful to keep in mind that over-the-road speeds of trucks back then were typically in the 30-40 mph range, but with the advent of the higher-powered diesels like the 6-71, speeds pushed up into the 45-plus mph territory.
Here’s some period ads extolling the virtues of the new Detroit Diesel.
Diesels were just starting to make some headway in highway trucks in the 1930s, although the difficult economic situation of the extend periods of recession put a damper in the investment of new trucks. By 1939, the time was right, in more ways than one.
The compelling story of the greater efficiency and much lower fuel costs of diesel fuel was increasingly harder to ignore. This trucker swapped out the gas engines in his existing GMC trucks. This was not uncommon at the time.
GM’s modular family of -71 diesels allowed them to cover a wide range of power needs, on the road or off, in applications from pumps, generators, off-highway equipment, etc.; anything as long as it wasn’t in direct competition with a GM division’s products.
That led to a lot of complaints, given GM’s dominant market share in so many segments. A federal consent decree in 1956 finally forced GM to sell the DD engine to competitors, including truck and bus manufacturers. The DD quickly became almost universal in transit and highway buses, and steadily increased its market share in trucks, like this 1958 Kenworth. I don’t have ready market share stats available, but in the sixties and seventies, the DD was very popular, duking it out with Cummins for leadership in the heavy duty truck engine market. That directly lead to a number of smaller independent diesel engine makers bowing out, including Hercules, Buda, P&H and Waukesha.
Here’s a couple more of these early pre-war GMC trucks. This one, like the one at the top, has the 4-71 version, the tell-tale being their regular-sized hoods. 110 hp doesn’t sound like much, but it was about the same as GMC’s mid-sized six cylinder gas engine of the time, the 361, which was rated at 118 hp but had considerably less torque than the 4-71 (284 vs. 350).
This GMC, from 1941-1942, has the 6-71, evidenced by its extended hood in the front to accommodate it. GMC ‘s largest gas engine at the time (1941-1942), the 477 six, was rated at 152 hp and 385 lb.ft. of torque, both less than the 165 hp and 525 lb.ft. of the 6-71.
The GMC COE (Cab Over Engine) line also was available with the diesels, although I couldn’t readily find a vintage shot of one, as this one is missing a vertical exhaust stack.
Total maximum GCVW (Gross Combined Vehicle Weight) of the largest of these GMC trucks was 90,000 lbs, which is more than the current baseline US federal maximum of 80,000 lbs (a number of states have higher exceptions to that).
The Detroit Diesels were quickly conscripted for service during WW2, which required a significant expansion of their production facilities. There was of course an almost insatiable need for power plants of all sorts during the war, and the DD quickly found itself in a number of applications.
By utilizing extra large 90 mm injectors, it was possible to increase the normal 165 hp of a military marine 6-71 to 225 hp in “Battle” mode for a (hopefully) short duration.
Its compact size made it suitable to be packaged in multiples, most common in this twin setup used in a variety of marine and tracked vehicles.
This was of course long before the 12V-71 was developed, which simplified high power tasks.
There was even this quad power package.
It was a foreshadowing of the ultimate member of the -71 engine, the 24V71T, this one sporting four turbochargers.
Turbos and four valve heads became available in 1957, and the 6-71’s power rating went up to 190 hp (non-turbo) and 236 hp with turbo. Later versions with larger injectors and higher maximum engine speed upped that, to 238 hp (without turbo) and 270 hp with turbo. In later years, marine versions like this 6-71 TIB (Turbo Intercooled Bypass blower) outfitted by one of the marine suppliers was rated at up to 485 hp, at close to 2600 rpm. Keeping one healthy required careful attention to the cooling system, as excess heat was the enemy of longevity.
The Roots blower on all Jimmys did not make them “supercharged”, as they only created the necessary “draft” to properly scavenge the cylinder, not an increase in actual atmospheric pressure therin. Given the limited duration of the compression cycle on these, even turbos did not add all that much actual boost; by blowing into the blower’s inlet, they mostly allowed the blower to “freewheel”, since it did not have to work to create the necessary pressure. That alone added much of the additional power of the turbo versions, as these blowers easily required twenty or more hp.
The DD diesel family was soon expanded in both directions. The larger (110 Series) was essentially a scaled-up 71 series. In 1950, the smaller 51 series arrived, and it made do without any exhaust valves at all, operating on the loop-charge principle—not unlike most two-stroke gas engines—except that its fuel was of course injected directly into the cylinder.
Here’s a cross section of a 4-51 that shows both the intake and exhaust ports (right side) and the pushrod-actuated unit injector at the top.
This system limited their use to non-automotive applications, as they did not operate as successfully over the wider range of engine speeds required in that type of use. They were used as pumps, generators, other stationary applications and in marine use where engine speed varied little.
In 1957, the -51 series was replaced by the -53 series, which was essentially a scaled-down -71 series. Like the -71 series, it came in a large variety of cylinder multiples, including this 8V-53. Apparently there were some 25 12V-53 engines built, but few have survived. Given the overlap in power with the various -71 engines, it’s hard to imagine what the point was; most likely it was a military installation that had very specific space requirements, since the -53 was a more compact engine.
The 3-53 and 4-53 were widely used in medium sized trucks, mostly GMC. Studebaker used these two when it decided to pioneer diesels in the low-medium truck range, offering the 3-53 even on one ton trucks, the smallest at the time.The -53 series was very widely used in marine applications as well as all sorts of industrial ones. Like the -71 series, they were compact, powerful in relation to their weight, durable, and relatively easy to fix if something did go wrong, given that all these DD engines used cylinder liners. That allowed for quick in-frame replacement of worn liners, pistons and rings.
With ever increasing demands for more power and higher truck and bus speeds, the Series 92 arrived in 1974, in V6, V8, V12 and V16 forms. They were essentially Series 71 engines with larger bores, sharing the same basic architecture and physical size. These engines soon replaced the -71 as the engines of choice in buses, where they were still highly dominant, as well as trucks and the usual wide range of other applications.
As with the 71 Series, power outputs varied depended on the size of the injector nozzle as well as whether it was turbocharged. The 6V92 came in 270, 307, 322 and 335 hp versions; the 8V92 with 360, 365, 430 and 435 hp.The 6V92T was marketed as a more fuel efficient alternative to the then-popular 8V-71, offering similar power with a 10-15% improvement in efficiency.
In 1987, DD introduced the Series 60 four cycle inline six engine with full electronic controls. It was the beginning of the end for the two-stroke engines for on-highway use, and by 1995, the last “Screaming Jimmys” were sold for that purpose. There were two main reasons: ultimately, the four stroke diesels were more efficient, thanks to their longer intake and power strokes. Also, two stroke diesels are more challenging for emission controls, essentially for the same reason. And four stroke diesels can be turbocharged to very high boost levels, allowing the higher outputs of modern diesel engines. All of the early advantages of the DD two-stroke diesels ended up being negated or surpassed by modern four stroke diesels.
The only place were two stroke diesels are still unbeatable is in the largest marine applications, like this Wärtsilä-Sulzer RTA96-C, the world’s largest diesel engine. But there are a number of unique features that have optimized its efficiency that are not feasible in transport-sized engines, including using each piston’s down stroke to compress the intake air for the neighboring piston, as well as an extremely long stroke in relation to its bore.
Even then, Wärtsilä’s smaller four stroke marine engine, the 31, is more efficient by a small margin. Both of them can exceed 50% efficiency.
GM exited the on-road market via a joint venture with Penske, who eventually sold out to Daimler. The two-stroke diesels, by then only built for off-highway use, ended up with MTU, and sold to the Swedish firm Tognum in 2005. Tognum was bought back by Daimler and Roll-Royce Holdings, who own it jointly. MTU continues to build a limited number of new two-cycle DD engines for military applications as well as offering a full line of remanufactured engines, parts and support for classic Detroit Diesel engines. It would not surprise me to see it still being built on its 100th birthday, a feat unlike any other engine, to the best of my knowledge.
I’ve been a bit obsessed with Jimmys ever since I first heard one as a kid, which left an indelible aural memory. And as a young adult, I drove a Jimmy-powered city bus for almost year. It’s not just their ability to “scream”, it’s also the distinctive throb idle and the way they sound as they’re revved. My obsession has recently been (self)ignited by some videos by Bus Grease Monkey, who goes around the country in his awesome 1940s 6-71 Silversides bus, helping folks to get old DD hulks running again. This video is pretty typical, inasmuch as it usually doesn’t take all that much.
These diesels are very simple devices, with no ignition or carburation systems, and of course no electronic control systems, although the later DD’s did have those, to the consternation of old-school mechanics. There’s no doubt in my mind that folks will still be waking up long-dormant Jimmys and getting them to scream again well into their second century.
Postscript:
Although the 1939 trucks were the first regular production GMC trucks with DD diesels, there appear to have been at least two earlier applications of a diesel in a GMC truck. I ran across this photo at a forum, of a 1934 vintage T-61 fitted with a Hercules four cylinder four-stroke diesel. There is nothing on it in my “GMC Heavy Duty Trucks 1927-1987” book, and it was most likely either a test bed or a customer that requested it.
In that book I did find this photo that claims that this older T-95 was fitted with a “GM Model 546 diesel engine” as a test bed. Since there never was a Model 546, I assume that caption is meant to say “567”, which was the EMD locomotive engine that replaced the original Winton 201 in 1937. But these were enormous engines, with 567 cubic inches per cylinder. The engine is apparently a four cylinder, and without a doubt, not a version of the 567 family, which wouldn’t begin to fit in this engine bay, even a one cylinder version.
It might have been a competitor’s engine used for bench-marking or possibly it might have been an early prototype of a DD 4-71, but it looks different then they ended up being. By 1937, the -71 Series engine was finalized and going into pre-production. Given that it’s in a working truck, the caption might well be wrong, and that it’s got a diesel engine from another source.
Related reading:
The Birth of the GM Two-Stroke Diesel – Excerpts from “My Years With GM” by Alfred Sloan
Curbside Classic: 1947 GM PD3751 “Silversides” Coach – The First Modern Diesel Bus
Trackside Classic: 1955 Union Pacific EMD E9 – The Last Of The Classic Diesel Streamliners
1959-1961 GMC DLR/DFR 8000 “Crackerbox” – GM’s Deadly Sin #32
One minor correction, the 71 series engine is a dry sleeve engine, 53 and 92 series are wet sleeve engines.
Thanks for pointing that out. I’ve amended the text.
My first truck was a 67 cabover White with a 318 in it. Like all Detroits it was a leaker . Why I still remember this I don’t know but in the early 70’s l stopped in the middle of the night at Shaffer’s truck stop in Breezewood PA to use the restroom . On the stall door someone had written ” Bought a model of a Peterbilt, Had a 318 in it . When I finished I sat it on top of the tv . Next morning the tv was covered in with oil “
Snyder’s gateway truck stop.
Well… it was impossible to get lost with a screaming Detroit as you could always follow the oil drops and find your way back home. Lol
The CO White were normally nickname “little hells”🤣 🔥 ” infiernitos” in Spanish. Cuz they got too 🥵 inside.
Remember some of them used to call those cabovers in the mid to late ’60s whites the Japanese cabovers.
Don’t quite know how that name came about but they were calling them that LOL
Actually there is a few 12v53’s still around.
Good to know. I’ve amended the text.
Great history, brings back some fine memories of my days on the road. Also explains the constant ringing in my ears, but it was all for a good cause! Thank you.
Nice post. Can still remember riding both Old and New Looks with their 6-71s….but the most vivid memory is driving M-113 APCs in Korea with 6V-53T engines – and the exhaust stack up top not too far from your ears when driving with the hatch open.
One of the many reasons I wear hearing aids now….:-)
Bedford’s flagship TM range featured the 6V-71 from introduction in 1974 up to 1983. Other Detroit Diesel options in the range were the 8V-71 and 6V-92TTA, the latter up to 1984.
Truck makers Bedford, FTF and -IIRC- Astra (Italy) used DD engines in Europe. I don’t know of any others. Cummins was much more common, especially in the UK.
FTF offered the V6, V8 and V12 71-series. From 1979 onwards (when a new Motor Panels cab was put on the chassis) the V6 and V8 92-series.
Scammell Crusader.
You can say that again!
Thank you. You are a great source of British and European wagon information.
I think that most were Cummins or Rolls powered in Britain. The army used them to move heavy plant (Royal Engineers) and I think that the REME had some wreckers.
Oliver used Jimmy’s as well, listen to this one pull…
Fascinating read, thank you!
What I found most interesting, and amazing, is that back in 1957, turbo and 4-valve heads became available.
1957–wow!
While GM was an early adopter of turbos (Olds turbo V8, Corvair, and then with the 1978 turbo V6), it was a laggard in 4-valve heads.
Turbos had been used in diesel engines for some time already, going back to the 1920s in large marine units. In 1952, Volvo offered the first regular production turbodiesel truck, and Cummins had some too.
Four valve heads have been around since the 1910s, and were not that uncommon on racing engines. Keep in mind that the four valves in the DD were all exhaust valves, as there are no intake valves. It improved the rapid scavenging of the exhaust by the blower, allowing the DD to run at somewhat higher rpm with larger injectors.
This brings back memories of plowing regrowth in Western Australia in 1972 with an Oliver 1950 tractor pulling a 20 disc plow for Wrights Prospecting at Geraldton
What GM achieved with these engines is amazing given that all other 2 stroke designs either failed or were not quite as good as the DD (other than P/H in the US, Krupp in Germany, Nissan in Japan, Foden in the UK, JaAZ in the USSR (with its own version of the GM design) and AVL List in Austria all had a go and ultimately gave up).
Nice .
It’s 05:30 so I can’t listen to the videos but I’ll be back .
-Nate
In the last two years, the little tug that pulls a sand-dredging barge past my deck every few days finally had its DD replaced with a four-stroke diesel. When it was DD-powered, the noise drowned out everything from conversation to thought. With the new engine, I only know it is going by if I look out the window. I admire the DD for its advancements and significance, but I’m not sorry that they’re getting scarce in service. I suspect that the men who had to work with them paid a dear price in hearing loss.
As a tinnitus sufferer, I’m not sorry to see noisy engines disappear, except at shows and the like. I’d rather hear a DD on a video where I can control the volume than in real life.
Great article, thanks. As you pointed out, emission control of the 2 stroke diesel engine became more and more of a challenge as regulations became for stringent. As a result, Detroit Diesel was one of the first diesel engine manufacturers to equip their engines with electronic fuel controls with their DDEC system. DDEC controlled injection timing and duration was so effective that it was incorporated into the design of the 4 stroke 60 Series engines from the start. As good as the 53’s, 71’s, and 92’s were, Detroit probably stayed with them too long. They had lost considerable on-road market share during the 80’s and didn’t regain a strog presence in that market until the successful 60 Series established itself.
These days, is DD Freightliner only or are they also optional in the other US brands?
For the most part only in Freightliner and Western Star, but they are available in Pierce fire apparatus.
Right, thanks!
G’day, thanks for your article on Detroits, l own a 50 ft steel cruiser built in 1947/49 here in Cairns Australia, she has a 4-71 which l’m led to believe was installed in 1954 so l guess it’s a 2 valve version. We have totally refitted the boat over the last 4 years but the engine has not been touched apart from oil and filter changes, its still running strong ! Regards Darren
I’ve had much seat time in old DD screaming demon equipped trucks. Your work day ends with your ears ringing and as you try to drift off to sleep you still hear that scream. The biggest waste of money was a radio in a Detroit Diesel equipped truck. They sound cool for a few minutes but hour after hour, not so much
Nearly all of this new to me, Paul. I was reading Hot Rod, etc. in the early-mid-1960s, with regular mentions of a “6-71 blower,” but it was only decades later that I realized it was equipment from a GM *truck* engine….go figure!
I like the two stroke diesels, learned on horizontal versions in Crown schoolbuses. I can still run a rack with the best of them. I have seen a Detroit with the military battle speed governor. It has a normal idle to max no load range then an extra position that moved the rack to full fuel and held it there regardless of engine rpm. Allis Chalmers used the 2-71 in the HD-5 crawler tractors, bigger models had Buda or even 110 series Detroits. Allis even tried to get into the truck market with their “Purple Monster” engine. 4 stroker. Nissan copied the Detroit but used an inline pump rather than the unit injectors. For a real interesting 2 cycle diesel look up the Rootes TS3.
I believe the Nissans were more closely related to the German Krupp design (NOT a DD copy) which Nissan licensed.
I had a Bluebird motor home with a 475hp 8V92 Detroit and loved to hear the roar from that engine. I also worked around 4 cylinder versions to 16V71’s in old Euclid articulated mining trucks which made an amazing racket.
Virtually every old Detroit Diesel hand swore that those two stroke engines ran better the harder they were run, essentially full throttle all the time. After owing one I think they were right.
Very enjoyable article, Dr Prof., most appreciated.
I’ve never quite understood turbos on these things, as it seems awfully like blowing hard into a holed pipe, so I’m glad you explain that it doesn’t add much to power.
For all the mechanical genius of these things, I absolutely hated them as a kid. The scream was just that of an hysterical adult reaching fever-pitch, and the stink was utterly choking. In pre-aircon times, seeing one turning the air black and the ears blue just ahead in traffic was a nightmare, as trucks were still pretty slow accelerators in the ’70’s. It was a signal that the next god-knows-how-much amount of time would be filled with tense screaming and unbreathable brown fug. I’m glad actual users of the beasts have above said that that famed racket got old pretty early in a work shift.
That said, V16 giants (massive literage, maybe up to 150), EMD 567’s powered our ’50’s built diesel-electric interstate and freight trains for a long, long time, and the huge, moaning, wa-wa-wom of these building speed is still the sound of travel excitement to me.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victorian_Railways_B_class_(diesel)#/media/File:Spirit-of-progress-70th-anniversary-2007.jpg
(Engine apart, these were a local design and build, as US locos were too heavy for tracks here).
Grew up with the Electromotive sound too, tens of thousands of Ks away in Israel which to this day uses solely EMD-engined locomotives, many of which are Spanish made and look like no US-built EMD. On the road the DDs were not popular (Israel had a lot of hilly roads with sudden elevation changes which favoured 4 stroke engines with low down torque like the Cummins, Mack or Volvo ones). We had them in many GMC buses but they were all swapped for Leyland 600s eventually…
Detroit Diesels, or any diesels back then didn’t have to smoke heavily, and if properly adjusted, they didn’t smoke, or only barely so. Black smoke is from one thing only: unburned fuel, meaning the it’s not burning all of it. And back then all the diesels were as likely to do that as the DD.
The buses I drove in Iowa City were well-maintained, and there was barely any visible smoke, and grayish if so, which means the fuel has been fully combusted.
If you look at vintage photos of diesel trucks on the go, you’ll commonly see very little. Having said that a start from a dead stop tended to lug the engine right at the moment of clutch engagement, which tended to create an over-rich situation resulting in a black exhaust.
Also, if you look at pictures of long strings of locomotives, you’ll typically see one or two with significantly blacker exhaust than the others.
But yes, the smoke was common enough. And it was really obnoxious in Europe, with all the delivery trucks that had low exhausts, and the taxis too. The air in a European city in the 70s, 80s and 90s was typically atrocious, as the narrow streets and buildings trapped it. Very stinky too.
Yes, the turbo thing on DDs was a question I’d had forever, but I’ve finally figured it out. Better late than never.
Worked on diesels for many years DD was my favorite lot of people called them Yamahas because of 2 stroke loved to hear them sing!
I repowerd a 1973 international 1210 4×4 pickup with a 353n from a gama goat . It is a aluminum block compresser with military 100 hp injectors. My girlfriend was not a fan of the scream so I got rid of it. Soon there after she got rid of me. I really miss that rig. I used it for 20 yrs.while Iwas working in the logging industry where much of our equipment also was powered by the screamers.
My friends always new when I was coming to visit a mile ahead of my arrival.
I miss that old SCREAMING CORNBINDER .
What a testament to the skills of the GM engineers. While Mr. Kettering took the lead I am sure he was supported by a cast of hundreds, maybe even thousands over the years.
In the 1930s GM came out with a great diesel engine. In the in 1950s they came out with several great V8 engines, especially the small block Chevy. If in the 1970s they had put their minds and financial resources to the task they could have come out with superb 4 cylinder engines and the world would be a different place today.
Yeah they were so good that even Ford put them in their equipment LOL.
Aka Louisville 9000 8000
Enjoyed the article. Noticed that GM used the term 2 cycle in advertising (think your article did couple times too). DD are 2 stroke engines – not 2 cycle – still only one cycle regardless of strokes.
I worked in a gravel pit between college years. They had a Euclid dump with a 6-110 DD engine. The driver on one shift was a short Frenchman very proud of his truck. Any slow down, he would be out polishing and wiping the hood, windows, etc. Huge and long string of swear words the morning she ate a piston and pooped oil out the exhaust all over hood and cab.
For 30 years I operated a farm drainage business with a plow on a 1965 Euclid C6 dozer with 6-71 4 valve. Locals knew when i was in the neighborhood. I think that’s why my left ear continues to ring. Miss the sound not the mud. Been described as glorious way to turn fuel into noise.
Noticed that GM used the term 2 cycle in advertising (think your article did couple times too). DD are 2 stroke engines – not 2 cycle – still only one cycle regardless of strokes.
I’m not understanding. The terms “two-stroke” and ‘two-cycle” are used interchangeably, and mean the same thing. There’s one power stroke or cycle for every two strokes/cycles overall. In a four stroke/cycle engine, there’s one power stroke/cycle for every four strokes/cycles. A “cycle” or ‘stroke” being defined as one complete movement of the piston from top to bottom, or vice versa.
FWIW, DD/MTU, which still makes some of these two-cycle DD engines, refers to them as “2-Cycle” engines exclusively on their website and their materials: https://www.mtu-solutions.com/eu/en/service/2-cycle-service-products.html
As Paul elucidates, there is no difference between a “2-cycle” and a “2-stroke” engine. The proper terms are 4-stroke cycle and 2-stroke cycle, but one or the other word is usually omitted in all but the most formal usage.
In French, the terms in use are 2-temps and 4-temps, meaning “2-times” and “4-times”. Just as idiomatic as “2-cycle”—and just as readily understood.
I have one miniature 6-71 maked for GM for distributors produce in 1950 aprox.
My email
valdirlodycla@gmail.com
No Paul ;
You are not missing anything, they’re the same, just one different word .
-Nate
I always thought it was one of those English/US English things.
It’s Twostroker in German as well.
Nas décadas de 50 e 60 meu pai era revendedor GM Detroit Diesel na cidade litorânea de Santos, São Paulo , Brasil !
Ele cuidava da manutenção dos caminhões, Ônibus, Balsas, Iates e motores estacionários.
Eu o acompanhava em seu trabalho!
Ele ganhou da GM uma miniatura do 6-71 fundida em metal com aproximadamente 15 cm .
Se alguém tiver interesse nesta peça para coleção poderei dispor .
Meu email é : valdirlodycla@gmail.com
Up the hills slow
Down the hills fast
If that aint a Dee-troit
Ill kiss your *ss….
@ Rick :
I’ve been saying :
Uphill slow
Downhill fast
Mileage first &
Safety last
For many decades now….. =8-) .
-Nate
Funniest story concerning a Screaming Jimmy was told by a coworker.
He said “The best way to drive one is to slam your hand in the door and take it out on the engine”
Drove 8.71 owned 6v92 and 8.92 with DDEC no.1
Pulled into Detroit on i78 Pennsylvania
Young mechanic never worked on DDEC 1 since school
I ordered my star from factory. Jan 1987
Sold June 2001 rather than rebuild 4th time
Approaching 4 million km
Yes it marked its spot…a leaker…but like phantom 309
There were some that saw nothing but tail lights from my old girl my western star
Just sold my 1976 3/4 ton Chevy pickup with a 4-53n engine, bypass blower and turbo charged. Had a 5speed overdrive trans. The truck had two 4” straight pipes, stacks of course. With the rear window slider open it was quit loud with the Jacobs breaks on! Installed the engine in 1978. The injectors were a little too much but the engine met emissions at night only
Including the 30’s production, how many total DD’s were built by the end of the war?
I don’t have that information available. That might take some deep digging.
DD’s production facilities were significantly expanded for war production. Prior to the start of that, DD production was probably several thousand per year.
https://usautoindustryworldwartwo.com/General%20Motors/detroit-diesel.htm might be a start.
Really enjoyed this article. I learned a lot. My Dad drove big trucks for 40 years, I spent quite a bit of my grade-school summertime (mid-1970s) in the passenger seat of various trucks. The 2-stroke Jimmys were my favorites. A neighbor has an old FWD dump truck with a 6-71 in it, he flew past my house in it one day a few weeks ago and I still got chills. Thanks.
I think the difference between those who like Detroits and those (most of us) who hate them may be ownership. If you got stuck owning one, well, you sort of have to justify your decision, right? If you drove for some sadistic employer they were “f-ing Detroits”. You didn’t even have to say eardrum-shreading filthy leaker with no bottom-end guts.
Sorry, you’ll have to speak up.
Having experienced many hours in front of a 3-53 Gama Goat, you needed to wear ear protection (muffs) as there was really nothing between you and the engine to absorb the noise. The 6V-53 used in the USMC Light Armored Vehicle was quieter, since it had its own engine compartment to shield/deflect the noise.
I believe that all military production of the 6V-53 is done at a DD/MTU reman facility in Kansas, but it has been 25 years since I visited that facility so they may be made elsewhere today. The newer generation of LAV uses a Cat engine.
Another legacy of the Jimmy engines is the blower, which pretty much transformed drag racing and lives on in aftermarket form today.
When I was in the trucking industry (75-85) one could always pick the new DD equipped class 8 truck by the oil puddle underneath it.
Yes that is very true. Not only the puddle but fully wound up specially the 318 ya would be moving along at about 18 mph needle pegged out grabbing gears 23 or 2400 RPM which is what they liked and you thought it was coming at you at about 80 mph lol.
Course back then you would always pull into a truck stop grab a cup of coffee tell him check the fuel level and add oil..
I must have missed this one the first time – nice discussion of a great sounding engine. I too watch DD videos just to hear them run. If I had more room and were perhaps a little more crazy then I am, I’d like to have one just to fire it up and listen to it (with ear muffs on) every once in a while.
Aaron ;
If you like vintage engine sounds there’s also Lister Diesels now made in India, theyre dirt cheap and come assembled and “ready to run” ~ in reality you need to take it completely apart and clean all the left over sand from the casting and SWARF etc, make sure everything is right -then- they’ll start right up and plod along making a most wonderful sound….
These things are BIG single cylinder Diesel APU engines .
-Nate
I was trained as a diesel mechanic in the Navy in the ’70s, first on the 12V71TTA on a 100 foot torpedo retriever, ran yellow tag S90s. Twin screw boat, two engines back to back with reduction gear in the middle. The engines had the stamped steel valve covers and two panhead screw injector racks. Balanced out the engine speeds by ear, when all four were “on it” they made a hell of a sweet sound.
Later trained on and worked on most 71 series Detroits, (and had a couple run away on me, truly a “skid marks in the skivvys” moment), one of my favorite memories was working on a couple of 24V71 powered generator sets. What a magnificent sound they made when coming up to 1800 rpm!
I’ve worked on lots of diesels but the 71 series Detroit is by far my favorite. To this day I know in an instant when I hear one. Thanks for the memories.!
Yes indeed for years we used to call them the bus motors when younger.
Although they powered so many other things it was that classic sound that reminded us of the city buses whatever even a rick would go by or a boat powered by a double d 2 cycle.
Detroit Diesel had a fix for the oil dripping from the air box drains. They routed the airbox drains into the oil pan. They used check valves in these lines so when the engine was running air box pressure wouldn’t add to the crankcase pressure. When the engine shuts off the check valves open and any accumulated oil from the air box drains into the pan. Ironically they used cheap O-rings on the cylinder liners in the 92 series, these leaking O-rings would let coolant into the air box and eventually when the engine is shut off the coolant can now drain into the oil pan. The O-rings on the injector tubes of the 92’s were also subject to leaking coolant into the engine oil. Lastly a redesigned water pump seal vent on the 92’s was prone to plugging up and when the pump seal leaked the coolant, again, would find its way into the engine oil. There were fixes for the problems and I did a lot of them.
Its kind of ironic the GM was forced to sell their engine to other customers and eventually they couldn’t sell the engines to anyone. GMC ended up putting Cats and Cummins in their trucks along side their DD’s. The 60 Series was a very successful engine but by then GM sold the heavy truck division to Volvo. Volvo quickly killed the Astro and General, the Brigadier did survive for a few years before Volvo killed that too.
Fifty eight now and was V-92 overhaul factory certified at 22 years of age. Father operated a fleet of over 150 silver 6V92 Detroits. Semi retired after an over 38 year career as a licenced diesel mechanic on all makes and sizes and still get a few calls a year to service two stroke GM/Detroits including a few Sherman tanks, marine, industrial and truck. Although fully electronic and emmission trained ,S-60 and MBE I will never miss the sound of any two stroke screaming at full load. Still recall the old German diesel teacher at college while having us watch a black and white movie reel on diesel engines. Black smoke vat givs? Class replies UNBURNED FUEL!
I worked at International Harvester from 1971 to 1980… worked on Detroits (53, 71, 92), Cummins, Caterpillar, and IHC Diesels. I taught engines, transmissions, rear ends, electrical, brakes, and air conditioning at the IH training center in Dallas… FOND MEMORIES…