(first posted 3/24/2016) Paul’s recent write-up on the 1965 Impala Super Sport gave a comprehesive overview of the car. But what was it like to live with on a daily basis? In March 1966, Road Test ran an owner’s report on a 1966 Impala Super Sport, giving the highs and lows of this particular car.
I didn’t know consumer auto leasing was a thing in 1966.
But it sounds like a very short term lease, by today’s standards, maybe a year?
The writer’s post-purchase dealer visits (real or contemplated) sound all too familiar.
So. Cal. “Freeway Hop” shows how substandard quality was not restricted to American automakers, this time probably from low-balled bids on Interstate Highway paving. Should we blame politicians or the contractors? And this was back when Calif. had money to burn.
Some European countries usually bid out highway contracts to include all maintenance for a predefined period (usually 20 years iirc) to be done by the original contractor as part of the initial payout. I’m not sure if they thought of that before or after the bulk of the US Interstate system was bid out.
I understand Autobahns have very thick paving, and they replace a whole section if any cracks or bumps develop. One can’t have unrestricted speed limits with such irregularities.
This can’t be inexpensive, so I seriously doubt Americans would tolerate the funding for it, let alone the high-speed driving it would make possible.
I don’t think it was a quality issue so much as a design problem having to do with the spacing of concrete blocks (and the expansion spaces thereof). One of the issues with the older freeways in Southern California was that they were clearly designed for lower speeds than they eventually had to bear.
from what i understand, “freeway hop” is caused by the front part of the poured slabs of concrete gradually being forced down under the weight of truck traffic. so the slabs turn into little “ramps”. its always been more noticeable to me in the 2 right lanes, where trucks travel most, so it kinda makes sense to me.
Yup. And that, ladies and gentlemen, was why there were Plymouth Sport Furys. 🙂 It is a terrible thing to have to make a choice between 1) what do I want to drive and 2) what does everyone else want to drive because that is where the best resale value is for a lease.
But I have no doubt that the Impala had fabulous resale value, because GM really was the gold standard in that department in the 60s. This was why my father would never set foot in a Chrysler dealer back in the 70s. He leased Lincolns for what he considered reasonable payments. Chrysler resale dropped like a rock back then, and made the cars terribly expensive for him.
“Chrysler resale dropped like a rock back then…”
Ha ha – back then? What else is new? Same old, same old.
Our family had the ’66 4-dr hardtop with the 327 4bbl. It was a very good car except for the Holley carb–lots of issues. A Carter or Rochester would have been much better.
My 66 Impala 327 had a Rochester carb. I thought they all did.
He is right about the CA Legislature screwing up engines and reducing mileage, and things just kept getting worse.
Except the smog. It took a while, but eventually the smog got a whole lot better.
And has continued to get better even since the ’90s, despite greater traffic density.
What, exactly was the “smog equipment” on a ’66 Impala? A PCV valve, for cryin’ out loud?
I doubt that the OEMs were required to tamper protect the mixture screws on the carb in ’66 (but I could be wrong.)
Timing was retarded and recurved,, EGR, air-pumps, and of course, some newer profile cams. Reduced compression was more of a 1971 thing if memory serves.
For the most part, 1966 California cars got the same kind of modifications applied to 49-state cars. It varied a lot depending on manufacturer and engine — some had minor engine modifications, some had air injection, some had EGR. PCV valves were already required; I believe, though I’d have to double check, that California mandated PCV valves for MY1965.
No EGR until much later. PCV valves, 1961. 49 state cars (and imports) had only PCV until ’68. GM and Ford used air injection, along with carb and ignition mods. Chrysler got by without air injection. My ’66 Dodge 273 V8 had sealed idle screws and a vacuum switch on the spark advance.
Upon sale, used cars back to ’55 had PCV retrofitted. Some time later (dont remember the year), NOx devices, either EGR or vacuum advance disconnect (with a overheat warning sticker for the dash) were retrofitted to the ’66 and later cars.
Nikita is correct, no EGR valves until much later, 1973 to be specific. At this time emission controls were basic, AIR systems, carb and ignition tuning. Off the top of my head, carb sealing of idle screws on Q-jet carbs for GM didn’t come in until the mid 1970’s when the Q-jet was revamped. Even then though, this was just to prevent tampering on a normal tune up. A standard overhaul as per factory service manuals required the plugs to be removed so they could be adjusted after the rebuild.
When the family moved from Portland to So Cal in 1967, for about 6 weeks my chest hurt, felt like a giant hand was squeezing my lungs.
The doctor said it was the smog, but not to worry, I would eventually get used to it.
The 66 Chevy got a belt driven air (smog) pump with anti backfire valve, along with pcv and warm air hose to air filter.
A burnt out light bulb and a noisy non essential instrument is not the end of the world, although the parts availability problem seems odd, especially a light bulb. 15 mpg is normal for a car like this for the times.
“The doctor said it was the smog, but not to worry, I would eventually get used to it.”
I can’t not picture the doctor with a cigarette in his mouth while saying this in the exam room.
Maybe you missed this in a previous Road Test review (VW vs Renault):
“Southern California is a great place to test paint and chrome. here, in the smog, fog and blazing sunshine, the best dip jobs of the Old World’s Master Craftsmen go to powder and chromed parts become pitted like the moon.”
You may not care about pollution, or your lungs or mine– but that sounds nasty, doesn’t it?
And air is breathable now, too.
Exactly. I’m under no delusion that I could function in an alternate world of 1960s levels of emissions per car and today’s levels of traffic. (Especially if you throw in 1960s levels of secondhand tobacco smoke but that’s another matter).
Leasing on the other hand is a major contributor to the plague of “gimme the usual” grayscale sedans and CUVs with automatics and black interiors…
The approach is different, but they’re essentially doing to the Chevrolet Impala what they were doing to the Ferrari in other article. They’re claiming that the mass-market emperor has no clothes, either.
Well, the difference in this case is that this is an actual owner (well, lessor, but the point remains) relating his actual, none-too-happy experience living with the car, whereas the other is based on brief driving impressions and third-party reviews.
The conclusions are not inconsistent with other consumer reviews of the time, incidentally. This was a period when the full-size Chevrolet’s execution, styling aside, was falling behind its reputation, although its reputation had not yet been affected.
This guy should work for C/D with all his comparisons to much more expensive cars and the high life. Wonder who was paying his lease, someone else no doubt. Very much in the David E Davis school. The competition was the Galaxy and the Fury, but this guy would not know much about that, at least he got his woodish steering wheel to stare at while he slummed it.
im sure jr college professors made decent money back then. wasnt reagan putting lots of money into education?
You know, back then, you could not compare to cars of that vintage to today’s cars as to quality and reliability. Even the lousiest heaps according to CR (FCA, Range Rovers) are worlds better than 50 years ago.
You also expected no more than 2 years before a car began to rust.
That wind noise was a problem with GM’s hardtops due to the frameless front door glass. Even road tests of the period mentioned it and questioned the wisdom of such a design.
Funny: you could use the excuses the service techs used 50 years ago and just change the dates.
Some things never change. They all do that dontcha know ?
Yeah they corner on the door handles but he should have known that it had been a feature for many years by the time the 66 came out, and ordering a two speed automatic then complaining about how much gas it uses DOH.
We couldnt get the two door bodystyle here but those who managed to weave their way through the overseas funds scheme and got a new 66 Chevy were perfectly happy with them and drove them for years.
You need to understand how rare it was to find a full-size Chevrolet of this vintage without Powerglide. The three-speed Turbo Hydra-Matic was only available with the big block 396/427 engines, which few people bought. You might conceivably find a stripper Biscayne six with a three-speed manual transmission as some kind of dealer ad special, but you’d have to be pretty determined to get them to sell it to you before the end of the model year because the salesman would rather put you in something more profitable. Three-speed plus overdrive was nominally offered on the less-powerful engines and a four-speed was optional on the hotter engines, but in all likelihood, getting either would gave required a special order and the four-speed cost almost as much as Powerglide. Most B-body Chevrolets on any given lot would have Powerglide.
The other consideration is that this was a lease car, whose costs are based on depreciation. In the U.S. market, particularly in that era, book value for used cars presumes automatic transmission; a manual transmission, even a four-speed, imposed a resale value penalty. So, if you paid the extra $189 or so for a four-speed, you would lose that money plus an additional resale hit. Road Test‘s subsequent test of the Chevrolet Caprice discusses these issues in some detail.
Here in the great white north the vast majority of these came one of 2 ways, 6 cylinder 3speed or 283 Powerglide. We were a frugal bunch then so there were quite a few 6 cylinder 3 speeds. Good winter cars. You’d see the odd 327 or 396 but they were rare. A buddy had a 6 cylinder Powerglide, a truly miserable combination.
The only good thing about a Powerglide was that a short tailshaft TH350 was a virtual bolt in, which transformed many an old Chevy. How Chevy maintained it’s sales lead with that abomination for so long still puzzles me.
Did Canadian resale value suffer the same kind of hit with manual transmission?
I’m not really sure, these cars were 10 or 12 years old when I knew them. We like our conveniences as much as anyone else though so I’m sure the automatics were worth more a few years down the road. You usually saw the V-8 Powerglide in the Impala or equivalent “Cheviac” Parisienne. They were pretty rare with manual transmissions.
There were lots of 6 cylinder, 3 speed manual steering and brake Bel Airs and Biscaynes around though. You could buy one for a few hundred bucks, put on set of 50 dollar recap snows, throw a few sandbags in the trunk and have a hell of a good winter car. Everything happened so slowly it was hard to get into trouble!
In the U.S., the way used car valuation is structured, it’s not that an automatic adds to resale value, but that it’s assumed and there’s a penalty for not having it. (This is admittedly a semantic point — you could just as well consider the price less deduction the actual value, but since more than 80 percent of U.S. cars of this vintage had automatic, I suppose it made more sense the other way.)
My father was one of those in the great white north with a 6 cylinder Chevy. Although his was a 1965 Impala 2-door hardtop with a 230 six (not the 250) and a PG transmission. He bought it in 1966 with something like 8000 miles on it to replace his problematic 1960 Dodge. The Dodge was a slant six car with the three on the tree. According to my father the only reliable part of that Dodge was the slant six. The Impala was dog slow, but unlike this article he found his car reliable and enjoyable to own. His only real complaint was the lack of power, and he said he wished he got one with a 283. He kept it until about 1973 when it had over 100K miles, serving the last few years of it’s life exclusively as a winter car. By then rust had taken it’s toll on the car though so he sold it off.
NZ assembled Impalas were Canadian CKD packs but only V8s the six wasnt even available or perhaps never ordered but the all had that two speed auto, though many got modified when better trans became available, all GM cars from US,UK and AUS used the powerglide it was not a popular option most buyers just bought manual an order for automatic could keep you on the waiting list forever while the car was imported unless it was a Chev.
Funny. These cars are ever-so popular among enthusiasts today.
My teen son fell in love with early Mustangs, so I purchased a ’68 coupe basket case for us to work on as a father-son project and his first car. It is finished now, and I am amazed at how cramped the interior is, how crude the handling/suspension is, and how much fuel it consumes. That said, a 302 with headers and a Holley 4150 sounds great!
Is your bad economy with that Holly carb? Hollys really are intendedto be tuned for best power and economy. They will work out of the box, but its probably set up too rich, especially for a small v8. Re jetting it, setting the power valve opening rate and accelerator pump may help.
I had a 302 with headers and a 600 cfm 4150. It was way off when new. 2 steps leaner on all 4 jets helped a lot.
Thanks Mike….,,my next weekend project is now planned!
now if only you could get that styling with a modern fuelie distributorless ignition 327 V8, modern disc brakes and circa 1977 Caprice suspension…
My favorite comment is “not arguing with a computer”.
I’m enjoying these old Road Test articles, even though they are certainly written from something of a “down on Detroit” point of view. Having owned and driven most configurations of mid ’60s big Chevys back when I have to agree with most of what’s written regarding driving dynamics. The ’65 and ’66 cars had the looks though, which was why I always thought they outsold the competition despite being the inferior car in many ways. It never occurred to me that resale value was that much different. How times change!
So many car reviews of the day were thinly veiled advertisements for new cars, especially Motor Trend.
Road Test is refreshingly critical, rather than ‘down on Detroit’. If I were a new car buyer, I would want to know the flaws, before I buy. This is somewhat more useful than the rah-rah attitude of others.
If we had more lousy cars to be reviewed, I’d be more excited about car reviews. It’s just more fun to read a critical review of a lousy car. (I enjoyed this as much as the grilling of the VW Beetle, so I’m not just “down on Detroit.”) This article was just as enjoyable as reading the brutal reviews of “Batman vs. Superman.”
The first car I legally drove was a ’65 Impala station wagon with the same powertrain, but without A/C, power brakes, etc. The SS was obviously a sheep in wolf’s clothing, but the wagon was somewhat the opposite. A stiffer body, stiffer springs and bigger tires helped a lot. It did not heel over like a sailboat or hop over freeway concrete slabs.
Final drive gearing was also more aggressive. That 327-4bbl/PG combo was good for just over 100mph. My only objection was the requirement for super premium gas at about 40 cents a gallon.
I also got to drive a friend’s ’66 SS 396 Chevelle with the four speed. Except for the puny tires, that would have been a better car for our writer, except the resale value of that model was unknown back then.
I’ve related this several times, but dad had a 1966 Impala sports sedan, red, 6 cyl. Powerglide. No A/C but power steering and an AM radio. It sure was a beautiful car, though. Even though it was a 6 cyl, I got it up to 102 on the highway one early morning and I never complained about any lack of power – I’m a cruiser, not on a power trip.
As far as handling went on those cars – it seems most domestic cars were built for straight-line performance, not handling in curves. After all, we had the Interstate highway system and all you had to do was cruise along – no twisty curves to bother about! Back roads? Well… you made do with what you had and didn’t take chances!
My Dad bought a used 65 Impala 4 door hardtop in May 1966. The car was originally a showroom display car and one of the salesmen bought it for their wife.
The car was 2 tone…..White roof with crocus yellow body 283 V8 with 3 speed manual…..Power brakes, steering and windows but no A/C.
The salesman’s wife did not,like driving a manual transmission so the car,only had 2,000 miles on it when my Dad bought it in mid 1966.
The car regularly got close to 20 mpg on the highway with the small 8 and manual trans….
Powerglide was said to drop fuel economy by one to two MPG on the smaller V-8’s .The 15 mpg that the 327 equipped Impala in this article was equipped with sounds perfectly reasonable with a powerglide….A 3 or 4 speed stick might have raised mileage to 16 or 17 highway with that 327 motor.
I did not know quality was so poor on US cars in the 60’s or that it was generally accepted that bad quality essentially came as standard equipment. Don’t make them like they used to? Thankfully not!
Strange though as anyone I know with a 60’s Chev, Ford or other American car these days always talks about reliability, simplicity and ruggedness of their car.
Build quality was poor, but the drivetrains and transmissions were long lived.
The industry had pretty much perfected RWD, BOF/Unit construction by the 60s as they’d been assembling the same basic configuration [and some engines] for decades.
They were reliable, simple and rugged. Panel fit, paint and details were afterthoughts.
Check out some old Popular Mechanics “Owners Reports” of the period to find out what buyers during that era experienced.
Simplicity, yes.
Ruggedness, maybe. Our Impala wagon had a similar layout to a Chevy half ton Suburban back then. Chevy light trucks had all-coil suspension. We did take the Impala on dirt road camping trips.
Reliability (and longevity), maybe compared to European imports of the day, but compared to modern cars, absolutely not. I disagree that engines and (automatic) transmissions were long lived. I did plenty of valve and ring jobs on American iron at 60,000 miles or so. Except for Torqueflites, transmissions didnt last much longer. Granted, with rusting in some parts of the country, cars were scrapped before powertrain work was needed.
By the mid 1960’s, GM divisions had little autonomy. Corporate bean counters took over. GM Assembly Division was in charge of build quality. Plant management was only rewarded for number of units out the door, without any penalty for rework or warranty claims.
The average customer wanted style and speed for cheap, and that is what they got. VW was climbing in sales, but still only appealed to a fringe market.
I was just a baby at the time but I know my Dad traded in his 1969 Kingswood Estate after only 2 years for a 1971 Pontiac Grand Safari. The Chevy was a “lemon” according to him. The Pontiac was a great car.
The professor had a nice way with words. Funny review.
My dad had this same car, 66 SS only with a 283 and Powerglide. This was a company car, and he had a choice between Galaxy, Impala or Fury, and paid extra for any additional options such as the SS equipt. Before this car he had a 64 Ford Galaxy 500xl with a 352 and Fords standard 3 spd automatic. He also opted for heavy duty suspension on the ford which made it one great road car. I was in high school at the time and drove it many miles on winding mountain roads as we were building a cabin in the Sierras at the time. He ordered the Chevy with the same HD option but was greatly disappointed with car. The suspension was firmer than standard but the results were noticeably different. Enough so that he tried to get his Ford back, promising to drive it another 2 years. These were Ford’s “Total Performance” years when they were actively racing in all types of motor sports all over the world. I think that made a difference.
I had a 65 chevy 2dr ht w/ a 4 bbl 327 ci 250 hp it was at the time the economy 327. It had a 3-speed synchro Saginaw transmission, could drop it down to first at about 25 mph, I loved the car and had very little problems with it. I sold the car with 150,000 miles on it and was still running strong. the worse thing about the car was the body it started to rot out all over the place like cancer. I still love my chevy’s!! this is my new 65 chevy….lol
The creaking A-pillars were common to those on 1966 Cadillacs. Those creaked, too. We solved ours with black undercoating spray on the backside.
Now I wonder after reading this, if the reason my Dad traded his ’66 Impala (Firethorn Red, 2-door hardtop, 283 w/PG) in on his ’68 Impala was quality issues.
Although he loves to get new cars, of all the cars he has had, this was the one car he kept for the shortest amount of time.
Of course, if quality issues were the problem, he would’ve looked elsewhere rather than his local Chevy dealer.
The ’68 Impala Custom (he preferred the formal roofline to the fastback look of the ’66) was a Grecian Green example, with a 307, teamed up with the 3-speed automatic IIRC.
He kept the ’68 until 1973. No issues with that car that I can recall.
I believe in 1966 many cars sold in California were equipped with air pumps that forced air into the exhaust manifold to aid in burning hydrocarbons. The quality of handling on Chevrolets at this time was not great-the emphasis was on the “Jet Smooth Ride.” The quality of Chevrolets in this period was really suspect; my parents bought a 1965 Impala, it was full of squeaks, rattles, misaligned body parts and interior panels. they kept it for about eighteen months and then traded it in on a 1966 Catalina. The differences between the two vehicles were amazing, they never bought another Chevrolet.
My parents had a 1965 Chevrolet Bel Air wagon with Powerglide and a small V-8. It barely made it to 100,000 miles. The interior was in a shambles by that point – the plastic chrome was peeling, the carpeting was worn through and the upholstery was tearing at the seams.
They kept that Chevrolet as a second car, and in 1972 bought a neighbor’s 1967 Oldsmobile Delmont 88 Holiday sedan. It had 19,000 miles on the odometer, and had never been driven in the snow or rain. That car ran like a top, and had 113,000 miles when it was traded for a 1976 Delta 88 Royale hardtop sedan in the spring of 1977. The car was starting to feel tired, but was still reliable. And the interior materials wore like iron.
The Chevrolet cars of the era were just slapped together. GM was going to sell every one they built and the production lines ran fast. The lack of spare parts mentioned in the article is because said parts were going to more new cars, not dealer service departments.
Quality control was pretty much non-existent. The Fisher bodies were so losey-goosey that the doors were located with shims and not all cars had the same number. It was purely up to the guy in the factory who installed the door. The same goes for the front suspension.
As mentioned by another poster, in 1966, 100,000 miles was quite a milestone. Most cars never made it that far Now 100,000 miles means the car is less than halfway through its service life.
Wow, I’m not sure there’s been a single positive response here and I would have thought people would have been gushing.
Now I’m profoundly anti GM, so keep that in mind. I briefly, like probably less than an hours’ driving time, had a 65 or 66 I ended up rebuilding an engine for. It was a co owned project. (long story I won’t burden you with) This would have been in ’81, so far removed from new. But I’d driven a few domestic cars from the 60s, even owned one or two, and this one didn’t seem half bad to drive. Yep, powerglide, I’m dumbfounded to read decades later that was the only slushbox available. 2 speeds? Uh, really? But that 327 actually pulled it pretty well. Only 2 speed auto I’ve felt that way about. I’m not talking about 0-60 or 1/4 mile times, just seat of the pants how does it feel? And it felt ok. Now don’t get me going about a 20 foot long 2 door sedan, but it does have it’s fans and simplistic driving dynamics were above average for the era. Styling for an absurdly long and large 2 door, is good for what it is, and highly desirable now, and I agree, it’s eh, instead of the typical for the era, ahhh, my eyes, my eyes.
Sidebar: I know the 350 is the… small block Chevy engine, but I’ve got seat time in a combined dozen more 327-350 Chevys and without exception, the 327s had some pop and the 350s were absolute dogs. Arf Arf Arf, grrrrrr. But the subject of this post had a 327.
I was a quality auditor for a decade, and to keep things fair and balanced, I wouldn’t make my reviews self-referential. I always wrote to describe the kind of person who would best enjoy the product or service I was reviewing. It was far more fair to write with an open mind than with a selfish narrow viewpoint. This writer comes across as a jerk, but I’m certain he wasn’t. It was important for the editor of Road Test to direct him towards an insightful presentation, and it looks like the editor failed as well.
What was needed here was for the writer to explain why the SS had a high resale. Why millions chose this car over others. Why the SS was a sales winner compared to the competition. Instead, he did this.
Buying any car from a dealer isn’t just about the car. It is just as important to have a great dealer taking care of you and the car. It sounds like he had a car with issues, but a very good dealer. The issues weren’t enough to prevent this car from becoming iconic to a huge number of fans. Never insult people based upon their auto preferences.
So, I’d say the car wins, but Art Evans and RT does not. A little humility would have helped.
Our first new ride in a spell was “65” Biscayne sdn. Was a 6/auto/white stripe tires(I believe)
Color was brownish gold.
Evans does come across as smart alecky, but I think the point is that Chevy was resting on its laurels by the mid-60s. It was still the most popular make and would remain so for many years into the future, which explains the higher resale value. But quality was slipping, as evidenced by Steve Pellegrino’s article a few weeks back on Consumer Reports’ reliability surveys of the time.
Our family’s experience with a new 1967 Bel Air 2-door sedan was similar. My mom was persuaded by my uncle to purchase this one from one of the volume Chevy dealers in Pittsburgh to get a lower price. The dealer was Don Allen, one of those featured by Paul in his dealer postcards series.
Our car had several initial defects, including a missing dome light bulb, a “jingle bells” sound from the engine when lugged, improper alignment of the driver door trim at the A-pillar, and numerous small dents. Rust started to bubble through the right quarter panel after the second winter. The automatic choke wouldn’t reliably shut off – I recall having to stab the gas pedal repeatedly to slow down the idle speed. The 250 six would occasionally backfire under load, even though there were no emission controls other than PCV.
My brother later discovered the source of the “jingle bells” was a loose bolt inside the starter assembly.
Experiences like these caused buyers to look elsewhere in future decades and go a long way to explaining why GM has lost so much market share since then.
Don’t let’s be unfair. When you get right down to it, Mr. Evans’ car was just fine aside from obsolete, inadequate brakes; a sloppy, underspecified suspension; dangerously underspecified engine mounts and tires; wind noise; rattles; inoperative dashboard lights; flaking paint; lousy fuel economy surely exacerbated by the obsolete two-speed automatic transmission, and a careless dealer.
My parents bought a 1966 Bel-Air 283 V8 with Powerglide. It did have power steering, tinted glass, AM radio, and cloth interior.
We had great luck with the car and it was an absolute beast. My sister had a head on collision with a neighbor who was driving a Chevy Nova (1970 era) around 1974. Besides crunching the drivers side fender and bumper, we kept on driving the car.
I got rear ended by a late ’70’s Caprice. I was stopped she was going about 50. I did have a trailer hitch in place. Her car hit the trailer hitch, bent it under the bumper, through the fuel tank. I also had 2 cracked taillights, the trunk was bowed just a fraction of an inch (still worked fine) and broke part of the drivers seat. New fuel tank and I continued driving the car until 1987.
When I sold the car in 1987 it had just broken 200,000 miles. Original Poweglide transmission, U-Joints, Oil Pump, Carb., most of the front end. The car still handled well.
I would have liked a Turbo-Hydramatic and disk brakes but the car was very reliable, great in snow, roomy and a tank.