(first posted 3/10/2012) Yes, sexy girls played a major role in BSA ads in the late sixties (we’ll have to do a survey of them sometime), but in this case, the bike gave me at least an equally predictable hard on (what didn’t at sixteen?). There was something about the BSA Victor 441, from the first time I saw it in a bike magazine: a big single cylinder, one upswept chrome side-pipe, that yellow/chrome peanut tank, the knobby tires, the girl. The Victor was a fairly newish concept, and one that soon took the country by storm: the dual-purpose bike, capable both on and off the street. It embodied everything I wanted in a bike then, never mind the girl.
Jeff Smith won the 1964 and 1965 500cc World Championship on specially-prepared BSA 441 singles, and the company decided to cash in on the publicity, perhaps sensing that there was a new market to exploit. Appearing in 1965, the production Victor 441 soon became a hit, both in enduro and street version. By 1968, it was BSA biggest-selling bike. The big thumper pounded out all of 30 hp, but the kind of torque two-strokes could only have wet dreams about.
Anyway, the Victor was the object of considerable MMing in my teens, and when Woodstock producer Michael Lang drove one over the (still virgin) pastures in the movie, the Victor’s popularity was cemented further as the cool bike of the moment. I’d still like one; nothing like feeling the power pulses of a big thumper.
Wow… I had forgotten all about the Victor… this bike– and the Bultaco Metralla– were my two favorites, back in the day… needless to say, my brother and I ended up buying Kawasaki enduros instead!
A neighbor of my parents has a Metralla hanging from the rafters in his garage. I haven’t thought about that thing in years!
I was pretty deep into Maicos and eventually Yamahas, my friends all ran Kaws. I don’t think I’d have the guts now to run them the way we used to..
Sean,
I’d be interested in that Metralla hanging in the rafters if it’s still there!
The road/trail concept great idea except for the knobby tyres on wet pavement aspect certainly hones the powersliding skills.
B-S-A- Bastards stopped again
Or
Bastards Stopped Anywhere – my Dad had a 350cc Gold Star.
The top pic looks like a promo for a James Bond film.
Yes, looks like something Ursula wore during Dr. No.
Warning!!! Camel Alert!
Ursula (should) Undress… 😛
By that point, BSA’s production, development and quality control were so far off the mark (and getting worse) that the sexy ads were all they really had to offer. Within a year and a half the Japanese would have broken the 500cc limit at which point it’s all over baby blue.
Norton followed with equal ads a couple of years later, trying to cover up the same problems.
This bring back great memories and one very painful one. I got a hold of one in 1977 in New Mexico and used it to good effect climbing mountains all over. The single cylinder had all kinds of torque, even going to to Sandia Peak outside Albuquerque, 10,000 feet up. It was just a great bike, but a shaker. Either it was the British genes or just the vibrations, but after some long rides, I had to tighten up almost every small bolt or nut that seemed to loosen a just a little bit. I remember once riding it up to Denver, and for a day or so, had what I would later come to know as coffee jitters from the vibration. Neither my Honda 350 or BMW 600 had that effect on me.
The painful? … I tried to start that beast with a cracked bone in my foot and it backfired, even with the compression release … I used words in languages I didn’t know I knew … A great bike I still pine for …
A dose of the shakes is pretty normal for one of these. However, there are a few fixes that can make a big difference – one of the main culprits is that the engine mounts go oval (particularly the front one). Ream it out, sleeve it, and there can be a dramatic improvement.
Oval engine mounting holes have nothing to do with it. The engine mounts by the pinching of the frame lugs around the engine case. It’s irrelevant if the holes in the case are enlarged because it’s the friciton of the sides of the lugs against the sides of the engine case that do the fixing. This is engineering fact. If the bike has been run with the bolts loose, it would be more useful to shim the fit before tightening.
There was a reason they were called 441 Victims – in honor of their owners. Yeah, while I never owned one (a 500 twin was my closest), I’ve ridden more than a few of them and got VERY adept at the kickstart drill.
Never rode a thumper, but the only bad portion of a long ride on a Honda 350 of the same vintage was a slightly sore tailbone. OTOH, I was pretty big for the bike… In the mid 70s, I rode a 550 4cyl for a bit. Loved the smoothness, though I liked the low speed maneuverability of the 350 more.
Thanks for these bike CCs on weekends. I’m pineing for a vintage Bonnie to grace the CC. Just like i’m pineing for one of these in my garage.
I always liked these big single-piston bikes. I’m still mulling over getting a beater 650XL and slapping some street tires on it just for a neighborhood runabout.
The B44 was a bit of a sweet spot for unit single BSAs. Since the C15 had first appeared in 1959 they had re-engineered the flimsy timing side main, swapped the the nasty distributor for a tidy set of points on the end of the camshaft and generally made the engine robust and responsive. The frame for these came straight off the WD B40, developed for the British armed forces, and was definitely a good one. This frame, coupled with any well-sorted unit single, is probably the optimum set up for classic bike scrambles.
The B50 was a bit of a stretch too far – unless you do some well-informed fettling, these are going to be pretty vibratory and a bugger to start. But the B25 Starfire was a proper little gem. I don’t know if you got them in the states, but they’re lovely flickable little bikes with an engine that can put a grin all over your face. There is a time limit to your fun though, as the engine is liable to explode fairly rapidly when used in anger. However, the art of making these quick and reliable is very well understood, parts are plentiful, and careful, knowledgeable assembly can make them into just about the best value fun classic bike available.
The B25 Starfire’s were available, but you’re talking America, mate. Anything less than the biggest available bike in the line is a girl’s bike. The 441’s outsold the total of everything else BSA carried in the singles category.
250cc? Bah! That’s a kiddie toy (even back then).
> I’d still like one; nothing like feeling the power pulses of a big thumper.
Have you considered the Royal Enfield 500?
They’re nice, but have one drawback: For the same money, you can buy a well-fettled T140 (750cc) Triumph Bonneville that has easier parts availability, and will clean the Bullet’s ass on anything – street or strip. And the Bonnie would be more reliable, and has more street cred.
The royal oilfield bullet was still being made in India recently
It’s not a BSA, but I had a Suzuki LS650 Savage with the big 40 cubic inch thumper for four years. Tough, reliable, easy to work on, 60-65 mpg. The only downside was the vibration and loss of power above 65 and the tiny 2 and 3/4 gallon gas tank. I’d have to stop every two hours to fuel.
My wife had a Savage for a short while (sold it to buy me my BSA A50R Royal Star). Leave it to the Japanese to come up with a big thumper that was absolutely gutless. In it’s defense, it was probably one of the best beginners bikes ever sold in the US, and still bring a pretty penny used nowadays.
I’m not a bike guy, but this ’67 T-bolt is in my barn. Mostly original, and I did get it running and ridable (but does need more work). I might still have the scars from repeated starting attempts.
alistair
alistair….
give a hollar if you ‘re looking to move that wonderous bike.
fastback.
will do, don’t know when though. But I don’t use the the bugger and it is taking up space that could be used to store my vanagon obsession stuff.
alistair
Well, that sounds hopeful anyways. If and when that time comes,
you can contact me at aaarauz07@gmail.com
Cheers,
al
I liked them too but think the beginning of the end for these was the birth of the Honda XL250. Started easy. Handlebars stayed smaller than the business ends of baseball bats because the vibration was reasonable. They were fast and actually competitive with the larger BSA in desert races. Just, IMO a better bike when you took off the rose colored glasses.
You can still see these on CL or ebay from time to time but I think I would rather have a root canal then try to start one of these or an aeromacchi on a regular basis.
Thanks for the memory Paul. The bike I mean, not Ursula. Well maybe her too.
I have a clean ’68 Victor 441 enduro that is nearly all stock other than the VDO speedo. It ran well the last time that I rode it about 25 years ago. It has been stored indoors since.
It is a cleaning job, not a restoration. The knobby tires scared me on the street, hence never really ridden after i bought it. Engine and gearbox are fine.
Where are you located? How much do you want for it? Do you have photos?
Is the Victor still around. I owned and rode one, mine, for almost two years before trading it even for my first car, a 1964 GTO. I would love to own another 441 if I could, can find one. I believe mine was a 1967 or 1968. No key to start, just a compression relief lever you would hold down and then let go of halfway through the kick, It had stickers on the tank designating two previous years as the winner of some annual short track race
Erie, I might be interested too. Photos, price to: waltercarleton@gmail.com Thanks in advance.
I bought a 441 Victor in 1967. First time I went to start it it backfired through the pedal and shattered my ankle. Electric starters were a miracle after that beast.
Do you by any chance know Gordon and Greg MacLachlan? I’m Gordon’s son josh
Blast from the past
I have a ’69 BSA Victor, 441 that I have rebuilt. Everything works great on it, but I can’t figure out why it leans to the left when I’m riding it. If I take my hands off the handle bars, it will pull to the left quickly. The bike has new shocks, new bearings, new tire, wheel, and fork tubes.
Does this problem sound familiar to anyone? Does anyone have any suggestions?
The engine is offset to the left in the frame because the front sprocket is inboard of the clutch, {they share the same shaft} This makes the bike left-side heavy and can be felt, especially on pavement. Look at the front engine mount if you don’t believe me.
Check your wheel alignment. Your rear axle is probably too far back on the right side. You may also need to realign your front forks after loosening the axle nuts and fork leg pinch bolts.
One of, if not the sexiest vintage bikes ever built. I have a 69 complete restoration in my stable, right down to ceriani forks and scrambles conversion. Added a cdi ignition for easier start. Great write up. It will be for sale in early 2015
I had a 441 back in the eary 70s, drove it all over Long Island, New York, over to the Poconos, and another time up to Watkins Glen. Took the baffles out of the pipes, re tuned the ignition, and re adjusted the carb, and drove around the track for hours, and hours. Great memory, I called it 1/2 a Harley. 1/2 the weight at 289 Lbs. and half the power, and a TON of torque. It could climb a wall if you could hold on. I took out the complete key, soldered all the wire connections, put in a battery eliminater, it was always ON. I knew it well, and it always strarted right up, but others if they didn’t know it well, could almost never be able to start it, even after a good explination. Weels up in every gear!!!!!! Great fun.
My buddy had a Shooting Star.
Now I ride a big heavy 1996 1500cc Vulcan Clasic saddle bagger.
Maybe when I get too old to Back up the Vulcan, I’ll go get another Victor. Rob
had a 68 441 Shooting Star for a few years in the 70s. wish i would have held on to it.
was young and foolish and pushed this bike up our drive (to bump start) way too many times to count.
ran great for about 25 minutes. had to let (Lucas) electrics (rectifier?) cool down before it would restart.
lots of low-end torque, shook like a paint mixer at top speed of 94.
still the best looking bike i’ve ever owned.
My Uncle Peter had a BSA 441 Shooting Star (nicknamed Thumper)
He offered me a ride on it once and I initially agreed, once it was running I was too scared to go. I must have been 7 or 8
He sold it and apparently the fellow he sold it to was unable to start it. When told that as a child I didn’t understand why. Having had a CanAm 250 I now completely understand…
1967… beside the “Summer of love”, it was the year of Expo 67 in Montreal and the last time when the Toronto Maple Leafs had won a Stanley Cup championship. 😉
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqu0YPuOxAw
I’m thinking that lead photo could have been the inspiration for this shot, and several others from the same shoot, circa 2003:
The other:
The basic design was sound, it was developed by CCM into their 500cc motocrosser which was successful into the late 70s. The 250 (and it’s Triumph version) had a lot of success on American dirt tracks until the 2 strokes took over.
A kid I worked with when I was in high school had one of these; actually it belonged to his brother in law but he rode it quite a bit. James was an irritating little POS but he was a hard worker, to give him his due. One Saturday morning we were killing time, waiting for the lunch rush, while James was fiddling with the bike. He decided it was time to fire up the big single so he was jumping up and down on the kick starter. He did this for several minutes with no luck, it didn’t even offer to fire. James then commenced to messing around with the carb, etc., still no joy. Finally, the bread truck driver spoke up and said “son, I don’t know much about motorcycles but I bet it would come closer to starting if you put the plug lead back on”. Good times.
I once had that happen. 4 cylinder Yamaha 700 Maxim. Someone unplugged all four leads and then lightly set the connectors back over the spark plugs.
My 1968 BSA Victor was too heavy for trail bike and too slow for a highway bike, but great on gravel roads. Parked at night at top of hill to start. Traded for 1st year Yamaha DT250 Enduro, my favorite bike in my memories
@Bill Chrest: Your DT250 sounded the death knell for the 441, my Harley Sprint, and probably a few more that I can’t think of just now.
Very reminiscent of Thunderball
+1
Women. Now that y’all brought up that subject we can talk about the
lack of babe pics on this site. Or I will just head over to a lowrider site.
This was another great article, thanks.
Comments, as always, were very informative.
Nice ! .
I’ve had a few British twins , they were good , in thumpers I prefer Tiddlers , less vibration .
-Nate
The Victor was the first and only motorcycle I ever owned. Bought it in the early 1970s and I think it was a 1967 model. Never once felt like I had any control over it (my fault) and finally hit a pack of dogs and laid it down on a farm road. After healing I couldn’t sell it fast enough. Always enjoyed looking at bikes but never felt the need to own another one.
I had a 68 441 in 1969 my senior year at high school. Love it.
Paid for my new 1967 441 Victor with HS graduation money. Could beat anything to 30mph, but weak after that. Could go straight up. Great torque. The front suspension topped out in off-road. Put it in 4th gear lugging on my way back home from my girlfriend’s house. Got a ticket 52 in a 30, but was 17 so I didn’t get a ticket, but had to attend motorcycle safety class with the other fools. Didn’t have a garage, slid it down the basement steps with ropes in the winter. Jump started it one spring behind my dad’s car, jeez, we were crazy. Survived it all, finally sold it 15 years later.
@ Bruce ;
Do you still ride ? .
You’re quite right it wasn’t smart what some (me and all my buddies) did on Motocycles as young men but we survived it and I’m still riding albeit slower now .
-Nate
After several years riding on the back of my Dad’s little BSA 70 and Honda CB160, I got the ride of my life on the back of my sister’s boyfriend’s 441. He only had 1 helmet, made me wear it and I grudgingly obliged. A block or 2 into the excursion I gave up trying to look cool and grabbed onto that guy before he flung me off the bike. When we hit the highway I actually thanked God for the helmet. Great sound and feel from that single, and even at 10 years old I know right then my first bike was going to be one with power.
Popular Mechanics, June 1968–“Beginners Guide to Motorcycles” with specs and prices….I’m reminded of how much more money the Triumph 500 (T100R) was than Honda’s 350 (with the BSA in-between):
George, thank you for posting the chart. That does say a lot about what was selling well and what was not. I do wonder about the accuracy of the Norton specifications… The Bridgestone is the firm that I had hopes for. A pity they were coerced/decided to withdraw from the motorcycle business as it was secondary to tires.
One Brit bike-a ’57 Triumph 6T-was enough to convince me to NEVER buy another UK sourced motorcycle! 71 other bikes, including 5 Harleys have shown me I was correct!
However, I do like street thumpers…….A LOT! Currently I own 2: a 2007 Suzuki DR 650 modified into a street only “semi super-moto”. Tremendous fun on curvy roads… 🙂 🙂 The other is a 0 mile 2014 Yamaha SR 400 35th Anniversary bike. It resides in my former office: EYE CANDY!! DFO
The 441 was a great dirt/trail bike and fun in the dunes and hills. However for the road the best Brit bike ever was the Triumph Trident, the last 4 stroke to be competitive in road racing, along with the similar BSA Rocket 3. I bought a new one in ’73 and wish I still had it, it was fast (12.8 1/4 mile), pretty smooth with a120 degree 3 cyl crank, and out handled any big rice-burner. If they’d put elec start on it from the beginning and made it oil tight (it had vertical split crankcases) and had stretced it to 900 cc as originally intended, it’s have kept the Brits competitive a while longer. Here’s mine, sold when the kids came along in ’77.
But still have a Kawa A7, been in mothballs for a long time now.
Bought a ’66 Victor Special in 1972 and the first thing I did with it was take the crank down to Dick Mann (the late) who had a shop nearby and had him put a new Big-End bearing in there. I remember the great racer telling me “You will not have much of a bike here”. Apparently he knew all about it’s shortcomings but also I imagine that he was used to riding highly modified bikes.