The process of buying or selling an old car, or any car, can really run a person through the wringer. The internet has paradoxically made the process somehow worse while making the process of finding cars easier than ever. As a seller, you deal with online flakes asking “Is this still available?” and then ghosting you as fast as a game of “ding, dong, ditch.” As a buyer, you must assume that the seller knows nothing about cars or is hiding everything by taking the fuzziest pictures this side of Zapruder. Sometimes the old ways are the best ways, and putting hands on a vehicle for sale is still the best way to buy, and this ’66 Valiant would have made the process easy.
My lovely bride and I made the annual September (weather and schedule permitting) sojourn to the “Pure Stock Muscle Car Drag Races” at Mid-Michigan Motorplex in idyllic Stanton, MI. At Stanton, flawlessly restored muscle cars endure a lashing that can only compare to the lashing they endured when new, at the hands of their (mostly) much younger-at-the-time owners. As fun as that scene can be, the parking lot is where the average meat-and-potatoes car lover can ogle machinery that is a little more on-brand, such as our featured Valiant.
Until about 10 years ago, Chrysler A-Bodies, especially Valiant sedans, populated the mildewy basement of my mid-’60s automotive reveries. I thought they were watching-the-Wheel-and-falling-asleep-with-the-remote-in-your-hand ordinary, Wendy’s-chili-and-a-baked-potato geriatric. But then something happened.
I broke all the time-honored rules of buying and selling and on a wagon-wanting whim purchased my 1965 “Dirty” Dart sight unseen from the other end of the country, and it changed my car-loving lifestyle for the better. Due to increasingly exorbitant labor costs and a shift in antique-car-owning paradigms, it’s become much more acceptable to show up in an old car with iffy paint and rust. Although I’m not really a “patina” guy, I’m very much more NOT a wipe your car down and sit with it for seven hours guy. And although I work on my own cars and do just about everything, my bodywork is not always straight and I don’t care if it looks like a squid once lived under the hood and found something startling.
Cars such as my Dart and our featured Valiant have become not only acceptable drivers, but many people PREFER these cars over much nicer examples. People go stark raving crazy over the Dart. And, in spite of that nuisance, I’ve learned to like Chrysler A-Bodies and even appreciate their unpretentious styling. They’re nowhere near the top of my list of favorites, but I don’t regret buying the Dart for a minute.
Therefore, if I didn’t already have the Dart, I might have considered buying this similar-but-slightly-worse Valiant. Its three-grand asking price might be a little much, but the owner may have been willing to deal, and maybe they would have even delivered it to my house. It could be used as I use mine, as a nice day “cold weather” driver for that time of year when I wouldn’t drive my nicer cars. It could be used as a daily driver (not in the salt, I hope). It could be a “hop up” project for someone needing a light shell. It could be a “fixer-upper.” It could be a no-excuses old car for anybody who likes old cars. There are so many possibilities.
But nothing in life is free. Lower quarter rust is almost a given in the Midwest, and Valiants and Darts all seem to suffer from Calcium Chloride perforation in their hindquarters, as does this one. Fun fact: The hubcaps are the same as my Dart’s except that the “Fratzog” in the center is replaced by a “V.”
The interior is dirty but redeemable, and I like to think that it’s a 225/Torqueflite car, which would be just about perfect with its (most likely) 2.94 gears. My Dart has the A-903 three-speed, and its 3.23 gears make it a little buzzy on the highway, although the engine noise is to some extent drowned out by wind and road and other avenues of ensuring permanent tinnitus. My Dart already had a replacement seat cover, but I’d replace the upholstery and carpet in this one if I bought it. Everything else would get a good scrubbing or my wife wouldn’t ride in it. In fact, she’d probably do the scrubbing.
The passenger quarter looks worse than the driver’s side. The visible rust would be the most conspicuous objection to my owning the Valiant. The rust repair itself would pose no grave threats to our coexistence, but matching the new paint to the old would require a defter touch with a spray gun than I currently possess. On the other hand, a light Comet or steel wool scrub over the fresh paint (ouch) might balance things out well enough.
Regardless, how lucky would it be to stumble on the perfect old car for sale in a parking lot? It’s never happened to me before. No driving hours to be disappointed, no flaky sellers who misrepresent the fact that they used aluminum foil to repair a floorpan, no rolling the dice and wincing as the car rolls off a sketchy trailer all the way from Sandy, Oregon…Oh, why can’t a ’63 Riviera show up in like fashion in my travels?
Still, fun old cars are out there, and even though old cars prices are still high (in my opinion), there are yet some affordable options, especially if you prefer the sedate, unfussy side of life. And there’s nothing wrong with watching the Wheel on a weeknight.
For someone looking for a “driver” car for local commuting and relative security of driving under the ‘shadows’, the 64 – 66 MOPAR A body cars are the best and easiest to live with.
The slant 6 either 170 or 225 is one of the most dependable engines on EARTH, as is the 904 Torqueflite. This car could likely drive for years with minimal maintenance.
It is amazing the prices people ask for used OLD cars these days.
I sold this 1965 Barracuda for $3,000 in 2004.
I love it and where was I in 2004?
I’d love to go back to 2004 with my current financial means, although I’d return with too many cars.
I have never been one that wanted to become a museum curator for a classic car. I see old guys sitting in their folding chairs behind their pristine classics and it doesn’t look fun. If I ever get another A-Body Mopar of this era, it would be treated like a loved puppy, not a show dog. Drive it. Love it. Don’t panic over it.
Jay Leno always said to buy what you were willing to drive anywhere. Valiants and Darts weren’t meant to sit in garages. They were meant to become a part of your family and be filled with daily life, old french fries, maps and empty soda bottles rolling around the rear seat.
Aaron – this tried and true way have buying/selling has worked for me on both ends of the deal.
In 1990 I sold a 1984 Dodge Colt (Mitsubishi) four door in a day or two after having parked the car in the lot at a big grocery store – with sign quite similar to the one the Valiant’s windshield. Easy; sold to a student at the high school across the street.
And in 1999, on a western road trip and after several hours at the Buffalo Bill Museums in Cody, I spotted a ’69 Falcon wagon on the side of the road on the way out of town. Did a u-turn and couldn’t help but buy the car. It was a being sold to settle an estate and it was a one owner, California and Wyoming car. A fair deal for both was made. The car took some work (mainly fuel tank and sending unit) but was an attractive, solid and completely rust free old car. It was fun; I had it about ten years.
Aaron, I agree one really needs to get eyes on the car, walk around it, and ask the pertinent questions none of which you can do through the internet. As an example I looked at BAT last week concerning a late 60’s wagon. Generally don’t look at BAT since it seems to be populated by back slappers who all say nice car and I once had, or my brother had, or my father had a car just like that. I asked the seller two point blank questions one of which is why are you selling it after looking many, many years and then having it only five? Some people were offended I asked such a question. Once again good bye BAT. As far as Facebook I call it Fraudbook.
Me, I call it Fecebook. I quit in ’10 or ’11 and don’t miss it a bit; life’s much better without.
Actually there are good things about it for me. One, I collect cameras and so I am in the Collector group, the Minolta group, the Exakta group, and the Nikon group. Also in the Learn Camera Repair group and as a matter of fact I have been working on a Konica FT-1 trying to clean all the FPC connectors inside so it powers on. I will post a lesson. I’m also in Carriers and USS Hornet as all those members want to see what I am working on and what is up with the Hornet from around the world. Last in the IBM Selectric group as I got my first II and have started the restoration of it.
Oh, I agree about BAT. It’s fun to look at the cars, somewhat nauseating to read the comments. I don’t understand what kind of satisfaction commenters get from ripping someone’s car apart under the guise of “educating the buyer.” Then, as you said, the backslappers and BAT boosters are legion.
They must be doing something right though…the prices of cars sold on BAT consistently leave me baffled.
Oh, and it’s strange that commenters on BAT would be offended by your question; it’s pertinent to the sale, and far better than the myriad nitpickers and know-it-alls.
Oh, don’t get me started on BAT…although that’s mighty easy to do given what a loony bin that place seems to be. I’m convinced that a sizeable portion of the bidders have next to no idea what they’re bidding on and just get carried away, often winding up “winning” something that they then proceed to bail from. Add that to the peanut gallery of commenters who offer nothing but comments along the lines of “Pip-pip Tally Ho!” and “This one’s a steal old chap!” (everyone seems to want to be a British caricature on BAT)…and the whole thing’s about as real as your typical reality TV show (like yeah, I think that those “Naked” people really are “Afraid” out there in the jungle…).
Oh, and the fact that every American station wagon from the 1960s has to be photographed with a surf board strapped onto the roof? (heads up Aaron if you ever go to sell your Dart. Cowabunga! Old Chap.)
I call it Fakebook. It has its uses. I’ve rarely bought anything off FB, and only if I’ve known the seller for a few years in one of my (admittedly narrow) interest groups. Likewise for selling; only to someone in those narrowly-focused groups who has a name for being a good trader.
I only joined up to FB when my writing group started using it for group communication between meetings. Now that I’m pretty much housebound, it has its uses. But sometimes others use FB at me. Had some old school friends I hadn’t heard of in over 50 years go searching for me after they’d had a few too many whiskies one night – saw the model cars and “Bingo – that’s him!”
We shall purchase the car and I suppose name it Wendy… I like it. But don’t need it so will pass. However, $3,000 sounds perfectly reasonable (to me) for a car that’s interesting, looks interesting, and is mostly ready to go if not perhaps the best choice for a literally daily driver anymore. But it won’t be sold as that so yeah, the price is right, enough people have that in their pocket.
Thanks for this one!
You’re welcome!
Hmmm, my COAL series is stuck at 29 cars . . . . Should I go for an even 30? 🙂 Seriously, it is a good thing this thing isn’t a V8/OD Studebaker sedan or I might be on the phone with the guy.
I agree that a 6/auto Valiant from that era is a really good old car if you are not into maintenance. I think I am at the stage where I would want something a little higher up in the “driver quality” scale, though.
Hey, if you want to give this guy a call, I think I can make out the phone number under the wiper in my original photo (or at least a couple guesses). 🙂
Speaking of Studebakers (and BAT, mentioned above), this cool GT Hawk sold yesterday for $9000. I would have probably thrown a bid in if it were almost any color but white.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1963-studebaker-gran-turismo-hawk-9/
You are the opposite of me. You cycle through cars whereas I hang onto them and keep them in tip top shape so consequently have only owned 11 and 9 are still here. Oh, but there is that weather thing…
I never cease to be amazed how different American Valiants of this period are from ours. I was just talking to an American friend yesterday about the amazing degree of latitude the Big Three seemed to give their Australian operations back then. Don’t like the styling of our new Valiant for ’63? Here’s a few mill, you redo it then. What, the Slant Six is too small and buyers won’t spring for the 273 or that new 318? Have this new 265 truck design, on the house, we’re not going to use it anyway. What’s that, now you want to completely rebody the Valiant? Okay, go ahead, but give them this coupe alongside that intermediate sedan version as well, you can’t offer just a sedan on that wheelbase…..
And that’s just Mopar. GM let Holden design their own V8 when they could have just picked up the SBC, and we all know that happened to the Falcon six down here (no, not the FEMI), culminating in the mighty Barra Turbo.
Amazing times. Unthinkable with today’s globalistic trends. I’m so glad to have lived through it all.
I reckon our 63 to 66 Vals were nicer looking than the US versions, I wish we got the 2 door body though, make mine a 66 VC with 2 doors.
I’m glad to have lived through our car industry years as well, matter of fact it gave me a living for 34 years.
Looks like a decent car ~ if it would drive home I’d think worth the asking price in spite of the visible rust .
BAT is okay I got hammered for making factual comments instead of slavering over them .
I still remember when it actually meant Bring A Trailer .
Good thing that :
A. I’m trying to close a Motocycle purchase with a craigslist flake right now and
B. this car is too far away .
Mr. Leno is an Enthusiast’s Enthusiast ~ I used to see him at Motocycle events and he’d walk past the fancy ones to look at my obscure worthless ones and say ” I remember riding these’ or similar.
-Nate
Geez, this isn’t THAT far away from me although it is in a different country. $3k sounds quite reasonable too.
I’ve been toying with the idea of a vintage winter beater if my son needs the Focus for his accounting co-op in January. It’s probably a terrible idea but fun to think about and this Valiant would sure fit the bill…
I’ll be the party pooper here. $3000 is too much money. This car is on a trailer. It either doesn’t run, doesn’t shift or doesn’t stop. $$$. The headliner and any sound insulation are missing so it is going to be like riding in an echo chamber if you get it running.$$$. The gas tank and cooling system is anyone’s guess.$$$. Tires.$$$. The rear quarter rust doesn’t look bad but it never does until you try to fix it and the under carriage and exhaust are usually worse.$$$. Add it all up and it gets expensive, and it’s still wearing that crappy paint job that won’t convince anyone that your investment was worth it. I like the car too but it’s a money pit. If it brings back memories of Mom and Dad, or Aunt Thelma and Uncle Ed, go for it. But they have to be warm memories.
Quite a bit of the car appears to be “there”.Hope when it’s all done/said, the little shaver gets some “white stripe” tires.
Thanks for posting this, I never tire of looking at old Valiants and Darts.
The “Dirty Dart” looks great with its bigger wheels and tyres, gives it a confident sure footed stance.
Thanks! I upgraded to 15″ steel wheels several years ago, and I’ve had an ad on Marketplace on and off trying to sell the old 13″ wheels (with a spare 14″) for $25…no luck. I’d give them away but I’d rather they didn’t go to scrap. They probably will anyway.