At the gas station fueling the pickup
When I see this duo upon looking up.
An admittedly fake turquoise Daytona,
From some area of lake covered Minnesota.
Aside it was a Ford from ’60,
that had storage aplenty –
(perhaps it is really a ’59,
but I am aiming for rhyme).
Truly, when was the last time you saw a convergence
of a full-sized combination with such divergence?
The thing that sticks out to me is that this would have been a rare scene (faked or real Daytona) in 1973, forget 2013!
But hey if you’re gonna fake it, do it right and own up to it. The Dodge owner is doing it right.
7 mpg!
Fake or not I like it
What impresses me about his fake Daytona is that, not only did he bolt-on the nose cone and wing, the builder actually modified the body to install a correct flush-mount rear window.
didnt spot that he sure went to a lot of trouble
Maybe it’s not a fake and the license plate is to discourage thieves? A “real” one would be worth in excess of $100,000…
He probably started with a Charger 500 that had the flush rear window.
The guy would have to be an idiot to make a Daytona clone from a Charger 500. The ’69 Charger 500 is just as rare and valuable as a real Daytona.
There was an article in a mopar magazine back in the 90’s that said a number of 500’s were turned into wing cars by people who saw skyrocketing values of the wings in the late 80’s early 90’s and had no idea what a 500 was (I believe the article said they knew of at least 5 cars this had happened too).
All the parts readily available here: http://www.wingcarfab.com/daytona_parts.html
Better a clean, straight, running fake on the road, than a dead original rotting behind a barn.
+1 totally agree
+2! Or yet another doner for yet another crappy Hollywood wreck
It had me fooled,I wouldn’t know it wasn’t the real McCoy.It’s not every day you see a Daytona real or fake.There used to be a yellow Daytona that saw regular drag strip use in the UK a few years ago,don’t know what engine it had or any more info.
Might I continue the rhyme with HyVee’s jingle… “Where there’s a helpful smile, in every aisle”. Sorry, had to.
As much as those Daytona’s are cool cars, I would rather have the Fridge err Ford, especially because its a panel.
Since you mention the panel truck, and it is Mopar week, I have to tell this story…
This past Saturday was the monthly car show where I am at. Just outside the show area was another Ford panel truck a few years older (single headlight). The owner walked up and told me it had a 318. When he hit the starter, I could hear that wonder Highland Hummingbird in full song.
Okay…IF it’s a fake, where did he get the nose-cone and spoiler?
Does it count as a fake, if he used legitimate parts off a salvaged Daytona?
I think putting the real-McCoy Daytona parts on a real Charger…is, in the end, legit enough to say it is. It’s just rebuilding the car…with a new chassis!
So many of your questions could be answered by just putting a few words into the google machine, like “dodge daytona nose cone”: http://www.wingcarfab.com/daytona_parts.html
You think there isn’t a business in making Daytona clones? I shudder to think how many there now.
I could have…but, frankly, I didn’t even think it POSSIBLE there could be duplicates. Because it’s so much not a high-volume item…I have only seen ONE Of these things; and it was obviously legit – it was brand new at our local Dodge City (that’s how Dodge dealers used to be branded). A halo car, on the showroom floor and that summer on the concrete display pad out front.
So, no – I never considered a cottage business making replicas. If someone had asked me the sales potential…I’d have said, maybe twelve kits. In all.
Ya learn something new every day…
So, no – I never considered a cottage business making replicas.
I didn’t know about it until today either.
Fake GT350s, GTO Judges, Z/28s, etc? Sure.
But fake giant wing cars? Never considered it.
The fact that this one is obviously a fake strongly suggests that there is at least one fake, right? And what are the odds of it being the only fake? If it has value and was rare, there will be fakes. Elementary logic, my dear Watson.
Must be the same situation as the Ford Falcon GTHO Phase III – Ford only made 300, and there are only 6000 of them still on the road…
I guess I’m just surprised because a “regular” ’69 Charger generally seems like a valuable car in the first place. Sort of like taking a Mach 1 and creating a BOSS 429 replica.
I guess this project could have started life as lower-value 318 barn find or something.
Perhaps an R/T but regular Chargers can still be found in varying condition for *somewhat* reasonable prices. If this one started out as a rotton barn find and you had to order the restoration parts anyway, why not make your dream car?
True. But there is no faking the ’70 Boss 302 Ford engine block I just bought. It has value, and is rare. Show me a fake.
These cars are 1000x more popular now than they ever were new. We know they were sold retail to homologate the cars for racing, but most languished on the lots. I remember even a couple of years old their used car value did not carry the same premium as their new car price. By the early 70s insurance premiums, then OPEC, and the general fact that a lot of people did not cotton to the design, had more limited appeal than the regular performance models. Even when Dukes of Hazzard was on the air in the late 70s and early 80s, Warner Brothers were buying all sorts of 69 Chargers off used car lots everywhere for basic money. It wasn’t until Boomers got into their prime earning years in the late 80s they started bringing mad money.
> Okay…IF it’s a fake, where did he get the nose-cone and spoiler?
You seem to consistently underestimate the automotive enthusiast community.
> I think putting the real-McCoy Daytona parts on a real Charger…is, in the end, legit enough to say it is. It’s just rebuilding the car…with a new chassis!
1. Please don’t even go there. The whole “Is a rebodied car still legit?” topic is extremely divisive. Best to just not bring it up.
2. There are more differences between a standard ’69 Charger and a Daytona than just the nose cone and wing. The most noticeable is that the rear window area is completely different.
At tonight’s cruise-in we spotted another “tribute” car of similar vein. In similar fashion this owner was honest…
High quality tribute cars can bring decent money simply because they were done well and are of versions of cars that are desireable. You can take an otherwise plebian 318 Challenger and drop in a 426 Hemi with Plum Crazy paint. Its fake, but still its a high quality Chally with a 426 Hemi in it. Now a buyer willing to put up real money for the real McCoy will go through proper channels to document it as much as is available. The balance of course is making sure you Don’t build too many of them to dilute the market and making sure the real ones are property documented.
See, now, I’ve never understood the reluctance to accept those cars – first allowing that they’re presented honestly, as an aftermarket tribute version. But what’s the difference between Chrysler Special Projects hanging a Gooney-Bird beak and wing on a Charger (yeah, yeah, with the backlight redone flush); and some talented body men with time to spare and the interest to recreate what was done before they were born, doing the same thing?
I’ve seen this before, to a lesser degree. I had a Jeep YJ Wrangler with damage to the snout…a violent repossession. I got it cheap; when I found out what a new grille shell would cost, I yelled murder.
I found a CJ front clip in a boneyard. Ta-DAAA!! A Jeep YJ-7. Popular in California barrios and almost unknown anywhere else. Universally hated…Jeep aficionados would see my pretty red CJ-7 with period correct fender lips and doors; pull up, notice the dashboard and axles, and say very bad words. Why all the hate?
To me…if you recreate one…do it right and well…take a bow. Don’t pass it off; but be proud of your skill and interest.
I think your last point is especially true Craig. It’s a slippery slope to diluting the pond. On the other hand, you could probably say that about the recent retro cars, which haven’t seemed to effect 65-69 Mustang, Challenger or 69 Camaro values too much.
Me personally? I’d actually PREFER own a replica. I can equip it the way I want, paint it any color I want, build and assemble it better than the factory could dream of, with better parts to boot, and not feel bad about desecrating history and driving it like I stole it. Oh yeah, and it wouldn’t cost as much as a house.
Retro or not, a new car is bought for far different reasons than a special-interest historical model. Camaros were popular, but not THAT popular, in the late 1960s. Paul did a parody of what a botched job it was, by comparing it to a girl you pick up at closing time, seeing her through those beer goggles.
Today it’s the bomb. Today everyone wants one, and the ONLY engine EVER put into one was a SBC. Believe it; here’s the order sheet for this one (off his word processor).
The Retro T-Bird landed heavily and very dead; I haven’t seen sales figures for the retro Camaro but I can’t imagine them to be very high. It’s just not a practical car. The HHR is gone; as is the PT Cruiser.
Like you said, though, a retro or modded oldie that’s not a special series but reflects one, can be used more freely and with less fear and guilt. Can be had for less and modified for your needs and taste. And your comments about building it better…I don’t know whether that’s a brag on your skills or a smear on Detroit products of the 1960s. So I’ll take it as both.
Mass production assembly qualities versus a one-off build with more than 60-90sec to complete tasks, normally fewer cost-driven compromises, 40 years’ advancement in materials and technology – not really very hard to build cars better
Well I’d say the target demographic for the hot retro muscle pony cars isn’t far off from those who’d otherwise buy an old muscle car. A ~$60k 1969 CJ Mach 1 and a ~$60k 2013 GT500 both likely end up being primarily Sunday driver/cruise night rides. Neither are practical and both are supposed to evoke nostalgia.
Ultimately you’re correct that they aren’t selling all that well, but, much like those late 60s/early 70s pony cars(namely 69-73 Mustang and E bodies), the mundane base versions that are supposed to sell in large volumes are effectively compromised by accommodating the big bad muscle versions and ultimately end up horribly impractical for most buyers.
Also, I wasn’t bragging and didn’t want to come off that way. Was I smearing on Detroit quality back then? Sure, but that’s a given. It’s more the availability of better parts created by the aftermarket, or OEMs over the last 40 years that can replace or be retrofitted to make something like this “Daytona” more reliable, more efficient, faster(both in accel/decel) and even handle/ride better.
The same thing happens over here, and you see a wide spectrum of replica/tribute/fake cars. Builders range from clueless amateurs to professional resto shops, the standard of the cars likewise. Some are exact paint-marking, date-coded glass replicas, some just have stripes and badges. Often they run more powerful engines etc and the call-outs are altered to advertise the additional cubic inches.
The interesting thing is at the top end of the replica spectrum, where cars can feature a lot of original or NOS parts – often more than restored original cars (with reproduction parts)! Those are the ones that can go for 50%+ the value of an original car, I have heard of cases where the price got near 6 figures.
The fundamental thing is there aren’t enough original cars for everyone who wants to own one, and if you can’t buy one (ie can’t afford one) then a replica is often the right answer.
The only problem I have is when a good original “survivor” base-model car is sacrificed to build one, rather than re-doing an already-modified car. But then an owner is free to do what they like with their own car, and purely from an economic standpoint a replica is usually worth more than a restored base model car to the same standard.
I’ve always been on the fence about the issue myself. From my standpoint I’d build a clone(or tribute or what have you) only for my own personal fulfillment, yet when I see TV shows build one just to sell at an auction, I get irritated.
The use of a base car as a body doner never bothered me much unless it’s really mint with low miles. A true survivor. But in most cases I just don’t see the issue. To rationalize it I just think of base versions of modern cars like V6 Mustangs: They’re clearly just decontented V8 GTs, they’re all over the place and they’re run further and further into the ground by each subsequent owner. If someone came and rescued one 30 years from now by making an authentic GT or Cobra clone, would I be bothered by it? No way!
I hope to see an article on Squad 51 during this Chrysler week….
I’m one of those people who never quite understood the reverence the Chrysler fan community had for cars like the Hurst 300H that Chrysler built in 1970. The only differences between those and ordinary 1970 300’s were in trim details, but I can practically guarantee that if someone modified a car himself, even though the finished product was nicely done and good looking, a lot of guys would simply discount it as “not factory”.
Given this attitude, I certainly don’t discount replicas as long as there’s no attempt to deceive people into thinking they’re the real thing.
“…is, in the end, legit enough to say it is. It’s just rebuilding the car…with a new chassis!”
No, the term “numbers matching” means a true original. And the Collector Car market demands documentation.
“… a “regular” ’69 Charger generally seems like a valuable car in the first place. Sort of like taking a Mach 1 and creating a BOSS 429 replica. ”
And, ‘regular’ Chargers were not the same as a ‘Mach 1’. It was more akin to a ‘base’ Mustang.