Earlier this week, I had profiled an example of the last model year of rear-wheel-drive Oldsmobile Ninety-Eight Regency, an ’84. It had always struck me as interesting that the upmarket, new, front-wheel-drive C-Bodies (Olds Ninety-Eight, Buick Electra) that were introduced for ’85 had smaller physical dimensions than the still-RWD B-Bodies (Olds Delta 88, Buick LeSabre) that shared their showrooms for just that one model year. Granted, the newer models were more efficient and made better use of space, but I grew up in a family that often put a premium on quantity over quality.
Instead of going to the nice steakhouse in town for a special occasion, the Dennises would have piled into our ’77 Plymouth Volaré to hit the Ponderosa by the mall, with its unlimited salad bar and a bottle of A-1 steak sauce on every table. Similarly, if my parents had been in the market for a new, full-sized Oldsmobile in ’85, and even if they didn’t have five collective mouths to feed on my dad’s income as the sole breadwinner, they probably would have boasted about their choice of the Delta over the downsized Ninety-Eight.
I have nothing against a good all-you-can-eat buffet every once in a great while. For ’85, and pound-for-pound, a new, entry-level Delta 88 Royale four-door sedan with a base price of about $10,600 and a starting weight of 3,600 pounds (at $2.94 / lb.) might have seemed quite the value proposition against a new, base-model Ninety-Eight ($14,700 and 3,300 pounds, or $4.45 / lb.). The point of this exercise is not to provide any truly meaningful metric (I know of no one who has ever shopped for a car based on price-per-pound), but rather just to illustrate that in the eyes of some, sometimes more is more – which is completely legit.
The base Delta 88 4-door outsold the base Ninety-Eight Regency sedan, selling 69,600 units against 43,700. In terms of overall sales of each model for ’85, and among just the two- and four-door sedans (and no B-Body wagons), it was close: 188,600 Deltas against 169,400 Ninety-Eights. This would suggest that at that time, there were at least as many Olds shoppers who valued quantity as those who put a premium on quality, with the aforementioned figures also reflecting the downsized ’85 Ninety-Eight’s sixth-month head start in sales for that model year. Regardless, there are positive things to be said for both quality and quantity. Sometimes, and on special occasions, nothing but Ruth’s Chris will do, but much of the time, there’s nothing wrong with a sirloin steak from Sizzler.
First example as seen in Lakeview, Chicago, Illinois on Sunday, February 27, 2011.
Second example as seen in downtown Omaha, Nebraska on Tuesday, October 25, 2017.
Click here and here for related reading.
I’ve heard that terminology derisively aimed at buyers of heavily discounted new American cars.
“Buying by the pound are we?”
I was surprised in your Ninety-Eight post the other day to learn the first front drive Ninety-Eight had such a strong sales increase its first year over the 1984 version. Of course, GM’s FWD C trio still began to suffer its way to decreasing relevance as SUV’s began to crowd in on full-size cars.
I had a front row seat in the transition of the RWD B / C cars to the FWD H / C cars. My father’s company cars switched from RWD Delta 88s to FWD Ninety-Eights. The FWD cars may have been more space efficient, but generally had considerably less space, particularly width and trunk space. A review of the 1985 full-size Olds brochure shows 20.8 cubic feet of space in the Delta 88 trunk and just 15.8 in the Ninety-Eight.
I used to throw my oversize frame bike flat on the floor of the Delta 88 trunk, utterly impossible in the Nighty-Eight.
We have much the same problem today in 2018. The new batch of so called full size cars are narrower than these old RWD full sizers as little way back as 2011 with the Panthers and truck space is smaller in most cases with the Maxima, LaCrosse and Avalon being the worst offenders.
And if you go back another generation the problem came up again. I had been able to get 3 child car seats abreast in the back seat of my 68 Chrysler Newport. They would not fit in my 84 Olds 98, a fact that made it impossible to use for our full family.
I know this isn’t exactly what you mean, but some of us do want the heaviest car we can get for our money. An old NHTSA study found that, other things being equal in a two-car head-on collision, a 2x difference in weight translates to a whopping 8x difference in survival. (That is, the person in the heavier car is 8x more likely to survive than the person in the lighter car.) Even if the weight difference isn’t a full 2x, a little bit of extra weight offers a lot of extra safety.
“Other things being equal” is a key qualifier here. As shown by the (in)famous IIHS crash test of a new Malibu vs. an old Bel Air, weight isn’t everything.
The weight on older cars can be deceiving. Though the ’59 Bel Air in that IIHS video was enormous in size vs the 2009 Malibu, it only weighed about 200 lbs more.
So the Malibu was denser than the Bel Air. Undoubtedly true when the electronics failed.
“I know of no one who has ever shopped for a car based on price-per-pound” Ooooh, pick me, pick me! I think my Kia Sedona might qualify me as a winner here. 🙂
I will come out and say it – while I thought the 77-79 Olds 88 was the most handsome of all the B bodies, the 80-85 version was the least. They just seemed blobby and shapeless compared with the rest.
This car’s sister (an 85 LeSabre “Collectors Edition” 2 door has the distinction of being the shortest time I ever owned a car – 3 weeks. I never even put gas in it before I resold it. The Buick was a much more attractive car than these.
As a rule, the RWD 88 always outsold the RWD 98, too, because the 88 was always cheaper. In 1985, the base 88 was about $11k, and the base 98 was nearly $15k. (The head to head pricing is a little distorted, because the base 88 didn’t include AC, electric windows, etc in the base MSRP).
The only real conclusions from the sales numbers (base 88 outsells base 98; up model 98 outsells up model 88) is that folks who want a less expensive car want the least expensive car, and that there’s a comparable decision process for more expensive cars.
Excellent points, all.
I love that first photo!
My parents had a 1982 Delta 88 Royale Brougham four-door sedan, which they traded in 1988 for a brand-new Delta 88 Royale Brougham four-door sedan.
The 1988 model definitely handled better, and it was the first 88 since their 1967 Delmont 88 that provided acceleration worthy of the “Rocket” label – even if the days of the true Rocket V-8 were gone. The fuel economy was also very good.
Unfortunately, in terms of build quality and “feel,” the 1988 model was a definite step backwards. That car initially had numerous small problems that required constant return trips to the dealer to fix. Fortunately, Frank Gayman Chevrolet-Oldsmobile in Chambersburg stepped up the plate and fixed everything without complaint. But that process took about three months after my parents had taken delivery of the car. Once those initial problems were corrected, the car turned out to be fine.
The interior of the 1988 model felt as though it could be disassembled with one’s bare hands. Everything felt very “loose.” The 1982 model felt much more solid. And the 1988 model had a constant drumming from the trunk area when driving down the road – even on smooth roads. The 1982 model, on the other hand, was whisper quiet going down the road.
The 1988 model was traded for the restyled 1992 Delta 88 that was a big improvement in every way. The new front-wheel-drive models looked good on paper, but GM didn’t really get them fully sorted out until the second-generation versions arrived in the early 1990s. That was my take at the time.
I don’t remember who did it but there was one magazine that did list the price per lb in their tests/reviews at least one of which has been posted here in the past.
I don’t buy on a price per pound basis, what I look at is horsepower per pound (or perhaps I should say pounds per horsepower).
My sister’s in-laws had precisely the same $ per pound reasoning. When in 1985 they replaced their seriously large 1976 Ninety-Eight, they bought a 1985 88. They had intended to buy another Ninety-Eight, but seeing the size and price difference vs the 88, they bought a Royale Brougham.
In the summer of 1982, my Mom landed a good job with the federal govt and was shopping for a Cutlass to replace an awful orange ’74 Volvo 145 wagon that we had as a placeholder family car after her beloved ’72 Montego was wrecked a year or 2 earlier. The dealer must have over-ordered Delta 88s because I remember a lot of them on the lot compared to Cutlasses and 98s and the salesman was able to upsell my Mom into a sharp burgundy ’82 Delta 88 coupe with a 307 and Super Stock wheels but with no vinyl top and manual roll-up windows-she was adamant about that. I remember frequently getting compliments on it and it was a such a good car, I don’t ever remember any mechanical problems with it.
I remember when we brought it in for service around the time that the FWD Deltas came out in 1986; the dealer was practically begging my Mom to trade it in or sell it back to them outright because they couldn’t keep the used, late model RWD 88s and 98s on the used car lot
I have probably posted this before, but one of the most beautiful cars of my childhood was my mother’s best friends ‘84 88 Royale coupe, metallic brown with a brown vinyl top and American Racing wheels. It was part brougham, part muscle car, and it sent 9-year-old me into a tizzy. Sadly it was stolen, never to be seen again, from the suburb of Franklin Park a few years later. I still have a soft spot for these 88s, and I’m probably one of the few who thing the formal roof treatment the B and Cs got in their mid-cycle refresh to be an improvement.
That sounds like a really cool car.
I agree with you as far as the sedans are concerned. Coupe-wise, I liked the fast roofline on the 77-79 LeSabre and Pontiacs, but the refreshed formal roofline didn’t hurt the 88’s looks at all.
Nice companion piece to the Ninety Eight article the other day. I will say that unlike a couple people who posted above, the 1980-up facelifted 88 was my favorite B-body.
In those heady days of massive production numbers, Oldsmobile was intent on chasing every sale. As I mentioned in the other article, for ’84 and ’85 they made an extra 88 model especially for the large car buyer who couldn’t see paying more money to get a smaller car. For the lb/dollar shopper, the LS had a base price about $300 less than the non-Brougham Ninety Eight. It came with the V8, unique upholstery and most 88 options standard.
You can identify them by a small LS emblem on the C pillar where the Royale emblem would be. The vinyl top was still optional, and I’ve seen slick top ones a few times which I really think looks best.
Thanks, Jon! After your comment earlier this week, I had to look up the 88 Royale LS, and to your point, I can understand how its sales doubled in ’85 with its appeal for former Ninety Eight shoppers.
I had a front row seat at this transition too. I snagged a ’87 Olds 98 Regency that had come in trade on a Caprice… in ’87. (not everyone was in love with the downsized version). I thought GM had done a great job with the car- powerful, surprising fuel mileage, tons of room, quiet… a luxury car in every sense of the word. That same year my mom traded her ’79 DeVille on a LeSabre Limited, and was just as pleased as I was. The only thing I missed in the 98 was, believe it or not, the size and heft of the old GM B-Body. The next passenger cars I would own would be V8 powered RWD’s with Blue Oval badges.
Love the analogies, Dennis. Perfect choice to convey the multiple considerations.
Sizzler was the usual destination if Dad and Mom wanted to go out for steak. Never did go to a fancy Steak House. Later, when Mom got a swing shift job, Dad would occasionally take us boys to the cowboy-themed steak house. Dim lighting, limited menu, and an unusual dress code. The ceiling was covered in hanging pieces of neck ties. An unsuspecting over-dressed person had his or her offending garment severed by a large scissors, just below the knot, and later added to the collection.
Thanks for the memories. Pass the salt, please.
Buying them by the pound is smart. My aunt bought a Parisienne and my mother a Taurus looking baby Bonneville.auntie had a much nicer and more comfortable car that was way more reliable. My grandfather determined to save enough gas to pay the price difference the Bonneville would have to be driven 235000 miles. Unfortunately it did not last this long unlike aunies b body
Great shots Joe. That car is actually an ’85 Delta 88 Royale Brougham. Only the Brougham and the Brougham LS got that Olds 98 style grille in 1985. The base models have a different grille.
I have mentioned on here before I had a ’85 Delta 88 Royale as my DD for many years. It was a very basic car, 307-4bbl, TH200-4R, no A/C, crank windows, CDN emissions (no ECM), F41 suspension. It was slow, but a very reliable tough old car that got great highway mileage. The only thing that ended it’s career was structural rust. It drove itself to the junkyard, after more than 20 years of reliable service.
I know these cars are criticized for being out of date and maybe not the best lookers of the B-body line-up, but they were good reliable cars. IMO, these were a better buy than the FWD C or H bodies. I remember my dad car shopping around in the mid 80’s. He looked at a bunch of the new downsized FWD cars from GM, and the Chrysler Minivans. In the end after being burned badly by our Fairmont, he went to what he knew would was old fashion, but would be a good car and bought a GM B-body (Pontiac Parisienne in this case).
My grandmother and aunts liked Ponderosa for Sunday brunch a little later on in the ’80s/early ’90s. Granted, the only ones getting their money’s worth were Aunt Jeanne who snuck out as much as she could in her purse and me since I was a teenager and ate like one…
Uncle Bob was the B-body fan and he never joined us; he had a ’77 or ’78 Delta 88 he bought new and later on a ’79 Caprice wagon that was an “oldie but goodie” low-mileage used Southern car.
I liked Olds Delta 88 as well when I was on the market for my first car in 1990, I ended up with a used Caprice Classic sedan with heavy-duty package. I like the Japanese cars too, but they were out of mu budget then. This car when it was introduced to public in late 70s, it had the market position like today Lexus RX350, Acura MDX and Toyota Highlander limited. What is the reverse fortune for the domestic car makers. No wonder they are in such bad shape.
One of my friends loved these and owned 2…you could get tons in the trunk and his 6’3″ frame fit without killing the backseat legroom. They were also reliable and familiar to rural dealer mechanics. Enthusiasts often miss what the ordinary family really valued….hence boring cars that make us yawn but get the job done sell like crazy.