(first posted 7/9/2015) Last September, CC looked at the Morris Marina, and I concluded that it was too little, too late. If BL didn’t know it was inadequate and always going to be inadequate, then they were obviously asleep at the wheel.
I’ll let you read the earlier Marina CC for my full review and impressions, but the key points are that the car was cobbled together with a complete pick’n’mix of BL components – engines from the Austin-Morris 1300 (Austin America), the Austin-Morris 1800 Landcrab or the MGB with twin carburettors, Morris Minor front suspension, a Triumph gearbox, simple semi elliptic spring rear from, well, just about any Morris William Morris himself would have recognised, a rather cheap looking interior which was not improved by the plastic wood, all covered by a contemporary but not special style and featuring some very 1970s colours.
Some of this was understandable – BL had inherited next to nothing in terms of potential new product from BMC and needed something quickly to tackle the Ford Escort and Cortina. BL had ambitions (in hindsight, wholly unrealistic ones) to compete in the main market with conservatively engineered but high style cars under the Morris brand cars, and technically advanced cars under the Austin brand. One to compete with Ford, one to compete with Citroen and Renault, if you like.
That might be why the Marina was too large to compete effectively with the Escort and too small to compete with the Cortina Mk 3. But BL had Roy Haynes on board, from 1967, direct from Ford and fresh from defining and leading the styling on the Ford Cortina M 2. Didn’t he know the Mk 3 was going to be bigger? Surely?
The Marina was an almost exact match size wise for the Cortina Mk 2, a 1966 car. It was launched with much—I was going to say excitement but I just can’t—publicity in the spring of 1971, just a few months before the Cortina Mk 3. What timing.
And then there are other things about the Marina that elevate it to Deadly Sin status – for example, the doors of this coupe version are shared with the saloon, the estate and the van, with the consequent restriction on access to the rear that implies. Not that you’d want to spend too long in there, unless you had a strange plastic seat fetish.
The styling of the Coupe had other issues too – a big bulging rump rather than a tight tidy rear end like the Capri. Yes, this car was the closest BL got to competing with the Capri, as well as the Cortina saloon.
And to cap it all, the colour of this example is not exactly great either. The nicest way to describe it is probably mouldy mustard. No doubt BL had a great sounding name for it, but mouldy mustard fits better.
Driving the car was more of a demonstration of understeer than anything else – it understeered more than a Beetle oversteered – with a poor ride to match. Build quality was, well, BL’s usual.
North America was not exempt – this saloon version, badged as an Austin Marina, was seen by K Forrest in Ontario.
At least the home market did not have 5 mph bumpers.
So, an inadequately engineered, wrongly sized and awkwardly styled car, with poor road manners and indifferent build quality.
But it was, by far, the most interesting car in that supermarket carpark. Who can resist staring at others’ sins?
My first car (at 16 years old) was a ’73 Canadian-spec Austin Marina sedan that we rebuilt from a rusty runner and a non-rusty non-runner. So this brings back memories and a bit of nostalgia.
Interesting to note on the Coupe the console in front of the gearshift, my sedan didn’t have that but to me it looks like it has been customized, can anyone clarify that?
Also the trailer hitch, which once again brings into question the “no-tow” or “low-tow” rating on so many of today’s compacts. Of course the Marina was RWD, so I guess it had that in its favour.
Yes, that console is aftermarket.
I remember that “my” Marina came with drum brakes at the front, which was a bit of a shock. First stop on a cold morning, you never knew which way they were going to pull. I do remember that the gearbox and the column stalks were very good. Everything else was rubbish, including dealer support ( 12 months to replace brake hoses after a re-call !)
You were lucky – apparently some were built with drums one side and discs the other…..
Funny this coming after the B210. What exactly made these worse than one of those or a Corona?
Coincidentally, my next vehicle after the Marina was a ’74 Corona. While they both suffered from the tin-worm pretty much equally, the Corona was pretty solid mechanically whereas the first day my mom drove the Marina home brand new from the dealer she stopped for groceries on the way home and coming out of the store it wouldn’t go into reverse. Things didn’t get much better than that. Plus with a strong dealer network, parts for the Corona was never a real problem. With the Marina, well, if it cross-referenced to a MG part you might be OK.
Thanks for the insight. These modern eyes think they look a little better than what the Japanese were doing at the time. The A, B, and later O series engines had a rep for sturdiness, Didn’t the B210 essentially have an A series engine. The Triumph manual though was a weak link on the Marina, and in most Japanese cases the manual was a strong feature.
I wonder if the sight in the seventies of all the sales rep drivers reinforced by the Top Gear jokes led to a bad rap on these cars. If you include the Ital they made it into the 80s and even at the end had a strong influence on the Hyundai Pony. Every one of them couldn’t have been bad. Even if some had a vinyl top, woodgrain interior and interesting cloth seat patterns, Corona’s had that too, it was the 70s.
No sales rep cars or Top Gear in the U.S. in the seventies, and the cars had a bad rep here. Or more precisely, no rep. By then, the Mk2 Cortina had somewhat of a cult following in the States (poor man’s 2002) but the Marina, despite an engine which probably had hop-up potential, had no following whatsoever. Such a disappointment after the innovation of the Mini and 1100/1300 (aka Austin America).
These cars were a flop in America. I remember them being sold as “Austin Marinas” and they were pretty much gone after the spring of 1975. The low point of any car wearing a BL badge . . . . .
Just to make matters worse, in Australia they used an E series engine! The local Leyland dealer never got my aunt’s one to run properly. I don’t know if others had better luck.
The styling and colours were actually quite pleasant back in the day, but the build quality was abysmal – maybe not quite as bad as Ford Australia did on their small cars, but certainly enough to make you look seriously at the Japanese.
It is interesting that it seems the advantage by the Japanese seems to come to build quality and manual shift quality. Looks, road manners and cost, not so much. I agree that the Cortina and Vega beat on styling and road manners but were Ford England factories or Lordstown, Ohio really that much better than BL, especially in later years of Marina production. Roger mentioned that 1000 Marinas survive in just UK. Which competitor of the Marina survives in larger percentages, not many I would wager.
Ford Escorts would survive in much larger numbers, and in Australia the Holden Torana would, even 4-cylinder versions. I would bet there are more Mitsubishi Galants around still also, to get a bit more obscure! I see all of those plus Corollas etc as daily transport, but hardly ever see a Marina even at car shows.
Not really, this car looks like it was very heavily influenced by the Datsun 1200, which was available at the same time.
Not very Austin like in appearance at all.
I’d take the Datsun hands down, when it comes to reliability … Sad that after 40+ years, British automobiles are still garbage when it comes to reliability. Pathetic.
Owned a drove a 71 Corona well used owned and drove a 120Y/B210 well used both were better cars than a Marina either a British TC1800 new and the Aussie O series powered version I have also driven both the Japanese cars were good mechanically but nothing special as drivers.
The B210’s saving grace was fuel economy & esp. quality control, a gospel preached in Japan by postwar American prophets w/o honor in their own country, like W. A. Deming.
Roy Haynes quitting Ford for BMC sounds like a classic “grass is greener” scenario.
“Honey, I shrunk the Valiant!” was my first thought upon seeing the light blue Marina found in Canada, with its North American spec big bumpers and vinyl roof, along with a color very common on 1970s Plymouth Valiants. (Rick Moranis being Canadian may make this quip even more appropriate.) Aside from size, the important difference was that the square, frumpy and old-tech Valiant had a strong reputation for reliability and durability, which was not the Marina’s strong suit according to all accounts that I have seen.
I was thinking about the Valiant also when I saw the Marina script on the hood of the Canada spec one. The 67-73 Valiant also had its name on the hood.
And the Marina also used torsion bars in the front end…..
…driving a new 1.8 TC two door was interesting ..it felt quite powerful and ‘torquey’ under the right foot actually ..but the steering and handling felt ‘vague and spongey’ and quite different to the ‘immediate and responsive’ handling of a contemporary Mk111 Cortina 2 litre .. there was no comparison between these two .. the Cortina was a dream to drive
BL had deathly sins? BL WAS a deathly sin, as was pretty much every car developed by Leyland. They were either made unattractive by design and development, arrived too late, were poorly put together, and most of the time all the above.
That’s what I was thinking. BL took some perfectly acceptable cars and dragged them backwards as the competition improved too. In the US, which was actually an important export market for them, they struggled with bumper and emissions laws more than most, which isn’t to say that most everyone didn’t struggle. They did. BL did nothing to improve or maintain their cars’ competitiveness while allowing emissions controls to ruin their performance and 5 mph bumpers to spoil their looks. While other imports added displacement, introduced new models, implemented fuel injection, emphasized handling, packed in features, or offered the promise of incredible efficiency; BL cars got heavier, lost half their carburetors, were built by leftists, and looked like tarted up versions of past offerings. Only the TR7 was new, and it was built by people that hated their jobs and customers. Were there any BL cars that weren’t causing market share loss, either immediately or deferred?
I love it when it gets zany around here.
Pig headed stubborn management caused workers dissolution with their jobs.The typical British disease of low investment and max profit. Didnt work then and it aint working now .
The Canadian Marina looks more modern with the 5mph bumpers.
It looks almost like an AMC product with the shape, door handles, and bumpers. Like a small Hornet.
The door handles were possibly the most successful part of the Marina and were used on Allegro, later Reliant Scimitar, Triumph TR7/8, four door Range Rover, Lotus Elite/Eclat/Excel and Espirit, Land Rover Discovery and a host of kit cars. Ironically when the Marina became the Ital they changed the door handles!
+1
No wonder they went down the toilet.
I don’t imagine they get many Marinas at Waitrose!
Very unusual to see one anywhere now – survivors now number less than 1000, none of which match the dress code at Waitrose
I drive through Surrey/Sussex/Hants at least once a week, and nearly always see an interesting, valuable car being put to good use – this week, an AC Ace, another week an XK140, a blower Bentley, a 1950 Morris Oxford, and so on; but I rarely see the mass-market stuff that filled the roads 30, 40, 50 years ago – the cars I remember. There’s a paradox there somewhere. Seeing an old Avenger or a Mk 3 Cortina is in some ways more rewarding!
I think that’s the point of Curbside Classic. It’s so easy to go to a show or display and see exotic, interesting cars, but you don’t see much of the cars we actually drove back then – the cars we easily relate to.
Having said that, I think the Marina is an exception. There was something so irredeemably deadly dull about them in every respect. I never drove one, but I was driven a few times, and they were clearly the most deeply unrewarding vehicles to drive. Everything was just good enough to get you from A to B, but only just
There are plenty of surviving Marinas in Hawkes bay utes panel vans sedans and coupes the damn things are everywhere.
What’s with the ‘breakaway’ trailer hitch? Looks like a cruel practical joke.
For caravan-ing, of course. Blimey, Occam24 ;-}.
I love the Marina because of all its compromises and the backstory of BL and the British Motor Industry.
Part of my Fantasy Garage on the Isle Of Misfit Autos.
Where is the piano??
Right here! (Link)
“Mouldy Mustard” lol. My mother had a ’72 Vega in GM’s version of this “trendy” hue. We affectionately(?) Called her “Gulden”. Regardless of the paint color choice, it’d be interesting to see a long-term test drive (a’la C&D) of the 2 side by side. I wonder which of these ’72’s might’ve faired better in such a trial. Neither was obviously to be considered a ” keeper” for sure. (Although I recently found a Vega in identical color and options to Mom’s with 13,000 or so miles, in “pristine”…as if that term might have even applied to a Vega when new…condition on EBay listed for about $7000). I forwarded the ad Link to my mother as a joke only to get the reply, ” I don’t even think it cost that much new”. No Mom….not even close! FWIW, if budget, time and space allowed I suspect that I’d be drawn to collecting BL vehicles simply because I find their eclectic mixes of drivetrains and feature content so interesting. BL reminds me of an overseas version of the Studebaker philosophy of throwing in what you’ve got until you run out of parts, then check the bin for whatever else might work when supplies run out.
You’ve got a close match with Saturn’s L Series: platform from column A, Engine from column B, Trans from column C, then build it in Delaware with indifferent workers. Bam! Dream realized.
The windshield wipers orientation seem reversed for the LHD and the RHD versions. What gives?
I always wondered about the wipers myself. Thanks to the all-knowing wikipedia, I now have an answer.
“A point of criticism with the Marina was that the windscreen wiper setup was “opposite” to the driver. This was decided pre-production after drivers of the prototypes reported that airflow at certain speeds made the wiper closest to the A-post lift off the windscreen, potentially disrupting the driver’s line of sight. The problem was judged sufficiently serious that the car went on sale with a wiper position as if for driving on the other side of the road, though subsequent road testers questioned the effectiveness of this decision and the basis for it.”
The MArina was by no means unique in th s – the Hillman Hunter and its derivatives were all configured this way, as were the Allegro and the Triumph Dolomite and derivatvies.Many 1960s British cars seemed to have wipers applied with little or no logic at all.
And don’t forget BL’s finishing touch of eminently removeable rubber plugs in the redundant wiper spindle holes!
I believe all the North American spec ones had the bigger B-series engine with twin carbs on the TC model. A local guy managed to put almost 300k miles on this one so at least some held together ok. Note the icelert sensor – maybe robbed from a Rover?
I don’t know for sure about the TC, but I can confirm that all North American models had the 1800 B motor. When BL changed to the 1700 later in production, that’s when export to North America stopped as it couldn’t meet emissions regs.
You must be Canadian. The Marina only lasted in USA till 75 and I don’t think the O series came till 78. I don’t think we got the TC at all, remember even the MGB was single carb by then.
The GT still had the same single carb as the sedan. The fitted the desmogged MGB engine as it had passed emissions testing.
As for the mileage just goes to show if you look after a car,change the engine oil every 6000 miles……
Very sad compared to a Capri,Rapier or Firenza,especially in that awful pea soup colour.The TC had a decent turn of speed for the time but it was another deadly sin and another polished turd from BL.Well spotted Roger.I have an unhealthy interest in these cars,a hugely unpopular domestic science teacher drove a 4 door in the same colour and my ex BIL(a wife beating,womanising drunk) had 2 which rusted out (one at 4 years old,the other lasted til 5)
Actually Gem these heaps seemed to be aimed at the driver of a A60 who was looking to trade, a school friends grandfather did just that, traded a 4/72 Riley for a TC Marina with the MGB engine and almost instantly regretted it, my friend and I took it for a thrash it was good for over 90mph indicated but wallowed all over the place at speed, Horrible cars, a Hunter or Victor is quite happy at near the ton even a Cortina if you can find a suitable downhill stretch but not a Marina but for teenage bravado I wouldnt have gone that fast in it.
I’m starting to get worried about your teachers…..
I agree with you, Gem…this Marina coupe is to the Capri what the ’65 AMC Marlin was to the Mustang.
Lots of interesting bits of information here.
As at least one person here has pointed out, this “mustard” color was available on cars from many manufacturers….it was 1 of many “love it or hate it” colors used in the 70s. Unfortunately, BL seemed to have a large number of odd colors in it’s pallette.
I bought a new Vega in 1972 and while I remember a C&D multi-car test of economy cars, as bad as the Vega was….the Marina was way worse in every category.
Having said that, I sort of like these cars, even the coupes. BUT….they put me in mind of those cars and trucks I see every few weeks in my area that have the body placed on a 4 wheel drive chassis. If I owned a Marina I’d so want to put the body on a different chassis.
Haynes missed the mark with the Marina in a similar way that the MK2 Cortina missed the mark of its main competition the Victor which had much more interior space than the tin can Ford The MK3 Cortina mirrored the styling of the FD Victor which was its rival, the Marina missed all the way around it was up against the Escort & Viva but was a bit bigger but no better made, A good car to release in 1967 but it was far too late getting out of the warming drawer.
I never realized before reading this article that the coupe’s doors were the same as the front ones on the sedan. Yeesh… no wonder its proportions were so awful. Longer doors would have helped in the looks department. Great post, Roger!
I thought BL had nothing BUT Deadly Sins.
Did they produce any cars that weren’t awful?
Yes.
Xj12
Rover SD1
Jaguar E type
Mini
Some cars had some great features an abilities, matched with awful ones. The Princess for example looked great, was spacious and comfortable , but was missing a hatchback, a decent gearbox and was about as unreliable as it could be. The Dolomite Sprint had most of what it needed to match a BMW 2002, except for dated styling and reliability
I agree that the Rover SD1 was the closest thing to not a deadly sin that BL ever made and if any other company had built it the way BL did it would have been one of that company’s deadly sins. It was also one of the least compromised designs BL ever made–it didn’t share its doors with other lesser models for example and it was a hatchback that actually had a hatchback. Unfortunately it suffered from typical BL build quality and took too long to bring to market.
But just about every car poor BL tried to cobble together from its beginnings throughout the 1970’s was a deadly sin and each helped pave the way for its eventual demise.
Metro when it worked?
The E-type and Mini were before the BL era, the XJ12 marginal because it would have been in train when BL was formed, and as Acd said the SD1 is really a Deadly Sin because it was an opportunity squandered. As per Paul’s definition a DS does not automatically have to be a dreadful car, although “if” (and it is a big if!) you believed Clarkson on the Top Gear BL cars challenge… I vaguely remember when TWR was racing them.
Although it also had a typically long gestation period, the Range Rover has to be one of the best BL cars.
I`m a long time car buff, and I don`t believe I ever saw one in the United States. I guess they really were that bad.
YES 🙂
When these were new I thought they looked like a dumpy, frumpy Hillman Avenger (Plymouth Cricket). Similar size, similar overall shape (in 4-door form) but, unlike the Hillman, no style. Made a decent looking van though, where the straighter lines suited the purpose.
Minor point, the Marina came out after the Mk.III Cortina which was launched in late October 1970 (the Avenger was even earlier, February 1970) so it was already lagging behind before it got started. Perhaps if they’d slightly cut the overhangs, given it more up-to-date suspension (I’m only talking live rear axle with coil springs and trailing arms, maybe struts or wishbones at the front, not full IRS!) and a snappier look it might have been able to take on the Escort, Viva and Avenger head-on instead of falling between sizes.
The Australian version was available with a straight six, a lead tipped arrow if there ever was one!
Yeah well GMH stuck a red six in a Viva and got away with it creating the Torana so Leyland Australia stuck their awfull P76 six into the Marina and created a bigger disaster than they bargained on the 4 banger Marina doesnt handle well at all doubling the weight over the front axle sure doesnt help.
The correct colour name for this delectable hue Roger, is ‘hearing aid’ beige.
Just occurred to me; who in their right mind would name a car after a boat parking zone?
That would be a question for the Bentley Buoys.
I think the colour was known as Harvest Gold.They even used it on MG sportscars….I once drove a friend’s Marina which was a hideous shade of purple and still remember the total lack of directional stability and the excess body roll even at low speeds.The car was completely inferior to the old Morris Minor and Oxford which it replaced.Strangest thing about it is that the Marina was actually a pretty good seller in the UK market.
I remember seeing these here in Ontario back in the ’70’s, along with an annoying TV commercial. Our salty roads took these out a long time ago, and I haven’t seen one in the metal since around 1981 (a girl at my high school had one – she even drove it in the winter. An old British car in a Canadian winter….hmmmm.). The one with Ontario plates must have spent its winters in a garage. Good riddance.
Whoops, I’m late here, but oh my eyes, my eyes!! Using sedan doors on a coupe surely qualifies the Marina as the AA+ gold-star high-achiever of deadly sindom. Sadly I’m not spared the occasional sight or a Marina coupe either, as someone in town has a white one – which is all done up with Unipart logos and stripes… For more fun Marina reading, check out my Marina van post here!
Shitty soda-straw thin, overly long exhaust tip just underlines that no one cares at the factory.
It also had the exhaust sound of being neither powerful, nor refined. Sort of just gargling away petrol, without any meaningful results. A sound Id expect from a 1933 lorry perhaps.
Or is that lengthy exhaust tip pethaps a secret “Q” weapon, in case a 007 agent suddenly is in the need of stabbing someone going backwards in a car jacked “loaner”?
Not a bad design at all . Even the first Volkswagen Passat 1973 in two doors (2 turig ) looks quite inspired by the Morris Marina coupe fastback.
Wonder why they put the side view mirrors so far forward? Just seems like they would be hard to see.
Mirrors at or near the front of the fenders was quite common on European and Japanese cars of the 50s-early-80s – they were still a factory option on some Nissans until recently. My 1992 Nissan Laurel had them (factory electric too, so easy adjustment) and once I got used to them they were fantastic. They were so much closer to my line of vision, sought of like where head-up displays are nowadays, and it was so easy to glance at them while driving. And when it came to towing a caravan, they were absolutely brilliant, offering a much wider field of view. If only they didn’t look so dorky…
I think the color is called “sandglow”. We had a neighbor with an orange Austin Marina when I was a kid. The car couldn’t have been more than 3 or 4years old at the time but was not nice.
The Marina was sold in Canada until 1978. It was the last mainstream British “saloon” sold here as the Cortina, Vauxhall Firenza (Viva Mk. 3) and Cricket (Avenger) all departed in 1973.
I would consider the Austin Allegro a deadly sin also. A company in BL’s position at that time could withstand only so many deadly sins.
The Marina’s main claim to fame is as a parts source for upgrading the much better Morris Minor, discs, bigger engine, as bolt in upgrades, actually that is the main use most BL products are good for mechanical updates for the better made BMC products of yore.
How much Minor was in the Marina, Bryce? Was it just a rebody on a longer Minor floorpan?
As a stopgap, the Marina sold well and was never intended to hang around for long. It was supposed to be replaced by the ADO77 within 5 years but alas the money ran out. Hayes intended to base a series of cars on this platform, a novel concept then.
The Mk III Cortina is actually shorter than the Mk II, but wider and lower.