(first posted 10/24/2016) I photographed these two, fine specimens of 80’s American luxury at the same intersection (Jackson & Franklin) adjacent to the Willis (née Sears) Tower within the span of just under four years. It was the second shot (of the Lincoln) which triggered my memory of having taken a similar shot, earlier. Indeed, it has often felt as if I was playing the children’s game “Memory” when a sense of déjà vu occurs when taking photographs.
The contrast that was immediately apparent to me in both shots was that of the perceived differing social classes of drivers of luxury cars and bus riders by much of America. It’s true that I didn’t start regularly riding city buses until over two years of living in Chicago. Perhaps this was partially due to having grown up in a car-centric manufacturing town (Flint, Michigan), but up until my thirties I had held the perception that riding the bus was for losers.
Cars were for folks who were well enough to do that they could afford that form of personal mobility. Riding the train (the “L”, as we Chicagoans affectionately refer to it) was cool, as that mode of transportation seemed a perfect fit for sophisticated, metropolitan city dwellers (and the occasional, foul-smelling pandhandler). It wasn’t until the middle of the last decade that I discovered the sheer convenience of using the Windy City’s (mostly) clean and reliable grid of bus service.
Let’s now look at these cars. Both the Cadillac and Lincoln had been in production for more than a few years by the time each respective example rolled off the assembly line. The Cadillac’s styling was in its sixth year, and the Lincoln’s was in its tenth (and its last). The basic look of both body shells dated from 1980, with minor styling tweaks over the years, arguably the most substantial of which was a slanted rear panel for the Lincoln for ’85. No longer fresh designs when our examples were new, both cars still presented a very traditional, American style of luxury – RWD, V8 engines (a 125- or 135-hp HT-4100 for the Cadillac, and a 150-hp 5.0L Windsor for the Lincoln), plush and pillowy interiors, and the identity of a marque that still held a considerable amount of prestige in the eyes of many consumers. Both of the featured examples weighed almost exactly two tons in base form.
A fact of life of living in a large city is that the closer one lives to downtown and the action, generally, the more it costs. Shorter commute times mean greater convenience and a quality of life improved by the amount of time saved on the way to, and from, work. Granted, CTA buses can be ridiculously crowded during rush hour, in contrast to the stretch-out comfort in either the Fleetwood Brougham or the Town Car (or even the CTA Red Line train, comparatively speaking), but perhaps the true luxury lies in not having to drive your brougham into the city, for work or otherwise.
Both public and private transportation have their innate and unique benefits, and its true that many cities in the United States do not have the boon of comprehensive, clean, affordable, and reliable public transit like in Chicago. I feel incredibly thankful to live in a place where the ownership of a car is an option and not a necessity. Contrary to what I had once believed, buses are not just for losers – even among auto aficionados. Perhaps the money I save by using public transport may one day enable me to afford and garage a classic car of my own.
Downtown, the Loop, Chicago, Illinois, at Jackson & Franklin.
Northbound Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham photographed on Thursday, July 12, 2012;
Eastbound Lincoln Town Car shot on Thursday, April 21, 2016.
I saw a mid 70s Coupe De ville here a couple of days ago the cars disappearing from your automotive scenery are turning up here.
Wow, but that Cadillac is just so much better styled than the Town Car. This generation of Lincoln was always challenging for me to love, and when you show them together, it’s no contest.
Mechanically, it’s another story. I wonder if the Caddy has been repowered. A swap with a 307 would be easier, no doubt, but replacement with a 80-81 368 would be infinitely more satisfying. That 4.1 was the worst of everything.
I prefer the styling of the Cadillac, but the Lincoln doesn’t bother me – it’s just the front overhang of the Town Car that really kind of wrecks its overall look for me. I think I actually prefer the Lincoln’s round wheel arches versus the Cadillac’s square ones, but each works well on its respective body.
I was just coming here to say the same thing about the front overhang of the Town Car. It looks so exaggerated and awkward. The shorter overhang of the Caddy imparts a certain purpose of design, almost an athleticism.
I often wondered the same thing only to find that the vast majority still have 4100’s in the engine bay. I suspect many were swapped out or rebuilt long ago after the intakes puked or the customer didn’t follow the strict maintenance schedule of yearly antifreeze changes and the stop leak pellets.
I agree with JPC that the Cadillac was better styled. The Lincoln so much benefited from the work done to it in the mid eighties. The Caddy was left to wither.
Giving the Lincoln a subtle areo aware restyle helped the look somewhat. More importantly, it told the world that the Town Car was here to stay. Adding port injection got 0-60 down to 11.4 seconds according to C/D. This was back in the range of the older ones. What was not in the range of the old ones was mileage, which was now ahead of any European luxury over 3 liters. Ford was rewarded with it’s most profitable model per unit.
Cadillac was skimping along on it’s good looks and stays of execution. Too bad Roger Smith missed the boat and didn’t make the minimum investment needed. Cadillac had fought hard to keep a unique engine and this could have paid off. The 4.1 when modified to 4.5 and given port injection bound up to 180hp with the more restrictive front drive exhaust set up. This would have been enough to get acceleration up to 425 V8 levels or beyond. By now the auto had an extra gear and the car lost 200 pounds in the transition from big block to smaller aluminum V8. By then the quality problems were addressed. A real Cadillac with a real Cadillac engine. The saddest words are these, “It might have been.”
The funny thing is that a couple of Consumer Guide issues I still have put the earlier 80’s 302 TBI Town cars at 14.8 seconds 0-60 which is the same as the 4100 Devilles. I’m sure the Town car’s had better passing response with the extra 30 FT LBS of torque though.
I too prefer the Cadillac’s exterior styling in profile view, though I have always been a fan of this generation Lincoln’s front fascia.
I must laugh though, as the first thing that jumped out at me was the ad for the personal injury lawyer on the bus. The Town Car in front of it looks exactly like the car a personal injury lawyer who advertises on the side of busses (and maybe TV) would drive 🙂
They usually drive 911s, better for chasing ambulances at speed.
Or maybe this? 🙂
That was my first thought.
Contrary to JPC, John and Brendan above, I prefer the Lincoln’s styling. To me, it seemed like a more unified design that still looked distinguished in the late 1980s. BUT, this particular Town Car suffers the indignity of having a fake convertible top – and with that, I have a question:
How popular were fake convertible tops on such cars in Chicago in the 1980s? I grew up in Philadelphia, where just about every Lincoln and Cadillac in the late 80s had a “cabriolet roof” applied by dealers. I’m not exaggerating: Dealers would routinely put these roofs on cars and charge extra for them in the process. However, when I’m in the Midwest, I rarely see older cars with cabriolet roofs.
Whenever I see such an example these days, I get curious about how popular this trend was geographically speaking – whether it was mostly confined to the East Coast, or was it popular nationwide. Regardless, the appeal of cabriolet roofs remains a mystery to me, but like all mysteries, I am pretty curious about it.
Those fake convertible tops were moderately popular in the Midwest, but not hugely. They were always a minority. I don’t know if it was about frugality or whether we were just more inclined to be happy with the cars as they came from the factory. Or maybe our dealers made a good enough living from them (they sold very well here) that they didn’t need to squeeze every last dime of profit from each sale.
Or could we just have better taste? ?
WERE? They still are, and there are several aftermarket companies that still manufacture them.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2013-16-CADILLAC-XTS-CARRIAGE-ROOF-TREATMENT-KIT-ADD-CLASS-TO-YOUR-CAR-/261342657048?hash=item3cd93c7a18:g:KroAAOxyXDhSmSDS&vxp=mtr
I’m sure it’s only a matter of time before they are offered for the new Cadillac CT6 and Lincoln Continental.
There are numerous 2007-2014 Camry’s and Avalon’s with them as these are the go to choice for the blue haired set these days. And yes the corners of the bumpers are almost always bashed in too! We laugh every time we see one as it looks so out of place on these cars.
These were not uncommon when I lived in Atlanta 25 years ago. I couldn’t find a pic of the Jim Moran Special, a Corolla with the padded cabriolet roof, an add-on hood ornament and special wheel arches in your choice of chrome or gold. If you bought the “gold package” all of the formerly chromed pieces were “gold” plated. Jim Moran was the guy who owned Southeast Toyota Distributors, the biggest distributor in that part of the South. They weren’t actually labeled with that name, it was what the salesmen called them. Usually with a tinge of disgust.
There was a big spiff if you sold one of those, but the people who bought Corollas just wanted the cheapest damned car they could get. None of them wanted a gold package Corolla, not with $2,000 extra dollars worth of basically junk and bad taste. Those cars didn’t even come with the serial numbers engraved on all the windows. That was STILL extra… LOL…
The “Carriage Roof” (Lincoln) or “Full Cabriolet Roof” (Cadillac), trend began in the late 1970s. In 1978, a Cadillac Phaeton model was available for the Coupe/Sedan de Ville. In 1979, a Carriage Roof was available for the Continental Mark V and was included as standard equipment for the Bill Blass Edition Mark V.
In the 1980s, the “convertible-look” top survived for the new Seville and the newer Eldorado. Over at Lincoln, it remained an option for the new Mark VI in 1980 becoming standard on the 1980 through ’83 Bill Blass models and the 1983 Emilio Pucci models. It was also available for the 1985-1989 version of the Town Car.
Although it was available as a factory option for some models during this time, a lot of dealerships added their own aftermarket tops to these and other models. And no, it was not an East Coast-only thing.
Quite frankly, even though I was a BMW (dreamer) guy by the mid-eighties, I still loved the look of a Town Car with the Carriage Roof exactly like the one in the above pics (in BLACK only, please!!).
Here’s the 1985 Town Car brochure pic:
An early 1980s Cadillac Seville with the “Full Cabriolet Roof” option:
I think most people would agree it works best on the 1979 Continental Mark V Bill Blass Edition…
+1 – Really the only car I ever liked with the fake convertible top. My doctor had one of these.
A car it looks really stupid on: an Aero-Bird. Why would you even go there? And yet many did.
No, that roofline is awful and makes the car look top-heavy. Too much roofline for the size of the car!
I meant on the 1985 Town Car, not the ’79 Mark V where it looks great.
I think that they are trying to make a carriage roof look from way back when they were real, like the 1920’s or 1930’s, not trying to make a fake convertible. Of course back when the carriage roof was real, I think some of them were designed to be folded back for an open air sedan.
That is the way the vinyl ones are typically designed, like the one on the Fleetwood. When they are cloth with the top bar/hinge thing with the two metal pieces at the ends and the fake tonneau snaps are trying to look like a convertible top.
1st look I thought the Lincoln was a LTD!. Caddys got more class. In Euroupe the FoMOCo product would not grta 2nd look.
I’m with you on the styling, Eric.
To these foreign eyes, the Lincoln looks the more impressive of the two. The Cadillac is obviously a GM design, and for me (not being used to seeing either of them) it would take a second glance to tell it was a Cadillac. Sure there are plenty of Cadillac cues when I look at it in the still photo, but if I caught a fleeting glimpse of it in traffic I might not be so sure.
If only the front wheels of the Lincoln were placed about four inches further forward. What did that short wheelbase/massive front overhang do for maneuverability? It looks like it must have been a bear to park in close quarters. Shame about the chrome door edge guards too; they visually break up what could be a very clean design.
A buddy of mine had a Town Car as a hand-me-down from his mom and dad like above. Nice looking on the outside, quiet on the inside. However, it wallowed over each bump like a pogo stick, and I felt it would capsize with each sharp turn of the wheel. Too much Brougham for me!!
However, I hope the recently introduced Continental is a step in the right direction. Looks sharp on the outside, the interior look right as well. A dose of European handling would be appreciated. Hope to see it on the streets very soon.
Just saw one yesterday in a lovely blue color (“midnight sapphire”). The chrome jewelry is quite tasteful, but it’s less sleek than I expected–it’s either too short (lengthwise) or too tall.
My guess is that buyers will find it too conservative–it’s about as daring as the original Hyundai Genesis. Not really what I expected from Ford, which has some pretty good-looking cars these days.
I’m still waiting for our local Ford-Lincoln dealer to receive one. It’s not a bad-looking car, based on the photos, but I wouldn’t call it a knock-out, either.
The bigger problem for Lincoln is exemplified by our dealer. It is the only Lincoln dealer in the Harrisburg area. But the Lincolns are always tucked away, in the back of the lot. The premium spaces at the front of the lot, which are easily seen by pedestrian and vehicular traffic, are always filled with Ford F-150s, or Escapes and Edges, along with an occasional Mustang. The second and third rows are taken up by Fusions and Explorers, followed by Focuses and Fiestas. You have to look for the Lincolns to find them.
I thought that too until I saw one in person and drove it. Very impressive.
I saw my first one “in the wild”. It certainly had presence. Quite a stunner.
We checked out a more loaded black example in Reserve trim last weekend that had a cringe inducing price tag over 70 grand and the 3.0 TT V6. It was a rolling digital laden sedan packed with loads of conveniences. The styling at certain angles is okay but from the rear we both thought Hyundai Azera which is hardly the look Lincoln should be going after. The side reminded us of a Bently and the front is almost a copy of Jaguar.
Neither of us liked the dorky exterior door handles which require power to use and a certain failure item in harsh weather climates. The interior was probably the best part of the car save the hard plastic seat backs. The seats themselves were very comfortable, something that many sedans lack today and a nice change of focus from the rock hard seats in most everything today.
Note that there is also a pricier Black label edition available that can peg the sticker into the 80 grand range with the optional 3.0 engine, premium paint and the various electronic option packages. That is a serious amount of coin for a FWD based platform that also underpins the Ford Fusion and Lincoln MKZ which start out at 23 and 35K in there base trim levels.
Hard plastic seat backs in a 70 grand car? Ouch!
I had to look up a Hyundai Azera because I didn’t know what you are talking about…and still don’t.
I don’t think it has the old school presence and swagger of a, say, ’79 Continental Town Car but nothing does anymore.
Considering how nobody is going to bring back Brougham, I think the ’17 Continental is a step in the right direction. As to the e latch, I know there is a fail safe but can’t remember what it is. Regardless, that is the right kind of thing to put into a luxury car. Will it hold up forever? Who knows. I know my 300 can be unlocked by touching the inside of the handle and its potential failure down the road is worth it. Folks are still awed by it. I can’t help but think of the responses I’d get from the Continental’s e latch and self closure feature. Same with things like the welcome approach lamps or all the things you can do with the fancy seats or the brake hold.
As far as the platform goes, yes it is based on the same platform as the MKZ but it’s been reworked and refined. It’s like saying a 300 and a Ghibli are “basically” the same thing. Well, no actually they are not.
The FWD vs RWD is basically irrelevant to your average buyer-until they get stuck in the snow. Almost no one drives a luxocruiser to make any of the advantages of RWD felt anyway. Almost every single E class or 5 series around here is a 4matic or an Xdrive because of that concern. As such, other than the “for old times sake” (part of the reason I got the RWD based 300) who cares if the Continental is FWD?
Finally, as to MSRP, rarely does anyone pay the full thing. I think pretty much all MSRPs are nuts-from econoboxes to luxoboats they are all too high.
RWD means RWD proportions. I’d say 90% of FWD haters in reality dislike FWD for that, front overhang and flat high offset wheels, more so than the dynamic deficiencies, at least In the Luxury segment.
The trouble with the Continental is that it looks identical to the now facelifted MKz to the untrained eye, for twice the money. This is the same trouble US luxury manufacturers have had since the 80s, their best efforts look just like rebodies of much lower tier products, clearly separate from the Mercedes and BMWs, or Lexus LS who clearly have a goal nobler than profit margins.
I honestly question in the context of their respective times just how much different is the new Continental over the last V8 powered ones of the 90s? Both are extended off a FWD midsize platform, both have major chassis differences, both had the best engines in the pipeline for the time, and neither have particularly remarkable styling.
Working in the Detroit Metro area, I am already seeing them daily. Overall I think Lincoln really nailed the design of the new Continental. I could nitpick a few details, but on the other hand there are also some design features I really like.
6 Speed: Your buddy’s hand me down Town Car must have badly needed new shock absorbers.
My ’81 and my ’87 Town Cars, when equipped with new nitrogen gas filled shocks, gave a very smooth, controlled ride with none of the pogo stick response that you mentioned.
It’s been my experience that the front ends of RWD Cadillac De Villes were serious gyrators, even with decent shock absorbers.
Unfortunately, he wasn’t able to keep it for very long. A short developed in the driver’s door which destroyed the power window/lock controls and scorched the door panel. He sold it to a junk dealer who was very happy to get it; apparently these were in much demand as parts cars.
Hopefully, someone else benefited in their restoration efforts.
Having owned an 88 and an 89 Lincoln Town Car, I’ve spent a lot of time behind the wheel and that is where the styling really shines. The bladed front fenders and that long power bulge hood really have to be experienced. To be polite, men would appreciate it much more than women.
Remember the 4-6-8 Bug a Boo ?
It was a problematic GM goof up that didn’t work well, my Bro. disconnected his not long after buying the car.
Would work to day as we now have more reliable technology. Remember EFI was
new in the USA!.
Disconnecting the computer that controlled cylinder deactivation was easy, and gave owners the standard 368 cubic inch V-8, which was a perfectly good engine. The real problems started when Cadillac switched to the HT 4100 V-8 for 1982.
We bounced around from the near-surburbs to the urban core a few times. In Boston, living near the city center was massively more expensive than a couple towns away… but we made up for it by getting rid of a car. My car-less wife achieved her quickest commute ever–by walking to work! So, for roughly the same money, she had more spare time. (45-50 mins driving each way vs. 15-20 mins walking).
However, we lost the flexibility of our spacious suburban driveway, which mean that it was harder to keep old cars on hand. Still, we had no regrets… more toys are good, but more time is better.
Now we live in the midwest and have the best of both worlds: plenty of space for the old cars, and my wife’s commute is 5 mins. OK, so that’s not the whole picture… urban coastal life certainly had its advantages in terms of food, culture, beach… hey, if one of you figures out how to have it all, please let us know!
The Caddy is nicer looking. The Lincoln has too much front overhang and too much roofline, esp. the C-pillar.
My wife is the same way- she will take the L, but not the bus.
I’ll take the Lincoln, just for the fuel injected 302.
My ’81 TC had the single throttle body fuel injected 302; my ’87 had the MUCH better true, real fuel injected 302.
The ’87 had more than adequate throttle response and power. The ’81 was smooth and acceptable…..if you didn’t floor it to run a yellow light or to quickly merge on Interstate 10.
IMO the ’81 had better quality control and build quality; but the ’87 was a more powerful and desirable car to drive. Ride quality, for the passengers, was about the same in both cars.
I still think that Cadillac is a beautiful example of the traditional American Luxury car. Not so much the Lincoln, as the proportions in the 80’s just never looked right to me after the late ’70’s downsizing. As for reliability and overall daily driver usefulness though, the Lincoln is obviously in the lead.
Coincidentally, two of my neighbors drive 1995 DeVilles. They’re both (predictably) single retired guys and are quite good friends. They spent the past weekend with a rented pressure washer and a buffing wheel detailing their cars in our shared parking lot in the wake of Hurricane Matthew, which left some battle scars on pretty much any vehicle parked outdoors. Normally I’d have chatted with them while they worked, but their collective enthusiasm for extolling what they perceive as the virtues of a certain presidential candidate prevents me from more interaction than a cordial wave hello these days. (I’ve chosen to chalk this phenomenon up to early-onset dementia, but that’s another story). Both of their cars sport the requisite “Florida Special” simulated convertible tops. Sitting outside this morning over my cup of coffee, I had to admire the results of their labor. Both cars look great, and both owners have vowed to hold on to them for as long as they can. In their cases the 4.9 litre engines make this a viable option, as long as the mid-90’s electronics hold out. For that era though, I’d still probably rather take my chances on a mid-90’s Town Car than a DeVille, as in those years the Lincoln really was a looker too.
Now, now; there’s no need to shun your neighbors. Rabid Jill Stein supporters they may be, but classic car lovers can always get along. 🙂
Even if the electronics give up, there’s plenty of aftermarket support for the good ol’ 302. They’ll be able to keep it going if they don’t mind originality.
We had an ’85 Lincoln in the family for years. You could not kill it. In 2003 it needed a new oil pump and my grandfather finally gave it up and bought a Grand Marquis (which he hated).
The Lincoln was the “long trip” car. Gray with red velour interior. The legroom! The power steering! The clock! These were all things my grandfather lamented when he was scooting the Marquis around Fairfax.
If given a choice between the two, when they were new, I would have gone with the Cadillac. As much as I fondly recall the Lincoln, the Caddy looks less dated, more sedate. Besides, I have always been a box Caprice fan.
This iteration of Town Car, specifically a 1987 example, is what started my love of large land yachts.
My family wasn’t very well off when I was young, and I spent my formative automotive years sweltering in the back seat of a stripper 1985 Cavalier Type-10 2-door with no A/C. Mom would drop Dad off at work, drop me off at school, then take the car to her job. And so it was for a long time-Mom and Dad were young kids and working what they could work to keep food on the table.
A good friend of mine in intermediate and junior high ended up living with his grandparents, and they treated me like a member of the family. They brought me along on vacations, let me stay at their house quite a lot, even let me treat the refrigerator like I lived there.
And they had an immaculate 1987 Town Car, black with maroon leather interior. For someone like me whose parents worked to the bone just to have a pot to piss in, riding around in that car was amazing! It felt like we were big shit riding around in that big huge car with the big huge back seat with a big huge window I could put down but never needed to because of the big huge air conditioner that I don’t think they ever moved from 69 degrees.
Even now, I see that version of Town Car and think luxury, something I cannot say for the Cadillac. The clean lines, the long hood… The Town Car just screams “class” to me. I know the Caddy’s supposed to, but it never did and still doesn’t-it certainly looks more lux than the Cavalier, but it didn’t stand out to me like the Town Cars did.
Makes me wonder how I’d have come out if I’d ever really known my great-grandparents and their tastes in luxury cars.
Last weekend’s LCOC Eastern Meet had a carriage roofed 1979 Mk V Bill Blass as Best of Show. Original owner and a 99 point car, driven to the meet.
Note that the 302 made 150 Hp starting in 1986 with 160 optionally available with dual exhaust system and the switch over to SFI. 1980-83 302’s with TBI made 130 HP and 140 from 1984-1985.
The full size C-body Devilles/Fleetwoods/Broughams started 1980 with 150 HP 368 4BBL V8 engines then down to 140 with the 8-6-4 engine and TBI or Digital fuel injection per Cadillac speak. 1982 kicked off the HT 4100 and a measly 125 HP and that was bumped to 135 for 1983-85. 1986 made the Olds 307 4BBL with 140 HP or 170 with HO vin “9” engine up until 1990. 1990 also saw the introduction of the Small block 5.7 with 175 HP as an option on certain models and that figure grew to 185 for 1991-92 before the aero re-design making the 199092 the best years for these cars after 1980.
I had versions of both these cars while I was in grad school. Gas was relatively cheap, big cars were cheaper and often in much better condition than small cars. With 2 kids, it was really easy to get around in these.
My favorite was the 1985 Mercury Grand Marquis. Coming from some very underpowered cars, it was a joy to drive and had an amazingly deep trunk. I believe it was the first year they had fuel injection.
My wife like the 1981 Olds 98 Brougham. More leisurely acceleration, much softer ride, and it was nice to ride around in.
I have fond memories of both cars, and they started my love of big cars. I seem to remember both cars getting around 17 mpg highway.
My father (a doctor, naturally) had this model of Caddy, but fortunately it was towards the end of the road for that body, and he got one with the towing package, so he got the 5.7. Quite a pig, but a very comfortable one that run for close to a quarter million miles before getting traded in on… a Town Car. I want to say 1994 with the 4.6. Much better engine, nice car, but not as archetypal as that Cadillac.
As much as I (and he. He now has a Mazda 3) prefer smaller cars, there’s something just right about crusing in one of these boats. In fact, one of those old Fleetwoods with an LS motor and 4l80e… Hmm, time to go to Craigslist and dream…
Love the town car. Irs reliable and comfortable and has a nicer interior and better looking body especially the 80- 84 with the taller rear and real bumpers. The Cadillac had that horrible 4.1 engine. I drove one once and it was so slow That bus could out accelerate it. Cadillac also had cheap interior and those self destructing fender extensions. Way more Lincoln’s survived the decades than Cadillacs. Cadillac costs way more to repair too. Lincoln was the best car of the 80s and Cadillac represented everything wrong with it.
Love lincoln
I like the Linc. body style in these years, was never a fan of the later big Bulbous
Bloated styling that came after. I have never driven any model……
There was something to be said about living in near suburbs close to major cities. When I lived in Atlanta, one of my jobs was in the Buckhead section of town. I lived near the airport. Even though the distance from my house to my job was about 20 or so miles, I could easily spend an hour in traffic. I eventually grew tired of that and would drive to the airport to catch the train into town. There was a stop about 1/4 mile from my office, and if I needed to do any shopping or other business, I could take the train to the shopping areas and downtown in a matter of minutes. I generally could get to work in about 30 minutes, 45 if there were delays. I kept all kinds of miles off of my car back then. It was great.
I later moved to Grand Rapids which has a decent transportation system for a mid sized town. Buses and now Bus Rapid Transit (which is different), but no light rail. In the 18 years I’ve lived here, I’ve only ridden the buses a few times. Fortunately for me, the places I worked downtown had their own private parking and traffic in a city this size is nowhere near as bad as a major city.
I go to Chicago for trade shows and other events, and sometimes think it would be nice to live in the big city again. But then, coming across the Skyway and then getting mired in traffic on the Eisenhower or the Dan Ryan, I remember my times in Cleveland and Atlanta and think, no…
What a treat to take in these pics. The Lincoln was the first one done off of the downsized Panther platform and was a rush job like the LTD Crown Vic. The fender flares looked as “drawn on” as my Aunt Irene’s eyebrows.
The Caddy looks great and is actually an ’86-89 with the Olds 307 V8 not an ’85. I can tell from the front bumper insert which had a thick silver midsection ’86-89. The ’80-85 had a thin white line in the middle. The other reason I know it’s not an ’85 is because it is still running.
Thanks, Calibrick – and now I can never un-see the “eyebrows” over the wheel arches!
Thanks also for the pointer RE: the correct model year(s) and engine. As I was looking at the frame of the Cadillac, I seemed to remember “HT1000” chrome badges on the front fenders of such-equipped cars (missing from our example), but I wasn’t for sure. Egg all over my face – it’s not the first time, and it won’t be the last. 😉 Have a great day, friend.
Both of these just seemed to ramble on forever. It was like the Corvair post-66, when GM figured “as long as some people keep buying them, we might as well keep building them”, but no changes unless necessary to meet federal regulations or if some new way to cheapen-out the car is discovered. Or like the full-size vans that seemed to be stuck in the ’70s well into the ’90s. It’s hard to believe that not long before these were built, it was considered de rigueur to have a new look every model year. Who would buy a car, especially a luxury car, that looked like last year’s model? Or one from three years ago? The neighbors would think you’re down on your luck and had to buy a used car. Can’t have that!
To my eyes, both designs are flawed, Lincoln with its too short wheelbase is awkward. What bothers me about the Cadillac, is the wheel arches. Not the shape, but the height discrepancy. It looks in profile like a person raising their chin as they try to peer upwards to see what is on that top shelf, as though it’s a rolling chassis with the engine out, or as if it’s trying to climb a grade that isn’t there. Not graceful at all.
I’m guessing you’re too young to remember skirted fenders on most expensive cars. I can remember a magazine styling analysis of the first Seville that accused its full rear wheel opening of detracting from the car’s luxury image. At least they never put skirts on these Fleetwoods.
No not by any stretch. I get what was attempted here, but the short length of the car to my eyes just isn’t conducive to the sleek look that rear skirts are meant to achieve.
RE: Cadillac vs Lincoln styling
To my eyes, these two cars look more alike than different.
I like the curved wheel well openings on the Lincoln more than the squared off openings on the Cadillac.
I like the shorter front overhang on the Cadillac better than the Lincoln’s extended front.
#IMO the Lincoln was a MUCH better “driver” out in the real world. It had a peppier and MUCH more reliable powertrain. It’s long term quality control seemed to be higher than the slipping Cadillac’s.
My wife and I grew up in Chicago and still regularly visit family and friends there. We both worked in the Loop for years. I used to just die everyday I had to drive a car to work even though I had a garage with staffers waiting for me. Driving is simply a very unpleasant way to experience Chicago. It is extremely inconvenient and expensive.
Usually I took the IC/Metra into Water Street on the River. The worse the weather, the better it was to ride the train. I always got to work on time without any drama. There is a wonderful feeling of warmth on those icy winter mornings when after waiting in the howling winds, you shuffle into a train car and let the heat restore your blood circulation as you read a chapter or two in a novel you would get through in a week. There are enough underground walkways to stay out of the Arctic winter weather and I usually only popped up at street level long enough to duck into the office building I worked at on Michigan.
As to busses, I used them often to get to my girlfriend’s condo in Boystown and they were usally a nice ride.
Honestly, when you are working and living in Chicago, being surrounded by one of the world’s most amazing collection of skyscrapers, stores and history never got old, even for this native.
Finally, Chicago has gotten really, really bad since we left it. Many of the wonderful things, places and experiences my wife and I had there are gone due to rampant crime and flat-out dangerous decisions made by far too numerous vagrants and drug addicts. Our family members who worked for City services in law enforcement and fire have felt a need to escape and we worried about them daily. Our trips into the Loop are planned as though we’re visiting an insane asylum. It is heart breaking. Our kids naturally, raised far from the City dreamed of living where their parents grew up, met and married. But not anymore. This terrific story reminds me of how far things have collapsed in my hometown.
Wow, the second paragraph took me back, the American class system is alive and well.
I have heard of the Sloanian ladder where each brand is meant for a specific class unless you were black or Hispanic
Reading the back catalogue on this site, you love to ridicule the European and especially the British class system of 50 years ago, pot and black comes to mind
This did not make sense to me at all. I honestly can’t tell if you and I are on the same page, and I do not mean that as an insult. I’ll just point out that anyone vaguely familiar with my writing for CC should have an idea of just what a non class system supporter I am, especially when it comes to arbitrary things like race and income.
As far as ridiculing others in the back catalogue of CC (as you referenced above), I take responsibility for only my own writing, but I can safely assert that attacking people with our essays is something we contributors just don’t do. Cyberbullying at CC would be pointless and a waste of time for those of us with lives and other ways we could be spending our time and efforts.
Lastly, if you’re a bus-rider, so am I. So there we are.
I think you are definately wearing the wrong trousers there, Wallace.
I only recently found this site and was reading a lot of the past contributions. It was simply my general observation that the US contributors, not specifically your past contributions, have on multiple instances derided European class systems but exhibit the same prejudices at home, in the US the prejudice is mostly about money and race
I didn’t take it that you thought the same way now, but it was there in black and white, people who need to use public transport are losers, if that was a common attitude back a while as well as the sloanian ladder, where is the difference?
A great deal of the class system of Europe is ancient history as I am sure a lot of the US class prejudice is
I’m not sure what you’re getting at. Where have we “derided the European class system”? Certainly we’ve made reference to it, but I don’t remember any derision of it. It’s not really our thing, regardless of whether it deserves deriding or not. Care to give us some examples.
As to your last line, I assume you meant that as a joke?
Chris, I am not some geek who needs to trawl through text or statistics to find evidence to shoot you down. All I can say was that is the impression I got when reading articles on this site, I can’t unthink it just because some didn’t like it.
The one thing that did stick in my mind was something along the lines of “gotta love the British class system” in an article about BMC cars, how can that not be interpreted as anything but sarcastic, was the writer really enamoured of the British class system of 60 years ago? I rather doubt it.
Only half joking on the last sentence, the world is a very imperfect place, class might have been a big thing up to the 1960s, but Europe is much more of a meritocracy these days, we are not hung up about class despite what others might think, it does not crop up in my daily life nor do I hear it in the news.
I have quite enjoyed the articles about European cars though the US perspective on their reliability runs contrary to my experience and came as a surprise.
I agree with you that there is a tendency by US writers to stereotype the British class system. We are an automotive history site, so our writers tend to portray things as they were, rather than how they are now. That comment you quoted was clearly intended to reflect the time when BMC was a thing; that’s obviously long gone. And there’s no doubt that the British class system was largely alive and well at that time, but as I said, it does tend to get a bit stereotyped, meaning there were exceptions already then.
As to the issue of reliability of European cars in the US, I have written much about that subject here over the years. In a nutshell, conditions and expectations in the US were significantly different than in Europe, where cars accumulated significantly less annual mileage and were more willing to service their cars religiously. That led to poor outcomes for the great majority of European imports in the 1950s here, during the great import boom, VW (and a few others) being the exception.
These issues were exacerbated by poor dealer networks, mechanics who did not like working on unfamiliar cars, and parts scarcity. These are key factors that VW recognized already in the 1950s, and having addressed them robustly, it contributed significantly to their success (along with the Beetle being more durable as a product).
And things got worse in the late 60s and 70s, as US-specific emission controls and the US market demand for power accessories and air conditioning complicated matters. These created more complex systems that the cars were not originally designed for, and the European versions generally did not have them, making them simpler and more reliable.
Being originally from Austria and having kept up with the European market and ownership/reliability issues, I understand both sides of this issue. But it can be hard to grasp coming from a strictly European perspective.
And my name is Paul. I’m the owner and executive editor of this site.
The low beltline on the Lincoln looks positively freaky now, but it didn’t work then, either. The perfectly straight character line is just too dang low on the car.
The big Cadillac and Lincoln sedans were the archetypal American luxury cars until the 2000s. They were spacious, comfortable, and impressive looking. After Cadillac and Lincoln introduced their luxury SUVs, the sedans just seemed lacking in the panache, that once characterized the DeVille and the Town Car. I think that like with the Escalade, the Navigator captures the feeling of the earlier big cars. The 2003 Navigator had a new instrument panel and an upgraded interior that seems to me to be “Peak Lincoln.” I prefer the front end with the chrome “Mark style” grille. I’ve had several 50’s, 60’s and early 70’s Cads and Lincoln sedans, but now I think that I want to try a Navigator. I have been wanting a ’51 to ’53 Cadillac, and the Nav reminds me of a modern version of those cars. These SUVs can be decried as being too big, too wasteful, and too indulgent, just like the Devilles and Continentals that preceded them. You will never hear someone say that about an ATS or a MKZ! A practical person would tell me that they don’t make any sense, but as an alternative to a Fifties Model, I think that they do. Especially as a hobby/collector car. I’ve got my eye on a 2003 Navigator and I’m giving it serious consideration.