In our GM DS series, we’ve mainly focused on their products from a market-competitive viewpoint. Obviously, quality issues and the ownership experience were a huge factor too in the demise of the Mark of Excellence. The gen3 Camaro DS had a postscript by an owner who had to take his car back to the dealer 46 times in the first year. That may be something of a record, but I know many of you have suffered through painful GM withdrawal symptoms due to serious issues with the quality, reliability or other aspects of your GM cars. Here’s your chance to share them; hopefully it will be a therapeutic exercise.
My wife had a 1998 Pontiac firefly. It was great on fuel but scary to pass anyone on the highway. She bought it new for $14k CDN. I had all the service done on time according to the manual. One day around 110 000 kms the car overheated and wreaked the head gasket and cylinder head. I couldn’t find anyone to fix it in the small northern Alberta town it broke down in as they were all to busy fixing oil field trucks. Got $200 for it. No more GM vehicles for me since then and even the old air cooled vw vans I used to run could get more mileage before needing a rebuild.
the 98 Firefly was actually a Canadian built Suzuki Swift with a bit of badge engineering applied. usually a robust engine though the head gaskets do fail when over heated. I have seen many of these cars go 300k miles.
My GM experiences have been pretty good. The worst was the typical Northstar V8 headbolt failure in my 97 Deville. I bought the car used and pretty cheap 11 years ago. I knew of the risk but the best information I found suggested this happened to about one third of the cars and could be prevented by proper cooling system maintenance.
It turns out the failure will happen to every Northstar engine eventually, and occurs before the engine wears out or otherwise reaches the end of its lifespan.
The DS occurs because GM never completely solved this problem. Indeed, the most vulnerable engines were built for many years, for their premium brand, all with a known critical defect.
But otherwise, the 20 -odd GM vehicles I’ve had were very reliable and served their intended purpose well.
I had a ’92 Chevrolet Corsica, which I owned for about a year. Oh, where do I begin?
At around 12,000 miles or so, there was a small fire in the fuse box; it melted the plastic access panel which served as its cover.
The plastic wheel covers – styled to look like alloys – were held in place by the lug nuts, which in turn were covered by fake plastic lug nut covers, which were impossible to keep from falling off.
The speakers always emitted an annoying buzzing sound if the radio was cranked more than one-third of maximum volume.
The front passenger seat back would not remain in a fixed position; there was always an inch or so of play in it, so every time I was driving alone and came to a stop, the seatback would rock forward and then slam back into position.
The doors required a substantial tug to open from the outside, and when they shut, they made a clanking, hollow noise.
The paint was awful, particularly on the urethane bumpers.
On the plus side, the 3.1 liter V6 was smooth, peppy and relatively fuel efficient, and the climate control system was excellent.
My family bought mainly GM stuff for years, and I can remember only one car I would call a lemon, and even then only a qualified lemon. It was the 1961 Olds F-85 wagon with the brand new 215 cid aluminum V8. As a tot I remember my parents’ continual problems with overheating. Hindsight says that there may have been a partially blocked cooling passage somewhere, because that car ran on the ragged edge of the red “hot” light whenever the weather got warm. Which was a shame, because my mother really loved the car otherwise.
My own GM experience has been limited, and none of it has been on anything newer than 10-15 years old. The 63 Cadillac’s problems can be chalked up to age/abuse. The 84 Olds 98 suffered a failure of its 200-4R transmission right after I bought it (14 years old, 54K miles) and also from a seemingly unfixable automatic temp control unit.
The 89 Cadillac Brougham (13 years old, 87K miles) had an engine vibration that was persistent. My mechanic was unwilling to recommend spending money on a new harmonic balancer (which I believed to be the culprit) because he was not sure that was it, wondering if it might have been in the transmission. So, pretty minor stuff, and all attributable to old age.
I lost that same transmission in my ’82 Olds 88, and the 307 later suffered an undiagnosed vibration at stop lights – leading me to part with the car.
I’ve only had transmission trouble in two cars, and engine problems in one That 88 single handedly had two of the three issues. The Olds ended up being my last contemporary GM car.
Knowing that the B body was supposed to be among the best GM cars in the ’80s, considering other options from their offerings just wasn’t of interest to me.
A leased 1997 Astro. From day one, problems. Vacuum leak due to factory fuel injection installation without a gasket. Persistent vibration at 60mph. No amount of wheel or drive line balancing remedied. Rattling row 2 and 3 seat backs. Chewed up front tires despite repeated alignments. A/C knobs that fell off in my hand. My left knee constantly hit the power door lock control on moderate bumps. Dealer who treated me as a criminal for having problems from new.
I was sooo excited when the 36 month lease was over. I handed over the van, and promised myself to NEVER subject myself to another GM product…then walked over to the Toyota dealer across the street, where I leased a new Tundra. That was in 2000, and I have purchased a variety of Asian brands since, all of which offered total reliability and great value for money.
The GM vehicles my family owned (a ’67 Beaumont, a ’73 Impala, a ’77 Century and a ’78 Cutlass) weren’t bad cars, but the Impala and the Cutlass had issues. The Impala never had any mechanical issues, but it rusted out in a short time, and we took it off the road in 1980 and junked it a few years later. The Cutlass didin’t rust out, and we kept it for 12 years with no mechanical problems, but it was slow and had very sloppy build quality. We had to take it back to the dealer a few months after we bought it because the paint was flaking off – this on a brand new car. Still, it managed to survive three teenagers learning to drive in it, and I guess the lack of power from the 3.8 V6 could be looked on as a safety feature…unless you were trying to pass something on the highway. My friends and I called it the Gutless. The Century was the best of the bunch. For myself, the ’84 Cavalier I owned wasn’t a bad car. It got me around and was much better built than the Gutless, though it was a bit temperamental until it warmed up, and the shifter for the 5-speed was sloppy. I traded it at 180,000 km for a Nissan King Cab pickup that was a much better built (and running) vehicle. I’ve driven many GM vehicles since, mainly as rentals, and they’re much better than they were. Still, I lean more towards the Japanese cars for quality and reliability. They are generally better cars, and they’ve taught GM and the other domestic makes a lesson, though I’m not sure how well they’ve learned it. I had an Impala this summer for a week, and I really liked it, but I don’t know how well it would hold up in the long run to, say, a Camry or Accord.
My school district’s Drivers’ Ed had two Chevy Ventures and I hated them. Compared to the Family’s 95 Voyager and 05 Sedona they felt tinny and subpart on the roads of Tompkins County. The engine bay was cramped and electrical gremlins reared their heads.
The most effective way to avoid problems with GM vehicles is to never own one.
My first car was a ’53 Chevy. I was 19 years old at the time. (The Chevy was a tank, rugged and gave no problems).
Since then I’ve owned about 110 cars.
Not a single GM among them.
This, simply because style and power (what GM sells) were never high on my list of wants.
You just have to have the right instincts and a DS will never darken your driveway.
Agreed. GM was always good at one thing: sleds. Front engine, rear drive, solid axle sleds. They have never really cared two hoots about anything else in their North American operations, and in fact, now that’s all that is done in North America.
These body on frame vehicles have the same basic architecture as a 1955 Chevrolet. They are cheap to make so they are easy to supersize, and customers lap them up at very high transaction prices. There is tremendous brand loyalty, too.
These anachronistic throwbacks are now called “trucks,” although they rarely seem to haul much more than their owners.
Oh here we go, I’m unreasonably excited to share this.
In late 2014, I needed a capable SUV or truck to tow my track car. Several friends had used the GMT800 Yukon and Tahoe platform and loved it, had nothing but good to say about it. I test-drove a LOT of options and eventually decided on a 2005 Yukon Denali. Rated to pull 8300 lbs or so, built on a shorter Silverado frame, with the 6.0L motor and “slightly stronger” 4L65E trans (versus the 5.3/4L60 in the non-Denali and Tahoe).
I found a gorgeous, one-owner, locally-owned-and-dealer-serviced example a few days after New Years Day 2015. Had 125k on the clock and some recent services performed. I contacted the service department where it was maintained and they sent me all the records – everything had been done by the book, on time. All was well. I bought my (used) trailer shortly thereafter and set off using it as both my DD and Tow Pig. It was great for both for the first couple of months, and then…
Everything on it seemed to wear out at exactly the same time. I replaced literally every piece that made it turn (tie rods wore out, PS lines spewed fluid everywhere, pump burned up, steering box leaked and couldn’t be rebuilt). The rear HVAC completely gave out. One of the door lock actuators failed. The radio would occasionally refuse to power on with the ignition. I replaced the Hydroboost booster as part of the steering system but the brakes were still mushy.
The kicker was that the oil leak I was chasing finally became more of an oil gush. It leaked so much oil that when I moved out of my rented townhome, I had to pay to re-seal the entire driveway because it was eaten away where I used to park this stupid thing. I was chasing the leak for months. Valve cover gaskets, valley pan gasket, a few other odds and ends.
I finally took the truck to my local mechanic and said “Gary, just fix this damn thing.” He called me that afternoon and said “look, we know what you use this for, we know you, and we know what the book value of this Denali is. Go get it washed and trade it in for a newer truck because it’s not worth fixing everything.”
Turns out it needed both oil cooler lines, the oil pan gasket, AND the rear main seal replaced. This was on top of the transmission occasionally slipping into 2nd pretty hard, the center diff of the AWD leaking, and the hard brake lines starting to rust out.
I knew GM had the ignition switch recall. Turns out, they also were subjected to a class-action lawsuit about the GMT800 trucks’ brake lines rotting away. GM got out of the suit, claiming that replacing hard lines every 6 years or so was “routine maintenance on any vehicle” no matter where it lived. Mine were only starting to fail, and I had two friends with Denalis have theirs go out while driving. One had his empty car trailer hooked up to the back. The other one’s wife uses the truck to cart their toddler around every day.
I couldn’t believe the attitude taken by GM as a company about both the ignition switches and the GMT800 brake lines. I’ve owned a lot of old cars (old BMWs, really) that have been in various forms of utter disarray, and none of them have treated me as poorly as my 2005 Yukon Denali.
I’ve got absolutely nothing nice to say about GM as a company after my experience, my friends’ experiences, and the reading I’ve done. My money will never again go to supporting GM.
I traded the Denali in, at night, for a used F-150. The sales manager didn’t even drive the Denali, just commented on how clean it was. I muttered something about how a pickup really fit my needs better and nearly laid a set of elevens as I left the lot in my newly-acquired Ford.
Good riddance.
I bought a new 6 cylinder, 4wd, 3 on the tree GMC Jimmy in 1974. I know – nobody bought this stripper except me. I didn’t even get the optional back seat though I did get an incredibly shabby canvas convertible top. There were a few serious problems which I largely ascribe to youthful abuse but they were all readily and relatively cheaply resolved because it was a GM vehicle and anybody could fix them.
The Jimmy was about 2 years old and still mostly intact when a large nut fell on my feet as I was driving a country back road. I stopped and searched the underside of the dash for a location and was unable to find an obvious spot for it. I got back in and drove off and never replaced the nut with no apparent after effects in the 3 following years I kept it. I never bought another GM vehicle but I still miss that truck.
Actually in that time period GM sold boat loads of i6 powered strippers all through the Southern Sates ~ We’d get them in as bargain priced used cars/trucks, clean them up and re sell them here in Sunny California, some folks looked for these here, not many but they weren’t too hard to sell .
-Nate
1990 Cutlass Ciera. 100,000 KM. 3 sets of inner tie rod ends, 2 sets of ball joints (all Moog), all struts, 2 sets of front tires after it broke the belts, all 3 ignition coils, ignition module, fuel pump wiring, crank position sensor, harmonic balancer, big PCV grommet that blew out several times when it would backfire.
All this in a year.
What a piece of sh!t! Ye Gods.
That is not common on any A-body I have owned, worked on or sold over the years. About the only thing I have seen on this era of A-body cars is an occasional crank sensor on the Buick 3300 V6 or a failed coil pack with high mileage. These are issues that affect many a foreign or Domestic car with age as so many VW owners can claim with loads of failed coil packs on those lovely turbo engines.
I’ve only owned one GM car – a 2001 Vauxhall Corsa with a 973cc, 3 cylinder engine. I only ever had one problem with it – it was rather slow.
Tough call between a 91 z34 with constant alignment issues and a front axle that FELL OFF in traffic. Complete electrical failure and passenger door paint failure. Traded in at 36k.
Or a 98 Montana with the usual 3.4l issues ending in a seized engine at 69k.
A distant third is the 85 s15 jimmy with all its carbureted 2.8 v6 issues.
Yet I took the plunge on a 95 impala ss and loved it despite the crooked rear axle and steering column ignition lock failure. And the mismatched plastics.
5 hondas have been very good to me since then.
As you know, our 1981 Impala with 267 V8 was pretty bad, but the worst was the 1983 Buick Regal.
Dad bought it used after my sister took over his Dodge Colt. The 3.8l V6 with 2.41 rear gears was no barn burner, but at least it cruised nicely on the highway, looked pretty good, and was comfortable to drive.
Then one day the rear wheel had a puddle of brake fluid around it. On disassembly the brake backing plates had rusted until a wheel cylinder had torn out. We fixed it and kept driving. How can you mess up a brake backing plate?
Then one day the rear bumper looked crooked. We checked it out and the whole frame had rusted out behind the rear wheels, which was a common G body issue. The body was holding the frame up, and our mechanic confirmed it wasn’t safe to drive.
Dad never said exactly what he thought about having to send a perfectly good running nice looking car under 10 years old to the scrap yard, but he never bought another GM vehicle, and neither have I.
The A/G-body cars were generally decent cars, but their rust resistance was poor. The same went for the much beloved B-bodies. I like both platforms, but I have owned enough of them to know that it is a never ending battle with rust. Unless you stayed on top of the rust and oil rust proofed the cars, they rusted pretty quickly. Modern designs are vastly better at resisting rust.
That said, my family were early adaptors of rust proofing. Ever since my dad’s almost new ’65 Impala rusted badly, my dad always rust proofed all our cars, and I did the same after I started owning cars. That made a big difference on these cars, and is the reason my brother’s old ’86 Cutlass Supreme is still on the road today.
Interesting comment about the rear frame section rusting out. I don’t know if you’ve ever been up to the Barrie Car Flea market but there used to be a guy that specialized in rear frame repair kits for the ’78-88 A/G-body cars. A friend’s brother had a 80’s Cutlass Supreme and I remember him stopping by the shop with a drooping rear bumper. I knew right away the rear frame was shot and brought the body shop manager to convince him the car was done. We fixed the car enough to get him home but then I later found out he cobbled it together and kept driving the thing for a few more years as it was mechanically solid. He was lucky the MTO didn’t catch him.
Yeah, never been to the Barrie meet but I’ve seen his kits online. Not only is it about 24 years too late 🙂 (the Regal left around 1992) but we weren’t tooled up to do a repair that heavy. It was also Dad’s daily driver and it couldn’t be off the road for weeks / months.
It got replaced by a Mercury Tracer LTS, a vastly superior car in every way…
Sorry, I hope you didn’t think I meant that your Dad should have fixed the frame on the Buick. I just mentioned the frame repair kits to reinforce that these cars had such a rust prone frame that there was a business setup to deal with the problem. The fact is that they were rust prone cars, certainly not as bad as some in the past, but I’d say worse than the average 80’s car. Unless you took preventative measures they rusted quickly in a Canadian environment. The point is, an owner shouldn’t have to take all these preventative measures to avoid that kind of serious corrosion.
From what I can recall about the kit it went beyond the scope of even the average DIYer, requiring serious metal surgery. I am sure those that did invest in fixing the frames were likely owners of more desirable A/G-bodies such as the Monte Carlo SS or Buick GN. It wouldn’t be worthwhile in a DD average car and certainly not a V6 G-body. I haven’t been to the flea market in years, so I am not sure if they website you’re referring to was the same guy.
I own a 1979 Malibu coupe that I have owned since it was new. I had it rustproofed when new and except for the inner bottom of the driver’s door it is pretty much rust free. Here in southern Indiana many of these and their BOP cousins also have the rear frame rust problem. Mine is solid, however, when it was new I noticed that right behind the rear tires are stamped in large oval holes in the frame. Not sure why they are there, but they are in the perfect position to catch all the salt and mud the tires throw off . I have always kept this hollow part of the frame cleaned out and painted inside. Of course it isn’t much of an issue now since I only drive it in dry weather and never in the winter.
I drove numerous A/G body cars through the horrible Winters of Upstate, NY and never ever had either of these issues. Ditto my folks and grand parents. But then I sent my cars through the car wash every now and again which sprayed the undersides. I also hosed out the frame rails once a year as did my parents. Never had any major rust issues with any A/G or B-body car. The same couldn’t be said of most Asian makes of this time era which disintegrated after about 4-5 Winters. It is quite common to still see one of these or a Ford Panther still running around. Ditto the A-body’s, H and G bodies, F-150’s and SIlverado’s and even 90’s Mopar’s with the occasional K-car or stretched variant.
71 Vega…. hands down the worst. Rust, overheating, total engine disintegration within 3 years. No other GM car has come close.
When do we get to see the DS for FoMoCo and Mopar? I remember a number of forgettable cars from those two manufacturers.
While Mopar has had plenty of scares before joining GM in bankruptcy court the writing had been on the wall since the late 70s. Mini vans and the Horizomni prettied up the bottom line but they never had the dominance of GM and merely to have survived from 78-08 shows over those years they did more right then wrong. Lee Iaccoca himself voted for the Aspen/Volare twins as Deadly sin #1
Fomoco for all its problems has not been as close to the drain as the other 2, and even at their nadir were able to pull out on their own. Sins, maybe even felonies, but not deadly ones just yet.
“I remember a number of forgettable cars” Help, my brain hurts!
Ford’s salvation was financial. The company arranged for big lines of credit, and when the crunch came, was able to borrow its way to survival until it could turn things around.
Chrysler had been robbed of its substantial cash resources by Daimler before being cast off (what Daimler really wanted all along was the cash, and to hell with the company, they didn’t want the competition from a strong Chrysler anyway). The Germans didn’t leave enough for the company to survive into the 2008 recession and new owner Cerberus failed to merge another of its subsidiaries, a finance company, into Chrysler Finance…which it kept anyway when letting Chrysler go bankrupt.
My 1979 Fairmont sedan was the deadliest of sins. That car single handedly swore me off from Ford’s until more current. My A-G body cars were far superior in every way save the non roll down rear windows.
>When do we get to see the DS for FoMoCo and Mopar? I
My worst experiences by far have been with AMC/Jeep.
My Chrysler experiences were almost as bad. Ford and GM were better, by comparison.
They’re in the archive, you just have to search for them. I can’t speak for Paul’s sins deadly or otherwise but he does seem to attach a lot of Catholic imagery to GM specifically (Deadly Sins, Saint Mark of Excellence, etc). Maybe it started with Garrison Keillor…
His Deadly sin articles are 90% GM and the rest for Ford and Chrysler or other.
Don’t hold your breath. I’ve had good experiences with my GM cars.
Chevrolets, one Buick and mostly Holdens. My current Commodore has 180,000 Km on it. Other than regular maintaince, its needed one fuel pump.
Engine is original, ditto suspension, and drive line. Oh, I’ve got one rear shock that is weeping oil. Another GM DS! What a POS to need rear shocks at that age & mileage!
I’m so over the never ending recycling of the General’s DS. More repeats here than network TV.
My worst, best, and only GM experience was my ill-fated ’98 Saturn SL2. Gave great commuter service for 42000 miles, then suddenly refused to start one afternoon. Finally convinced it to fire up for a trip to the dealer, who shrugged and said they couldn’t find a problem to fix. Still wouldn’t start reliably at home, though, so I finally gave up. I have problems considering a GM product to this day.
Not sure it was a GM issue…probably previous owner(s) but here is my worst GM car/truck experience:
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/cars-of-a-lifetime/coal-1990-gmc-suburban-out-of-the-frying-pan-into-the-fire/
In retrospect, because of the body mount, and systemic mechanical failures, I suspect this vehicle was in a flood and put back in service. It had a dealer sticker from a part of the state that is flood prone.
1967 Camaro. Base 327, Powerglide.
Left rear axle shaft too long, kept blowing out axle seals and soaking the brake shoes in oil (dealer claimed “wear item not covered by warranty”) until I went in person to the zone office 3000 miles short of warranty expiration and complained, upon which the dealer finally ‘fessed up and did it right.
Engine burned oil at a quart every 300 miles at 40,000 miles.
Carburetor accelerator pump needed replacement of its plunger every 10,000 miles, after that it would hesitate from a stop…first a little, then a lot, then it would stall.
Transmission burned up the high clutches at 30,000 miles. After 12000 miles, from an almost-stop at cross streets, it would start to downshift but slip, then bang into first gear. WHEEE—BANG! Transmission was rebuilt but at 55000 miles it was doing it again.
The left engine mount broke; the rubber-to-metal bonding (read that as GLUE) broke. This caused the engine to tip on acceleration and the throttle linkage would jam open. This was the subject of a GM recall wherein GM used a cable to restrain the engine, but mine was totally broken and replaced by a new design with interlocking parts that limited movement if the rubber bonding failed.
And it wouldn’t have been a very good CAR even if all that stuff didn’t break. GM cars at least were supposed to ride well and be quiet. But this one rode like a buckboard and the thinly padded, slablike seats didn’t help. It was noisy inside. It was cramped in back, rear seat was virtually uninhabitable for more than a few minutes. Ventilation was drafty in the front, nonexistent in the rear. The rear axle on its one-leaf springs hopped on acceleration and hard braking. The front drum brakes overheated in normal driving (California freeways, mostly) and the linings would crack, causing the car to pull sharply to one side as the servo-action of the brakes took hold on the side with the cracked lining.
The Camaro was replaced by a Slant Six Plymouth Valiant Signet, a far better automobile even if slower and not as sleekly styled; it HANDLED better than the Camaro and its ride and seating comfort were far superior.
I had a 1979 Cadillac Eldorado Diesel, too. At least its engine was still running when it was traded. It needed a $25 (1980s price) fuel filter every 5000 miles when it could clog, even though it had a Racor water separator. The vinyl roof shrank from beneath its mouldings. The headliner fell down. The extra-cost Firemist paint flaked. The front end wore out at 24.000 miles…excessive free play in the steering and looseness in the ball joints. But it rode well, was quiet and handled decently.
84 v6 Camaro I had in the early 90s, I replaced the T-5 twice & the rear gears once. I wasn’t too mad about those parts as I was young & hard on it. The worst thing to happen to that car is the frame area at the steering gear box cracked. I guess it was a common issue because of stress and not rust. I put on z-28 sized tires/wheel & sway bars but didn’t get the chassis brackets. The holes were already there for them so I got a pair & had the crack welded up. I liked the car otherwise.
My first new car was a 1976 Cadillac Eldorado Convertible, with every option available except the alarm system and metallic paint. When delivered, the dealer (apparently angry that he had given a $1,600 discount as it was ordered before the “last convertible” mania had begun) just rolled it off the truck and did not prep it. I picked it up in Virginal and drove it about 270 miles home. What a day! But, not quite. A suspension bolt broke, the taillight screws were rusted, cruise control broke, the gas pedal was so abrupt that it was dangerous, the passenger recliner broke, the glass rear window shattered, three tires had to be replaced within 90 days, the paint was unacceptable on a Chevy, etc. I finally wrote to Cadillac and asked for a warranty extension, it was gaining on me! A field rep contacted me and asked me to drop the car off at the dealer. They provided a Seville loaner and kept the car for two weeks. When I got it back, it was perfect, they even Blue Coraled the exterior. It ran and looked great for 80-90k miles. The point was the incredible bad build quality, coupled with the almost cynical interior materials (wood tone contact paper, molded door panels, “wood like” fancy plastic moldings that had mold flashing showing…) finished me with GM for a long, long time.
Here’s a picture of where the crack happens & the reinforcement bracket holes, the brackets should have been on all f bodies.
This is the bracket installed, there was one called the wonder bar that was on Iroc Camaros only. It bolted above the sway bar.
Only GM I ever owned was a ’93 Geo Metro. Not a bad car within its’ limits, but was uneconomical to fix when the balljoints wore out as they were pressed in at the factory and required replacement of the A-arms!
Ford had the same official service procedure for decades, for ball joints. A new ball joint always required a new A arm and bushings.
Of course this did not apply to the aftermarket. Replacement ball joints were widely available that were installed on the existing arms.
have you all noticed that grease zerts are no longer installed on suspension components like they used to be? this is the main reason all these front ends are failing prematurely. every 90’s ford explorer is a squeaky beast because of this. gran marquis and the ford equivalent as well. but all manufactures are guilty, not just ford!
Yes, from the ’60’s through to 2000’s, so many Fords had no grease fittings on key components like ball joints and tie rods. I’ve collected many old RWD Fords and use this as a quick and easy way to tell if front end work has been done.
If the parts have grease fittings, they’ve probably been replaced. No fitting, probably original….. and worn out.
The sealed units tend to last longer on a mileage basis, because they’re just that…sealed. The downside is when they get old, and the grease becomes hard and waxy, they have to be replaced.
I’m surprised the (independent) mechanic I used didn’t know this – I could see scamming for labor but not parts, where’s the profit? I figured that if nothing else Maruti-Suzuki in India must’ve come up with something more field serviceable.
Separate ball joints are going the way of The Dodo, we stock more and more control arms every month. Sure they cost more upfront but you get new bushings and there isn’t a chance the tech won’t bend or break the arm.
One word: VEGA! Need I say more…
I drove a rental Cobalt for a week in Atlanta back in 2008 and spent the entire week fiddling with the seat trying to find a comfortable driving position. My co-worker thought it was hilarious. Another weekly rental in Boston was a Buick Century. When leaving the car if I pushed the lock button on the remote the doors would lock and then immediately unlock. After a few stops I would just shut the door and leave it. The doors were always locked upon return. Was this a feature or was this particular car haunted?
Never owned a GM car myself but drove many company cars and they seemed to handle the abuse better than the other makes. One chevy passenger van exploded it’s alternator and the shrapnel took out the rad and valve cover. That same van would eventually crack it’s block. Another caprice wagon was returned at the end of lease with it’s engine in pieces in the back of the car. Threw a rod from lack of oil and no maintenance in 100K km A Lumina sedan met the same fate for exactly the same reason. Those cars were never assigned to me but occasionally I was given them to drive the car pool and there were a few times I refused to drive them due to the poor condition of the brakes/tires.
A couple of memorable family member owned cars were the Quad 4 that developed a rod knock at 221K km and a sunbird 1.8 ohc that rounded it’s cam lobes a couple of times. Then there was the 2.8 Crapalier that siezed up from no oil. “What do you mean by check the oil?” “What do you mean change the oil? What’s wrong with the oil that’s in it?” Some how it was my fault they drove them til dead never having opened the hood for years. Can’t fix stupid.
Two similar stories, First one, my mechanic had an engine in pieces on his bench, looks at me and says, “3 yr old corvette, (this was 1976) 55,000 miles, never checked the oil”. Second one, my younger sister, 1982 Cavalier, wouldn’t start, I checked the dipstick…only oil on the very tip of the stick, and it was like tar. She bought it new, it had 22000 miles on it and never bothered to check the oil. She was very lucky that the engine responded to an oil change with no apparent damage.
1968 Buick: Well assembled, but defects were designed in from day 1.
As long as it did not rain or there was no traffic was OK.
Cooling system for 350 engine was only 12 Quarts, 1/2 to 2/3 the size in other GM 350 V8s and would overheat every time was stuck in bumper to bumper traffic for more than 15 minutes. Because there was no overflow tank the boiling coolant would flow onto the ground and then to have the car run again when cooled down needed to add fluid to radiator.
Distributor was in the front of the engine and it and the plug wires would get wet and water would soak into the contacts if it rained and the car would not start in the morning if it had rained the night before. Had to use a can of a spray to dry distributor and wires to enable the car to start.
1968 was the first year of coolant recovery system on GMs and it was exclusive to Buick that year. It should have had one. It was ballyhooed to the moon on their TV
ads.
I guess I can add my two cents to this love fest. My last GM car was purchased used with only about 25,000 miles on it. A ’94 Cadillac Seville STS. it was purchased in 1996 and at 27.000 dollars it is still the most expensive car I have ever bought. It was a great looking, driving, spacious car. It was pretty good for the first 50-75 k, then the problems started coming quickly. The engine main seals started leaking oil. A couple of starters, radiators, rear leveling and a/c failure. At the end, the body, paint and especially the interior were still beautiful but I was just tired of it. I sold it for 1.600 dollars with 132k on the odometer. I was disappointed that GMs flagship really wasn’t built to hold up to the long haul. Hence I haven’t lusted after any Cadillac newer then 1979. I know that I owned it long enough (about ten years) for it to become just an old car. I don’t think that we will see many modern cars on the road, restored, fifty years from now. Cars are just too complicated and expensive to fix once heavy depreciation has set in.Still most new cars will provide up to 150,000 miles to the original owner. Can’t say that about cars built in the 50s and 69s.
Having only owned 2 GM products (a ’93 Century and a ’55 Chevrolet 210), my ownership experience is limited to the annual brake job on the Century. Otherwise, no big whoop.
However, I’ve driven a ton of GM products that were in fleet service. None were breathtakingly bad, but they did leave one scratching their head:
The ’07 Silverado (current assigned vehicle). Ball joints wore out faster than on a Ford and the clock resets itself to 12:00 on any sort of whim. I’ve put 62,000 miles on it in 3.5 years; the dash has started to crack within the past year or so.
Impalas with horrible alignment from the factory.
G-Series vans that seemed put together with spit, hope, and bailing wire.
Overall, I cannot say I’ve had any horrible experiences with GM products, just some befuddling experiences.
My family has probably owned more GM products than any other brand. I can say though that we really haven’t had a bad GM car between my parents and my siblings. That said, my family is generally made up of people with an above average knowledge of cars, and we all knew which GM’s to avoid. Even those in my family that aren’t as car savvy always seek advice from those that are.
That said, I did work at GM dealership for some time starting in the 1990’s, and I saw some horrible vehicles there. I think the worst car I remember was a Cadillac Catera. It was years ago now, so I don’t recall the exact problem the car was having, but I do know that the head mechanic tried numerous times to repair it but couldn’t get the car right. We eventually called a GM field engineer who worked with our best techs but after numerous attempts and hours of labour the car was deemed unrepairable and GM bought the car back from the owner. I also recall the diesel tech in our shop saying that the 6.5L diesels would put his kids through college. We swapped out more of those engines than any other, and they weren’t overly common. The FWD Cadillacs of this era were generally problematic and most techs called them Cadil-scrap for good reason. The lower end FWD cars, like J-cars and L/N cars were just poorly made and assembled with cheap parts.
My last GM ( I’ve owned five ) was an 8-year old used 95 Chevy Lumina sedan. Everything worked when I got it except the AC, which I had fixed immediately. By the time I sold it 14 months later the white paint started peeling on the roof and hood, the parking brake cable broke ( a common occurrence — you could the cable hanging low on the majority of old Luminas ), tie rods needed replaced, replaced the alternator, several dash lights went out, the front passenger side power window stopped working, then the rear drivers side power window stopped working. When the driver’s power window stopped working, I unloaded it for $500. Haven’t owned GM since.
Biggest piece of sh!t I’ve ever owned, and I had 78 Cutlass that needed a new diff, had the shifter fall off, and rusted above the rear side window at 8 years old and less than 60k miles, which always left a nice pool of water in the rear passenger footwell after a rain.
I had a 2010 Cobalt LT and that was the last GM product I’d ever buy new. Complete junk is an understatement for that piece of scrap, automatic transmission went out very early (I think around 67000 miles). The ignition switch had “the issue” even though gm initially claimed the 2010’s were not affected. Ate tires pretty often too and the interior quality was ghastly compared to my early 90’s Corolla. Even the mileage wasn’t spectacular, at least the AC was cold! I’d take a mid 90’s Cavalier over a Cobalt any day though. You can pick up Cobalts at true value now (nothing) lol.
The steering shaft on my 2007 Cobalt LS went bad at 8,000 miles and ten months old. That one had me shaking my head.
My personal worst GM car was a 1986 Pontiac 6000-STE, I bought it used at 13 years old and 90,000 miles.I promptly blew up the 2.8 v6 at a heady 55mph and 3500 rpm. It then needed shocks (including fixing the self-leveling feature), struts, brakes, power steering lines, A/C compressor, reupholster the front seat, replace all the speakers (blown, not because I wanted to have a killer stereo) repaired the factory radio to retain the steering wheel controls, fuel pump. It was starting to need a rack, and cradle mounts, ball joints, and a bunch of other little things. I sold it with 120,000 miles on it and two years later.
Family worst was a tie between the 1984 Olds Delta 88, and sis’ 94 Olds Achieva. Both died mechanically long before their time with neither one making 140,000 miles. The Delta 88 ate 3 TH-200 transmissions and one valve. the underAchieva, well, the infamous Quad OHC timing chain issues kept cropping along with various modules dying. The 92 LeSabre was initially a lemon, but proved itself after the warranty ran out – it was flawless. Under warranty, it had to be towed to the dealer about 4 times, after that, it was the proverbial swiss watch.
Anything with a 4T65E! My wife drove a 2000 Century and a 2004 Impala, both with the 3100/3400 engine, and at a certain mileage, the transmission would shift harshly into all gears after about a half hour of driving.
In the Impala, I installed a shift kit, and it mostly solved the problem. Apparently, when the transmission gets some miles on it and slips a bit, the computer jacks line pressure up to maximum, and every gear change is HARSH. Since the shift kit speeds up shifts, the computer never gets the message to jack up line pressure. When the transmission shifts hard, it also emits a whining noise whenever you accelerate. I hear cars with 4T65Es whining all around town to this day. Even when I traded it in, the Impala would still hang in “neutral” at a stop and slam into gear as the engine revved up (yes, the fluid was full).
Anyway, lots of people on the internet seem to have this problem, but with two cars in a row with the same issue, I’ll never buy anything with that transmission again. I can’t believe they never fixed that problem in five model years (and probably longer!).
There are Sonix repair kits for this issue on the aftermarket along with several others. We had a few 2000-2001 cars go through our dealership with this issue and a good transmission service and some Trans X bought the customer several years before the pressure solenoid had to be replaced.
I would take a 4T65 or any Ford or Chrysler junk Ultra-drive in these years.
Saturn Ion. Twice. We purchased a new Ion and it was ok except for the lousy seats and the super irritating automatic door locks. Until the check engine light came on for the evap system. The dealer tried 3 times to fix it and even brought in their specialist to no avail. We asked for an identical replacement car and got one, after a few weeks, the same problem arose. Lemon law attorney and a trip to Toyota solved the problem. I was beside myself to see that the General had fallen so hard. I’ve been working on an ’03 GMC 1 ton Duramax and am ready to burn a few engineers and bean counters at the stake. What a lousy excuse of a vehicle.
I can’t say they were mine, but my boss of 8 years wife’s 87 Sedan ‘d Ville and my dad’s 88 Suburban were complete junk. I called ’em “below horrible”. I was indeed a eye witness to their many problems. And I personally picked both of them up at the various dealer’s they were sent to a few times as well. Boss’s wife didn’t leave GM but purchased one of the Olds 98’s that inspite of being blandly designed turned out to be quite reliable. Identical to the one from a couple of CC’s ago. My dad went back to Ford. My family were not import buyers. Even though by then most were made here. My dad was an old fashioned midwest union guy. Our other GM vehicles were ok, like my dad’s 69 Chevy C10 ( owned from 69 to 81) and their 91 Corvette held up pretty well. So no other real DS disasters to speak of.
An Isuzu hombre was my first new vehicle. It wasn’t that bad of a truck overall, but the dealership experience for warranty service was terrible. From the time I bought it, it had this issue with the front lugnuts…they would loosen and the wheels would make a clicking sound. I’d tighten them, and they’d loosen themselves in about 500 miles. So I took it to the dealer. 5 times. The last time I took it in, I may have been an asshole. So, they fixed it, by swapping the sae lugnuts for the next size smaller metric version and impacting them on. I didn’t find out about it until I had a flat and couldn’t get them loose. So, anyway, I’ve not bought a new GM since, and won’t again.
FYI,
My father worked for the Oliver rubber company back in the ’50’s. They made the rubber body sealing gaskets, window and door seals used by the big three. He told me that GM spec’d the cheapest rubber available while Ford and MoPar used better grades.
The only GM car which I have ever owned was a ’69 Chevelle which was ten years old at the time. The interior stunk of mildew (due to numerous interior leaks and the trunk would fill with bucketfuls of water every time it rained. I have never experienced the level of body leakage in any other brand of car that the Chevy did.
I can vouch for GM water leaks. A 68 Chevy Biscayne, a 70 Impala, and a 70 Pontiac Catalina, all leaked around the back windows and trunk. They all stunk like mildew too. Ah, the good old days with the rose colored glasses off.
My grandmothers (which I own now) 74 Impala stayed rust free until just 2 years ago. Then just like magic, the rear window channel started disappearing. I’m barely keeping on top of it. But at least the rest of it is holding together.
Interesting. This might explain why my various 70s and 80s G-van’s door seals were shot/torn/missing before they reached 9 years of age, but my Fords have excellent original seals at 40 years.
Hi Paul,
I have had very positive and rewarding experiences with the GM cars that I have owned.
The 55, 56, 57, 58, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 67, 68, 70, 75, 79, 81, 82, 84, 85, 86, 93, 95, and 96 Chevy BelAirs, Impalas, Rivieras, Buick Elektras, Pontiac Parisienne Broughams, and Safari Wagons and Roadmaster Limited Wagons have been great cars. I am still driving my 65 Impala SS convertible, my 1985 Safari Wagon, my 1986 Parisienne Brougham, my 1993, 1995 and three 1996 Roadmaster wagons. One of my 1996 Roadmaster Limited wagons was featured in a Curbside Classic Post last year. My success is due to keeping with the cast iron Chevy drive trains with rear wheel drive. The Roadmasters have 225k-275k and look showroom new. My economic equation with cars is based on spending no more than ten cents per amortized mile. The only cars that I have that equal the GM longevity are my Volvo 740, 940, 960 and V90 wagons which are capable of 350k miles and have been driven same.
I enjoy reading your posts. Gary
Well, there was the 69 Camaro with the 307 and the 3 speed auto – 2 years newer than G. Poon’s 67 described above, but with the exact same problems – broken motor mounts and broken rear leaf springs. However the car that guaranteed I would never considering buying a GM car actually belonged to a Japanese guy working at my wife’s company. He was only going to be in the States for a couple years with his company and wanted a new (1989) Z-28 “ because I’ll never have another chance to own one“. I helped him buy one; He was shocked at how crudely and how cheaply built it was and how old fashioned (solid rear axle? Really?) it was. He liked driving it though. However right at 12,100 miles the right front wheel bearing failed. In those days, GM still only offered a one-year 12,000 mile warranty. So, when we went to the dealership, the first answer was “Tough luck, buddy“. Embarrassed for America in front of my Japanese friend, I spoke to the Service Manager and he came through with a free repair. However, he solved the problem, by lying to General Motors and reporting the mileage as 11,100 rather than 12,100 because otherwise they wouldn’t pay for the repair. This was a clear message for me that GM as a corporation had absolutely no intention of standing behind their products beyond the absolute minimum required. Either the Service Manager had no “Good Will” budget from them, or he had already burned it up on similar problems. Either way, GM clearly didn’t give a damn.
At the same time, I was driving an Acura Integra with a 4-year, 50K mile warranty, and had recently had my muffler replaced at the 15,000 mile service. Oddly I hadn’t noticed any problem and hadn’t asked for even an examination of the exhaust. I just happened to notice it was listed as warranty work on my invoice -no charge. Of course though, I asked the Acura Service Manager about it, and was told “we noticed some rust spots and that shouldn’t happen on a car with 15,000 miles, so we replaced it.”
Guess which company left the impression that they really wanted me as a repeat customer, and which obviously didn’t give a hoot?
Worst- 95 quad4 alero. Alternator, lower control arms rusted out, atf fluid leak, oil leaks,,,cheap shit interior, It rode like garbage…punishing ride and the 4t60e transmission would up shift as fast as possible andthe quad4 would start bucking at 45mph. Then it lost gears 3 and 4. I hated it so I drove it for a year with 2 gears till it shit the bed.
Then my next car 3800 powered regal was a gem as far as reliability, fuel economy and power goes. It had the same transmission with the same shift points so it could handle 4th gear with the torque of the 3800. That’s how cheap gm was. They wouldn’t even reprogram the shift points for the 4t60e trannys in the 4 bangers.
Not mine but it would probably be my Dad’s Tahoe that he special ordered in 1997 and the transmission died with 400 miles on it…Hasn’t stopped him from buying another one as he’s on Tahoe number 4 but this may be the last…one of his daytime running lights is out and apparently the bumper needs to be removed to replace it or something ridiculous though that’s not his reason for switching cars. Or I can’t forget my Grandparent’s early 1980s Regal Sedan that wouldn’t start due to an ignition switch issue but that may have been due to age…I remember waiting in a Publix parking lot in Tampa for many hours for someone to come and fix it…Just remembered that my mom had a ’81 Century Wagon (bought new) that had a serious overheating issue for most of the time we owned it. A Vega Estate Wagon was traded in for the Century Wagon…My family has owned a lot of questionable cars from many brands yet we’ve never said…”I’m never going to buy another (insert name here)”. My personal GM experiences have all been in rental cars. Probably my least favorite GM rental car would be a Buick Encore…slow and felt like it would tip over, switched it out for a Verano. However, I’ve recently rented a 2016 Cruze and 2 2016 Malibus and would choose them over a Corolla or Camry any day.
My dad’s 75 Electra Limited coupe dying during a return trip on a fishing expedition to Maryland. The transmission. Dad always said GM’s Hydra-Matic was tempramental. It died a couple of more times before he died, and my mom traded it in for a brand new 85 Buick Regal Limited Coupe.
Interesting considering the 1985 Regal would have come with the Metric 200 transmission which was known to be weak and the 75 Electra would have had one of the best transmissions available at the time GM’s THM 400.
Surprisingly my worst GM car was not the Vega I owned for a few years in the seventies. Sure, it had its share of problems but I was young enough then that they didn’t really bother me that much. I had grown up working on my cars to keep them mobile and was still willing to put in some labor on the Vega.
Instead, the worst GM car I’ve owned was a 2001 Pontiac Grand Prix GT, purchased new from Wright Pontiac-Cadillac here in Evansville. I mention the dealer’s name as my experiences with the dealer contributed to my dissatisfaction. The Grand Prix (with the 3800 V6/AOD combo) actually was not a bad car to drive; it was reasonably peppy, got decent gas mileage and the front seats were comfortable. The problem was that the GP snacked on power steering pumps, requiring a new one every 6-7 months. I don’t know if this was some sort of design flaw or something unique to this car but every six months or so it was the same thing, the power steering pump would begin to squeal and you knew it was time for a new one. Needless to say I got to be on a first name basis with the service manager and service writers at the Pontiac dealer. The process was always the same, I would drop the car off on my way to work, pick up a rental car, and then wait for the late afternoon phone call telling me that I needed a new power steering pump. This was always a two day process as the dealer didn’t have a replacement power steering in stock and one had to be “shipped in”. After the third or fourth time I asked the service manager why they couldn’t keep at least one power steering pump in stock and take a day off the process. I was told that management wouldn’t let them do that.
When the extended warranty ran out after five years the Grand Prix only had about 42,000 miles (I hadn’t even had to buy new tires) but there was no way I was keeping the car and be out of pocket every six months for a new power steering pump. I traded it away for a Toyota Solara and have not been tempted by a GM product since. Oh yes, sort of an addendum, when GM axed the Pontiac brand they pulled the Cadillac and GMC franchises from this dealer and reassigned them to the local Buick store. The company is still in business selling used cars.
My guess would be a misaligned PS pump mount or bracket. The service advisor should have addressed this issue under warranty instead of mindlessly authorising repeated pump replacements.
Oh, I agree, and I’m pretty sure that I mentioned this to him, at least once or twice. Like many people he took the path of least resistance and hoped the problem would go away. In a sense it did because I traded the car for something else and never darkened their door again. In retrospect I wonder why someone at GM didn’t begin to question all of the pump replacements (all under warranty) and push back at the dealer.
Very few techs take the time to flush the steering system when they replace components, same as after a compressor grenades, the crap floating around the system ruins the new pump.
_THIS_ ~ NAPA has a nifty power steering filter that has a magnet inside it for just this purpose ~ you install it in the return hose and presto ! all the crap is filtered out, all you needs do is change the fluid once or twice until it remains clear and sweet smelling and you’re god to go .
Lazy Mechanics piss me off .
-Nate
Same with transmission coolers! Flush that thing out when you replace/rebuild a transmission or you’re asking for more of the same.
That was obviously an alignment issue that the dealer should have caught. We have seen 1000’s of cars go through my buddies dealership with this same exact power-train combo and never heard of this before.
Except for the power steering issue the Grand Prix was not actually a bad car. I refuse as a matter of principle to buy a four door vehicle for my personal use. As time goes by there are fewer and fewer two door cars available, at least in my price range. The 2001 Grand Prix coupe was stylish (except for the lower body cladding that Pontiac slathered on most of their cars then), comfortable and reasonably pleasant to drive. It was not a hot rod by any stretch of the imagination but it would keep up with traffic and would also return 30-32 MPG at 75 MPH. As long as I wasn’t paying for the repairs the mild inconvenience of being without the car for a couple days every six months was not a big deal.
I have not really been tempted to purchase any GM car since then. I did look at the revised Camaro when it first came out but was not impressed; the seating position was so low that it reminded me of the driver’s compartment of an M60A3 tank. I honestly can’t think of any current GM vehicle that even remotely interests me.
That’s easy, 2005 Chevy Equinox.
My family bought the Chevy Equinox on Labor Day weekend 2004, we had a 1996 Chevy Blazer that was getting a bit old and tired, but it was having problems and my mom wanted a new car. She liked the Equinox, it was the size that she wanted, it had enough room for all of us and friends, so we bought it.
Now, most of the problems I can remember went to that car being past its sell by date. It had transmission problems with it slipping out of gear, the leather seats cracked and wore badly, it was developing squeaks and rattles. Coolant managed to get into the engine one time, and once we moved back to San Diego, not a day went by where the car wasn’t at the dealership for some issue.
On top of that, it wasn’t just very good. The Blazer we had may have been older, cruder, and not as refined, but I remember it feeling better than the Equinox. The car wasn’t powerful, it wasn’t comfortable, it had a terrible HVAC system, the interior was still pretty cheap looking, it didn’t get very good gas mileage for a crossover, and everything seemed like accountants played fast and loose with slashing stuff to save a buck.
Amazingly, the car lasted 200k miles for a long time, finally meeting it’s end when my sister got into a car accident it in, totaling the front end and putting in end to the giant gold menace. My sister replaced it with a 2001 Subaru Forester, and while I have my gripes with that car, it didn’t feel like the penalty box that the Equinox was.
Of course, it is highly ironic that you posted this today. Considering that as I was driving my friend home, the engine to my Cadillac ended up overheating on the highway and I needed to call AAA to get it towed for a diagnostic. Hopefully, there’s nothing expensive and terrible that needs to be solved, but the fact that I stood in the rain for a good half hour while waiting for the truck isn’t how I wanted to spend my weekend.
Your almost 20 year old Northstar overheated and you “hope that there’s nothing expensive and terrible that needs to be solved”?
Bwah ha ha ha ha!
Oh dear. I’m sure Joseph knows the risks and is putting an optimistic spin on this. Unlike most of us he does not have transportation alternatives.
Cars will overheat for other reasons so his optimism is reasonable.
Good luck Joseph…please keep us informed.
Well, I got it back today. Thankfully, the overheating wasn’t caused by something wrong with the engine, and there was no damage sustained to it. The bad news was that my radiator had busted, which required a replacement as well as a coolant flush, combined with a new battery it was a 1K repair job. The car’s fine now, and it doesn’t look like there’s any more problems so far (He says as he crosses his fingers and prays to Henry Leland’s ghost that nothing goes wrong a month or two from now.)
Glad you are safe Joseph. Sorry it cost you $1,000. Hopefully, the car will be good for a while.
We’ve owned 5 GM cars and while three were junk, two were rock solid:
76 Cutlass – bought with 110k miles for $400. Got another trouble-free 50k miles out of it before it died during a cold winter when I was reluctant to go out and check the oil frequently enough.
95 Saturn SL2 – bought new. Got 200k trouble-free miles out of it before we sold it to some numbnuts who quickly destroyed it through neglect.
As for the junk:
83 Malibu – Think it had the 3.8 V6. Bought with only 60k miles but never ran right, was super slow and wouldn’t start if you let the gas tank get below half. Fortunately it was stolen and destroyed a few months after we bought it.
83 Century Coupe – 3.0 V6. Slow and guzzled gas. Bought it at 65k, lost the transmission at 80k. Car was in good shape otherwise so got it rebuilt. Then a month later the engine self-destructed. Had a factory sunroof that constantly leaked.
96 Cierra wagon – bought it with 30k miles. Had a front end shimmy nobody could seem to fix. Within a year the interior started falling apart and the windows would fall out of their tracks. Once it hit 60k it would break down every six months like clockwork and require a $300-$600 repair. Destroyed in a car accident at 90k. I got $4000 from the insurance company and used it as a downpayment on a Honda Odyssey. It’s been Honda and Toyota ever since and the difference is mind-boggling — I never fully appreciated how insultingly terrible GM cars were until I owned something better. It’s like GMs sole goal in designing a car was to deliberately make it into a big “f_ck you” to their customers.
Those Buick 3.0 carbureted V6’s were junk. Built between 1982-1985 they were essentially a higher revving 231 V6 built for transverse mounting. Why they bothered making this engine when the Chevy 60 degree 2.8 was not only smoother and quieter it was also much longer lasting in these light weight A-body cars is just another mystery of GM.
I can attest to them being junk. I had a 1984 Buick Century Limited Coupe with the infamous 3.0 V-6. Three engine rebuilds in 70k and I was done. I liked the Century itself so much that I bought an ’87 with the 3.8 SFI V-6. One of the best cars I ever owned!
I liked my Century too, apart from the mechanical issues – my first 2-door car, first car with power windows and door locks, cushy velour seats, and the huge sunroof could be taken out and, with the windows down, practically made the car into convertible.
Also, I think you and I have had this same conversation here before…
Yes we did some years back! My sunroof leaked like a waterfall too!
My worst experience came from a car which is not a true GM car but belongs to its galaxy, namely a korean-built Chevrolet Spark.
I rented one when I was going to the family hometown in Corsica.
Driving a small manual underpowered car in Corsica is a big fun : you push the engine, make quick downshifts and upshifts, cut through curves, making your own private rally run.
Well, the Spark was just a big bore. Engine was buzzing like a vacuum cleaner, reluctant to gain RPM, the gearbox was uninspiring, the electrically assisted steering has an arcade-style feeling and the brakes were kind of on/off. No way to do your own ramly with that car.
All in all, it was one of the most uninspired car I’ve ever driven, a true appliance. Exactly the opposite of sparkling. Calling it a Chevrolet Dull would have been closer to reality.
Also had a 81 V6 Chevrolet Malibu. I loved that car but I reckon it has the worst built-quality I’ve ever seen, much worse than french cars of that era (whose bad built-quality is notorious), nearly entering Lada territory…
On the other hand, I’ve been the owner of 79 Caprice for 3 years. Except for some initial troubles caused by a long period of immobilisation, I’ve done 40.000 km without major trouble. Not bad for an almost 40 yo car.
Worst: 1998 Jimmy I bought new. Repeatedly cut off, sometimes on the highway at 65mph. Sometimes in traffic. Very dangerous, obviously. Ignition switch replaced twice under warranty but it kept happening. Traded it for a new 2001 4Runner and never owned another GM anything ever again.
Best: 1990 Century I bought slightly used in grad school. It was cheap and comfy. Kept it in good shape but drove it well over 100,000 miles. Got what I paid for it as a trade in value. No joke. “Free” miles. Not one thing broke or failed.
I love the A-body cars. At least if they are 1984 and newer without the Buick 3.0 2BBL V6. We still have customers coming in asking for one, especially the wagons with he bullet proof 3300 Buick motors.
I had a Cierra wagon with the 3.1 V6 and it was decidedly non-bulletproof.
The 3.1 60 degree V6’s have a reputation for being troublesome. Theoretically, they shouldn’t be, but they are.
The fuel injected 2.8L in my 1988 Beretta GT should have theoretically been as bulletproof as the carburetted version in my 1981 Citation. But it wasn’t.
The Beretta was the biggest piece of garbage GM car I ever owned. The 1991 Saturn SC2 I replaced it with was the best, hands down.
Our 95 Saturn SL2 was our best GM product.
I’ve owned and regularly driven four GM products.
1966 Pontiac Tempest four door – the OHC6 was already dead when I got the car, so I swapped in a SBC. It was fun, but I only kept it about a year and sold it to have a down payment on a Suzuki Samurai. It was pretty reliable as I remember.
1971 Chevrolet Vega sedan – easily had the most problems with this car, but it’s also still the one I would rank first or second as cars I’ve liked best. Being my first, I learned to wrench on it, and it had over 220K miles when I used it as a trade-in. Handled great, even after the heavier Buick V6 swap.
1982 Chevrolet Cavalier Type 10 hatchback – two main problems come to mind with this car. First, the Used dealer did not disclose prior body damage (my first purchase at a dealer), and the smog pump siezed at around 90K miles. I fixed it with a shorter v-belt (bypassed it, in other words). Yes, it was buzzy and slow to build speed, but it handled like it was on rails (I did a bunch of mods). Another fun car, despite its unrefined nature.
1987 Chevrolet Spectrum four door sedan – this rebadged Isuzu was about as uninspiring a vehicle as one can imagine. Its draw for us was that it had four doors and we were expecting our first child. Drove 33K miles in one year, by which point it was a rattling, oil-leaking mess. It would be replaced with an ’89 Honda Civic Hatch, and was the last (purchased*) GM product to soil my driveway.
*I also had possession of my deceased paternal grandmother’s ’77 Nova four door for a few months before selling it for my Dad.
Tempest.
Vega notchback.
Like, Ed. More rear seat room as well. Still good looking after all these years.
As the owner of a 4.1 Buick V6, i’ve wanted a Vega for the transplant. Alas, everyone with a Vega assumes your going to SBC it into a drag car so Vega’s have become horribly overpriced. Amazing considering it was a worse (usually) car than a Pinto which are still (sometimes) available for a fair price.
Cavalier Type 10.
Sputum, er, Spectrum.
What else but a new ’72 Vega! Fortunately I had a front row seat to observe this fiasco but didn’t own the turd. My future ex-wife tolerated this heap for 18 months and that was it. The disaster by which all others are judged.
My Saturn ion. This is maybe my 8th or 9th gm vehicle, and ironically the most expensive car I had, purchased for $4400 cad when it was seven years old. Every suspension component, many of them twice or more, THREE manual transmissions, (each time its been deemed to be output shaft bearings, not that I’ve ever run it dry, and there are certainly no mods putting too much power down, oh no….) An appallingly cheap interior, and an intermittent no start problem that meant many tow truck rides before shorting out the clutch switch (with a paperclip).
It lacks any fun to drive feeling, save for the fact that I’ve resigned myself to the fact that I will be the final owner, and can treat it accordingly.
I think much of the Opel engineering was well done and I love the smooth and efficient ecotec engine, but the plastic body panels and generally low quality mean this will likely he my last gm vehicle. Shame, too, as I want to like general motors products.
I can say, amen, Alexis. But the polymer panels [an asset] and strong engine and trans [automatic] are the biggest positives of my 05 ION.
Ironically, I’ve have only had out of pocket expense on the 2nd set of sway bar bushings at 64,000 miles.
The rest was covered under warranty, recall and extended recall. GM lost a lot of money on warranty costs. It’s no wonder they can’t make money on small cars.
BTW: GM gave itself a Boss Kettering Award in 2002 for that POS “low draw” ignition switch.
After 11 years it finally works as well as the one in my 63 Valiant. Now that it’s fixed I think I’m good for another 11 years and 65,000 miles.
The worst experience ? .
Waking up just before hitting a light standard in my sweet 1964 Chevelle four door sedan .
The light standard embedded itself into the passenger side firewall, neatly shearing off all the 230 CID i6’s accessories as it went .
I nearly died, I still wish I hadn’t ruined that fine little car =8-( .
-Nate
1982ish Buick Skylark (X). I got roped into cat-sitting for a teacher in high school, in return for use of this pile.
Outwardly it looked okay, it had a plush interior. Except my ass sank right through the fetid seats and into a sharp hunk of metal. (And before anyone asks, I was beanpole-mode back then.) And the brakes, fuck the brakes. It had the rear lockup issue in spades, but fortunately the engine was so ineffective it was difficult to get any speed up. Plus gas was leaking somewhere so the car stunk whenever you stepped on it, which was most of the time. Maybe that’s why the entire interior felt sorta greasy.
Easily the worst car I’ve ever driven, and that’s in comparison to some pretty primitive trucks.
But in terms of sheer disappointment, one time a rental agency gave me a free “upgrade” to a 2004 Chevy Monte Carlo. I don’t know what GM was thinking when they came up with this thing. It wasn’t sporty in any way. The interior was so basic and substandard there’s no way you could spin it as Personal Luxury. And the retro-themed styling was WTF, these two things do NOT go together. It was obvious at that point that GM was in financial difficulties, and mail-it-in efforts like that Monte Carlo just convinced me that GM was doomed and DNGAF.
Most of my company vehicles over the last 35 years were GM models, many of them on the DS list. None, not one, was problematic despite 30,000 miles a year and often running over 100,000 miles.
My personal vehicles were another matter. A 1984 Mustang GT that blew up its rear end at 10,000 miles and then again at 20,000. A1987 Honda Accord whose drivers side window shattered on its own, whose poor weatherstripping over the windshield allowed wind to buffet the car roof in deafening harmonics, and whose wipers detached at the first contact with snow. How about a 2001 Mercedes CLK 430 that went into limp home mode every time I took it out until I contacted M-B to get it fixed.
I could go on about the expensive and temperamental pieces of crap I’ve owned that were in the shop while I drove my plebeian GM deadly sin around without incident, but what’s the point? The DS list seems to be your raison d’etre.
My MGB’s driver’s-side window also shattered spontaneously, luckily while it was rolled down. Was it thermal or mechanical stress? I’ll never know.
Rear end failures on V8 Foxes were common due to the spindly 7.5″ ring gear.
The 8.8″ came out in ’86 and was much stouter.
Ive only owned 4 cars from the General, and they’ve been pretty good cars:
A ’77 Grand Prix that Ive had since 1989 that I’m (still) restoring went to 201K miles on the original Pontiac 350 and TH400 (It now has a new 455 and rebuilt transmission)
In high school I had an ’80 Firebird and I swapped the original 231 V6 for a 455. It was a good, fun, fast car until I wrecked it.
I had a ’78 Trans Am W72 400/4 speed for 4 years with that just turned 100K that was developing a rod knock when I rebuilt it but otherwise a fine car.
I have an ’84 Delta 88 with 77K on it; the original 307 and weak-link TH200 still work fine and car is very well built. I see a drivetrain upgrade in its future though.
My fiancé has an ’02 Saturn coupe with 260K on it and refuses to get rid of it.
With a 25-year career in the military and law enforcement, Ive driven dozens, if not hundreds of Suburbans and Tahoes, Caprices, FWD Impalas, full-sized vans, and various other fleet vehicles with no horror stories. My current issued vehicle is a 2011 Tahoe; its not the fastest, most comfortable, best built ride Ive ever had but it does what I need it to do.
I guess my closest association with a GM turd was a 1983 Buick Riviera that my Dad bought new. It had the 4.1L V6 and went through at least 3 transmissions that I’m aware of, plus it threw a rod at 70K miles despite his taking meticulous care of it. It was a great looking lemon.
I had several terrible Fords though.
Funny & coincidental this topic came across my news feed today! I’ve owned & maintained my entire family’s cars myself, my entire life. 5 out of 30 cars were GM.
Too many bad experiences to list.
At the moment, I am looking to buy a newer used vehicle for my wife.
Just this morning, I wrote in a text:
“Jeep= I will NOT buy any newer Jeep, period. (My bro’s 2006 has left him stranded 6 times due to electrical gremlin that puts vehicle into “limp mode” & has been at Dealership 1/3 of the time he’s owned it)
GMC= I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER GMC PRODUCT AGAIN.
Kia= not particularly interested
Hyundai= not particularly interested
I’m thinkin’, Ford, Honda, Toyota, Mazda… reliable cars with longevity & lower maintenance.”
Off topic: Any idea’s for a reliable, newer used SUV?
Okay… one bad experience… Replacing leaking heater core in 2000 GMC Envoy.
The ENTIRE dash needed to be removed= 17 hours to complete!
During:
I discussed this with a GM tech. from a Dealership. “The GM Tech. Book” called for about 17 hours as well! I saved about $1500+.
SEVENTEEN hours later…. completed:
To be fair it’s not unique to this car. Almost anything built in the 30 or so years is the same way-Even my A2 Jetta needed the dash out to do the heater core.
True. And its very variable depending on the car design. A heater core on my 97 Deville took 45 min. My 87 Mustang took 15 minutes . But my Grand Marquis takes all day.
Of course It depends on the make & model. I wish ALL auto designers made them easily accessible.
A BMW e30 (for example)… it slides to the left, right out of the center console, next to the gas pedal. (15 min) But, I’ve never had one of those leak, either!
My 88 and 94 Taureses also require complete dash removal and AC discharge for heater core removal. My 79 T-Bird? Open the hood, remove two hoses, unscrew four 1/4 inch bolts and lift it out. Takes 20 minutes. It’s all on top. We could probably do a CC article on on all the insanely difficult and easy heater core jobs.
+1 that would be fantastic!
My parents had a 69 Beaumont that would just stop running, I remember my Dad taking it to a couple different mechanics and they couldn’t fix it. One day it stalled in front of the local Pontiac Buick dealership and we had a new 77 Lemans Safari by the end of the day. Never had a problem with the Lemans except it had a target painted on it, got hit 3 times and the last was a write off. My wife inherited a 74 Malibu Classic that lived till 1986 when it was cut up at my father in laws auto shop. The only GM’s we have owned since are a 89 Grand Am and a 92 Sunbird. I really can’t say anything bad about either, they never left us stranded and we just spent money on maintenance.
Last gm car I had was a delta 88 royale brouugham 1980. It had horrible quality. The paint flaked off, the top of the drivers door fell of as did the trim and hood ornament that fell off and broke the windshield. It got 7 miles to the gallon, smoked on acceleration, drank oil. The seat broke as did cruise control, the power locks, the module failed. Driving in rain was like driving a Ford in 8 inches of snow. I sold it and got a much better in every way Ford Ltd
Interesting. My grandparents also owned a Delta Royal Brougham with the 307 but it was a 1981 and had the then new 200R-4 transmission. They bought used with only 30K miles, pampered by the previous elderly owner. The build quality was perfectly fine, the paint never flaked off, everything lined up as it should, the 307 was indestructible and it routinely saw 25 highway MPG on there yearly trips to Florida. The only thing that ever failed on that car was the transmission, with over 150K miles! Needless to say there were so pleased with that car that they bought another Olds, a 1985 Cutlass Supreme coupe with the same 307 motor that they kept until going into a nursing home in 1994. I inherited that car and it gave me many more years of trouble free service.
Both the Delta and Cutlass drove perfectly fine in both the rain and snow and were virtually the same as any panther car I have driven to date.
Oh boy. Have I got a story to share about THIS careless car manufacturer.
I bought a 2007 Chevy Cobalt LT sedan, 2 years old. It was very peppy, and had a sporty feel to it.
Unfortunately, this car was plagued by the faulty Ignition Switch, which led my engine deciding to shut off, while driving on a 2-lane road one day. It was a sunny day, with dry pavement.
I tried to steer the car as best that I could (I am no muscle man). The car swerved a full 360 degrees, landing me in a mud ditch, at the side of the road. Now I was facing the wrong way, in a ditch of mud, and my car frame bent in a V-shape.
Shaken and upset, the kind driver of the car behind me calmed me down. Then a police office showed up, as well as an ambulance and tow-truck.
The cop took a statement from the drriver behind me, and said that although it looked like I was trying to remain in my lane, but could not, he charged me a fine.
As well, this is now on my driver’s record as an at-fault accident on my part.
On top of that, my car was a write-off.
This occured 2 years before G.M. went public with their recall on their cars with the Ignition Switch failure recall (affecting many of their smalll cars). I have been receiving Recall notices now, and still today, since then.
I have sent in photographs to G.M. Canada about my case. They ignored me until I had a lawer get involved, sending my information and request for minor compensation: just to clear my record, and reimburse me for the small fine.
They told me that there is not enough proof for them to do anything.
They wanted to see the car, but it was sent to the crushers by then.
I am now enrolled in a Class Action suit regarding this, in Canada, with hundreds (if not thousands) of other G.M. car owner’s.
I loved G.M. cars and their designs. However, after this experience, of them ignoring me (it took them 2 years to respond), then simply tell me to “forget it and go away”, due to their own reasons, (“I have no proof of my car engine shutting off”), has turned me off from purrchasing another G.M. product FOREVER.
Oh, I just received yet another recall notice in the mail! And, I am not laughing.
Now, I am a VERY SATISFIED Ford Escape owner.
1980 Chevette (need I say more?) It would be easier for me to tell you what didn’t go wrong than what did.
My wife-to-be’s Chevette? featured self-detaching windows, water? leaks, various failed engine accessories. All not covered by the Extended Warranty, of course.
Just as the Car Guys warned against, she purchased it on her father’s advice. Well, one can’t expect an Okinawa veteran to recommend Japanese products.
A bit off topic but I had similar “nothing goes right” issues with a ’92 Mustang (yes, not GM but still a lemon – didn’t know if there would be a bare it all lemon theme for Ford too).
Anyway, I filed a lemon-law case and actually won! Ford bought the car back from me. In my case the lemon law, via the State of Florida, worked; don’t now how effective it is in other states.
My dad effectively “lemon-lawed” a 2001 Escort ZX2 here in Michigan. It had a severely rough idle that they couldn’t fix. After the fourth time in the shop (I think), they bought it back. Sadly, he bought that car (partially) with a $4000 goodwill “coupon” from his ’94 T-Bird 3.8’s blown head gasket. He’s still, however, a Ford man through and through because most of his Fords have been nearly trouble free.
All of the makes probably deserve a DS article or two.
My worst GM car was easily a 1980 Buick Skylark, it actually ran fairly well the first 12,000 miles or so-until the warranty expired-and then the troubles began. I can’t begin to list them all, but top of the list was the breaking of the bolts attaching the starter to the block. Between the breakdowns, recalls and numerous trips to dealers to have problems repaired, the car was an absolute disaster. It was worse than the Vega I once owned and that’s saying something. I got rid of it in 1984 and have not driven a GM car since then.
My parents had mostly GM or Ford vehicles while I was growing up and for the most part were reliable but there were a few issues that I remember:
1969 Buick Wildcat 400ci V8 and TH-400 – Bought new shortly after my birth, transmission locked up while my mom was dropping me off at school which was downtown, during rush hour, in winter, while raining.
1974-75 Ford Capri 3.0l V6 and four speed manual – Can’t remember if he bought it new or slightly used, but he loved driving it even more than his Gran Torino until it stripped all of the teeth off of the nylon timing gear.
1977-79 Chevrolet Impala 350ci V8 and TH-350 – Bought used (from a Chevrolet dealer) to replace the Capri, my dad was working on it one day and looked up while underneath it and found a weld line running across the floor pan; further investigation reveals that this car was actually two car bodies and a undamaged frame that had been wrecked and subsequently rebuilt from the remaining good parts, gone in sixty seconds…
1996 Pontiac Grand Prix 3.1 V6 and 4T60 – Bought new even after advising him to not buy a GM with the 2.8/3.1/3.4 V6 (I had already been there and done that), first thing to go was the well known intake manifold coolant leak and after that it was a service bay queen from that point on and the last GM product he would buy.
My own experiences with GM are:
1980 Chevrolet Z-28 350ci V8 and TH-350 – Bought used after my first car (1975 Audi 100 LS) was t-boned in a wreck, threw a rod after my mom drove it without oil while I was in California for a week. Replaced motor which promptly killed the original transmission, replacement transmission failed when shift lever broke inside the case and left it stuck between drive and neutral. Sold it to a friend before shipping out for a tour overseas.
1982 Chevrolet S-10 2.8l V-6 TH-200C – Bought used and suffered from the usual 2.8 malady of coolant leaking into crankcase from intake manifold and a carburetor designed for a FWD application being used in a RWD vehicle (floods when turning in one direction and stalls when turning in the other direction), after having the engine and transmission rebuilt I did not have the $1,300 for a rebuilt carb so I pieced one working example out of 5 or 6 bought from the local u-pull-it wrecking yard. Swore to never own a vehicle with this engine or carb again.
1993 Chevrolet S-10 4.3l V6 and 4L60-E – Bought used with 46k on the clock, transmission and motor mounts crapped out before I hit 75k, plastic side tanks on radiator failed and exhaust rotted away before it hit 50k.
1994 Chevrolet S-10 Blazer 4×4 4.3l V6 CPI and 4L60-E Bought used and right out of the gate it started leaking oil from the rear manifold gasket (this is when GM had started using a caulk type sealer instead of an actual gasket), transmission crapped out before 75k and finally the Central Port Fuel Injection gave up the ghost last GM I have bought.
I will admit that I have never bought a new vehicle and don’t care to as depreciation sucks, especially on new cars but I would like to note that none of the vehicles above made it to 100k (and in some cases 50K) before needing major repairs, this is in comparison the the foreign or non GM cars that my parents or I have owned some of which I have highlighted below…
1987 Subaru GL Wagon 1.8 flat 4 and five speed manual – My dad bought this used in 1990 and after 286k and about 15 years of ownership only got rid of it because the suspension mounts were rotting away from rust.
2000 Acura 3.5 RL 3.5 V6 and 4 speed auto – I bought this used with 125k on it and drove it until well over 200k before it need a major repair (radiator, then struts) and sold it at 263k when the cost of repairs was going to be more than its blue book value.
2006 Lincoln LS 3.9l V8 and 5R55S – My current daily driver with 159k and has never seen anything other than scheduled maintenance.
Post bankruptcy GM does seem to be doing a better job than pre-bankruptcy GM in many ways but I think that the spectre of the bad old days and the way of doing things is still present within the current corporate culture, my girlfriend bought a Chevrolet Cruze new in 2014 and so far there has been 7 recalls on it and the number of complaints on the NHTSA website boggles the mind; she has already announced that another GM product is not in her future and we are both eying a couple of Not GM vehicles to replace our current cars when the time comes.
Bought a 1978 Buick Turbo Regal Sport Coupe in August of that year. Other than a terrible paint job (silver w/clear coat) that lasted around 8 months, everything went okay until around 75K miles, when the turbo and top end of the engine went. After one end of the passenger door strap that was used to close the exceedingly heavy door gave away, I removed the door card to make a repair and quickly saw evidence of lackadaisical assembly e.g., 2 screws used to secure things where 4 screwdown points were plainly visible. I had the car repaired and quickly traded it in for a new ’81 Honda Accord.
1985 Fiero 2M6 & 1982 Olds Cutlass 3.8 V6 w/T-Top. No more GM for this guy, ever.
The main thing that I recall about GM cars in my extended family was how nice interior materials were in the 60s era cars, compared to the self-destructing interior plastics they used in the 70s…my mom’s ’69 Delta 88 had beautiful vinyl seats and interior trim, while my dad’s ’76 Cutlass S had trim that started fading and falling apart almost immediately. The other thing that struck me about that Cutlass was that the front seat was not centered in the car…the gap between the seatback and b-pillar was MUCH wider on one side than the other. That car was bought new, so it wasn’t collision damage, it was a seat that was off-center, which also was hard to adjust…it took adults in BOTH sides of the front seat PUSHING with all their might, to get it to move on its rails, from the time it was new. Thankfully my parents were of similar enough height that the seat rarely got moved.
I wouldn’t DREAM of shopping a GM brand…I’ll keep doing cheap leases on new Hondas and be done with it.
I’ve covered the then-new ’77 Skyhawk ad-nauseum over the years. Worst car ever, and was bad from the start. Same for my dad’s then new 75 De Ville which rusted within 3 years. My hand me down 79 Grand Prix wasn’t terrible, I just didn’t like it. There was nothing really fun or exciting about it.
After trading the GP in 1987 on a 300ZX, I never ventured back to GM-land until 2009, when I bought a 2002 Tahoe with 89k miles. Traded it after less than 3 years of ownership because too many problems: defective catalytic converters (replaced them with a set from the junkyard as I had missed out on the GM recall), stereo that was both crappy and didn’t always work. Cheap plastic dashboard – you had to be careful not to scratch or crack it. 200r4 trans rebuild at 120k, driver’s seat and carpet was worn out. Idiot lights came on from time to time and could not be traced to anything. The kicker was reading in the forums about the “autoride” rear air suspension failures that typically occurred at 120-130k miles. Didn’t want to be stuck with the that repair too ($2500+), so dumped it. The Tahoe/Yukon was a great idea…poorly executed (go figure!).
1980 Pontiac Phoenix. I have listed its faults on these pages before. My only GM car. At least it was better than my ’75 FIAT 131, so that’s something.
My last GM car was a ’79 Monte Carlo. I bought it one-year old, used even though I thought it was ugly because it was one less ugly car I had to look at while driving it. The transmission was garbage. The power window switch failed. The adhesive on the trunk weather stripping came off on your luggage and your hands (try getting it off either). The carb broke. Radiator crapped out and you needed both inch and metric sockets to remove and replace it. Pull strap on the driver’s door broke. The paint failed prematurely. Even the manual adjuster on the non-powered seat broke. Very few things have happened in my life that made me happier than getting rid of that POS. I vowed never to buy another GM car as long as I live. It’s a promise that’s been very easy for me to keep.
My folks bought home a new ’78 Monte Carlo with the 305. When I sat in the passenger seat and pulled the door strap to close it, it came off the holder – no screws held it on. It had an intermittent shudder from the rear that no one at the service department could figure out. About a year after we traded it, we got a a recall letter from GM Chevrolet saying we were part of the rear end axle shaft recall.
My 81 Chev Bel Air that would stall or refuse to restart after a highway run. So, you get off the highway to pick up a coffee on your day long journey, and then have to wait 15-30 minutes for the thing to cool down so it would restart. Then I would drop it into drive before it would change its mind again.
I’ve already written in other CCs about my 96 Cavalier which had its transmission die along with the head gasket at 54000 kms.
Nary a GM product has ever, or will ever have a spot in my driveway since.
Then there was my friend’s 73 Cutlass Supreme, a beautiful car, that rusted out by 1980. I mean completely. He replaced it with another Cutlass, and guess what, rust-o central in a few years.
111 comments so far, Holy FUK!
1) 1978 Monza V6, had to rebuild motor, less than a year later it was acting up again.
2) 1999 Safari Cargo Van. On the way to DJ and on left turn the rear diff gears went. I transferred equipment to someone else. It had stupid 3:23 highway gears that were useless due to aero lag. Decided to put in 3:73 posi. Big difference, and actually better mileage in city and less strain on all drivetrain.
3) Also had water leak in front driver side of said 1999 Safari (not good for fuse panel) that was hard to figure out, did a lot of caulking and eventually sold it.
’95 Firebird. Glovebox broke on the way home from the used car lot. Transmission started slipping at about 80k. Belts slipped off or snapped constantly. Slid over water like a hockey puck. Loved the styling; don’t miss the car a whit.
When I was in Iraq a few years ago the contracting company had been issued 4 govie vans. 3 Econolines and 1 GM (Savanna?). No one on either shift wanted to drive the GM so it always sat at the airfield. One day I needed to go to main side for something and I took the GM. I remember the steering wheel was incredibly wobbly like it was barely held on. The trim rattled like it was going to fall off any second. Even for a govie it was bad.
I liked my 1980 Chevrolet Monza. Purchased new in September of ’79, it looked good and was stoutly built. However, two heater cores, a radiator and an alternator all going bad in the 67,000 miles I drove it proved a bit much. I’ve never seriously considered GM again.
Thanks Paul for letting us vent. I feel better already.
Next up should be one of these for Ford and Chrysler owners. I could write a book a mile long on the junk we both sold, traded, owned and saw at various car auctions over the past 25 years.
Paul needs to add VW to the que
I have two worst:
1) ’72 Vega. A total tragedy from such a FUN car to drive. Rust issues led to radiator falling out of its mount and going thru the fan, which led to engine overheating and oil in the coolant, coolant in water, etc…
2) ’88 Corsica. It, too, was enjoyable with a 5-speed but the all-new 4-cylinder engine…a 2.2 IIRC…had a bad thrust bearing. Engine was apart twice and was on its way to a third rebuild when we traded it.
I only had one GM car that had some well known issues. It was a 1979 Pontiac LeMans with the 301 V8 and 200 Metric transmission. The light blue paint was thin on the hood and deck lid and after about 7-8 years was starting to flake off. The 200 Metric failed with 80k miles. Soon after the 301 developed a knock but that was due to severe negligence from the previous owner who thought it normal to only change engine oil once a year with much city driving and short hops. That poor 301 was so sludged up you could scoop it out with a spoon. All of my other GM cars right up to present never left me stranded, never lost an engine or transmission, had reasonably good build quality and when something did need attention the local dealer was good at diagnosing and repairing the issue under the warranty if needed.
Of note all of my W-body cars were top notch for reliability, performance, mileage and suffering no engine or transmission issues. My A-body cars were virtually bullet proof. My current last 3 Impalas have gone as high as 172K miles with nothing more than one replaced Intermediate steering shaft and an alternator on the 2000. The current 2013 LT is approaching 60K miles with zero issues, my mom’s 2008 has 81K with nothing to report other than service and my close friend has a 2013 LTZ Impala that just got to 130K with nothing other than brakes, tires and a fuel pump regulator.
I also loved all of my A/B and B-body cars and never lost an engine or transmission in any of them save the 1979 Lemans which had little to no service for it’s first 7 years of life.
My 1979 Fairmont was a total pile in comparison and really soured me and the folks on Fords for years. My grandfather 1976 Granada was also a joke when it reached 6 years of age.
I actually can’t remember a GM car I’ve had that I hated as much as many of you. The people that hated one and kept on buying the same brand are amazing to me. Masochists?
Worst GM product? Definitely my ’84 Century with the 3.0 V-6. What a piece of crap that engine was. Let me tell you, that engine wasn’t fit for a lawn mower. Three rebuilds by 70k and I was done with that car. And I was pissed because overall I loved that car! In the mid 90’s when I was looking for an inexpensive car and my neighbor was selling a mint condition 1987 Century Limited with the ‘T’ package I decided to grab it. Loaded with every option including Twilight Sentinel – they had owned Cadillacs for years and wanted something smaller so he had special ordered the Buick for his wife. It only had about 75k miles on it when I got it. Knowing it had the SFI 3.8 V-6 made it an easy purchase for me. And let me tell you, that car could move! That car was so reliable it was ridiculous. Normal items went here and there, but overall it was bulletproof. I put well over 200k on that car before it started to rust and I knew it was time. Shows how the General can make a bad car and a good car out of the same platform! Only 3 years separated them and those two Buicks were like night and day!
My folks had a bad GM, too…our ’77 Caprice Estate wagon was a total POS. My Dad would often say it was built on a Friday at 5:00. It had rust all along the rear windows and it was only 3 years old!! The 350 was a good engine, but the rest of the car was a total joke. Moldings fell off that car daily and the paint was really cracked in only a few years. The power window switches never worked properly as did the cruise control. The digital clock was installed crooked and worked for a few years before stopping. Hubcaps flew off all the time. There were more things I cannot even recall. I know my Dad hated that car, and loved the ’82 Country Squire that replaced it.
My Mom’s ’79 Riviera was a beautiful car. The build quality was excellent, too. The only flaw was that it liked to stall occasionally at red lights and such. Made it a little unnerving to drive because you never knew when it would happen, but overall my folks really liked that car and were sad when it was totaled in 1985 (in mint condition with only 30k miles on it too!)
Dad had sworn off GM after the Chevy wagon, but when he was diagnosed with cancer in 1989 he said he was going to buy himself a Cadillac and he did. He got a 1990 deVille Spring Edition Coupe that he absolutely LOVED. Had it until he passed in 1993 and my Mom drove it until 1998. Never gave us an ounce of trouble. Ever. One of the General’s best, in my opinion.
Almost forgot – my then girlfriend now wife had a light blue ’86 Cavalier Coupe that she bought 2 years old with 24k miles on it. Fantastic little car. Never ever gave her any trouble. The funny thing was it wasn’t her first choice when she was looking. She had found another more optioned 1986 Cavalier at another dealer. It was 2-tone white and red with a pop-up factory sunroof and A/C. She went back to get it the next day and it was gone, so she ended up buying the basic blue one. Well, wouldn’t you know a friend of hers from high school bought the white and red one and had nothing but problems with it! It had rot on it in no time and was constantly being repaired for one thing or another. Honestly, my wife’s was basic but it was a great car. Once again – the General making two of the same car, one good and the other…..not so good!
Let me list all of the GM vehicles I have owned:
(2) 1941 Chevrolet Special Deluxe sedan
1963 Chevrolet Belair sedan
(2) 1969 Cadillac Commercial Chassis M+M combination ambulance
(2) 1972 Cadillac Sedan Deville
1975 Pontiac Safari station wagon
1977 Chevrolet Impala
1988 Buick Electra T-Type (best car that I have ever owned)
2001 Buick Lesabre Custom (worst car that I have ever owned)
I have no more GM vehicles in my fleet. After my experiences with the 2001 Buick, I feel strongly that GM should have been allowed to fail completely. I just gave the car to my in-laws a month ago.
I’ve had a 2005 Impala that was pretty bad, but so was the 2007 Ford 500 bought a few years later with comparable miles.
I’ve never owned a GM product myself, but I have rented a few. They’ve mostly been sprightly and comfortable, but ultimately undistinguished. One does stand out though… I did two road trips through the south-west USA in consecutive years, both times traversing Death Valley. The first time was in an ’04 rental Focus, the second time in an ’05 Malibu V6 sedan. The Focus was a delight. A willing and economical engine, fun handling and nothing broke. The Malibu… not so much. Although the 3.5 V6 was strong, the handling was flabby, and the brakes didn’t survive the Death Valley crossing. I swapped the shuddering pile for another Malibu in Vegas, this time a Maxx. What a ridiculous car that was. The malformed, truncated rear end on that car actually held less luggage than the sedan! What were they thinking? I also rented a 3.4 V6 Grand Am for a day in Honolulu that same year (2006). Even though it was Trump-level ugly, it was a pleasant enough way to get around the city, with a fair turn of speed when requested. And at least I didn’t have to look at it while I was driving!
As has been mentioned, some of us are masochists! My first two constantly-broken cars were 1980 Pontiacs, and even after the rolling crisis that was my family’s Buick Century, I just couldn’t stay away forever. I was in CarMax, looking to make a fast trade on a distance commuter, and was trading in my beloved black over black 2004 Grand Cherokee. I loved that Jeep so very, very much.
After looking at a lot of economy cars, I saw it. Glossy and shiny on the showroom floor. A nearly-new Pontiac G6! It was the I4, but that was ok. Burgundy with a black interior. It truly was pretty. I upgraded myself instantly, and took it home.
After a few weeks it needed the door adjusted as it may have had some bad body repair. Then it stranded me at my wife’s ex’s driveway, dropping off her kids. Nice. The battery terminals had huge, Bloomin’ Onion-looking growths of corrosion. Overcharging? Replacement cable and battery. That was followed soon by the dash Christmas-light display. The warning lights were going crazy all the time. It hurt to get into and out of, as the doors were too “swoopy” to fit humans easily. The issues just kept coming, and I think I only made it six months. It went back for cash, and I switched to a little ’94 Nissan Hardbody pickup to live without payments for a while. While I learned the hard way, my father gave in and purchased a Caddy SRX, which has been pretty reliable if ridiculously thirsty. So maybe they’ve finally got it under control…
Chevy Monza notchback, about 1980 model year. Can’t recall because it was a company car. Nice-enough looking, but a ridiculously low seating position that was never comfortable. Underpowered and noisy, it was terrifying at highway speeds due to vague steering. I nicknamed it “Lurch,” because it would just lunge when the pavement would grab it’s skinny tires. Handed it back to the boss and started using my own car.
My worst GM experience? Well, there really isn’t any, other than nit-picking stuff. My ’72 Cutlass had a flat spot just off idle that took many tries to fix, I cranked up the accelerator pump to keep it from stalling, but it took a simple fix to resolve, once the right guy looked at it. That car also ate starters for a while, but I think it was the shitty rebuilt starters my dad had them put on it. My ’82 Blazer was basically bulletproof, a trim piece, a headlight, and a battery at two years (Until well into the 2000’s, I never, ever had a battery last more than two years.) Sometimes, it was almost two years to the day, and it would die. The replacement Dodge Caravan had a lot of A/C issues, but it was ok other than that. It was replaced in 1988 by an S10 Blazer, another totally solid truck that went on to about a half million miles on the original short block, transfer case, and rear end. I guess the only “dog” GM vehicle I had was my ’86 Iroc Camaro. It had endless computer issues, all but one fixed under the emissions warranty after the bumper to bumper one had expired. My 2000 GMC Sierra had the worst stereo I’ve ever heard, period, and it wasn’t the base stereo. It had no power and just sounded like crap. A cheap aftermarket head unit showed a so called expert that it wasn’t the speakers, though I ended up replacing them too, later on. Other than the shiity stereo, and the BS “carbon” nonsense that GM claimed was causing the startup ticking (It was lifters, no matter how much they denied it), it was problem free until it was damaged in a wreck in 2003. I got rid of it soon after that, it was never right again.
My wife and I bought our first new car in the fall of 1976. It was a Buick Century coupe with the formal roof of the Regal and the cow catcher grill. It had a/c (a must have in Houston), power windows, power door locks, am-fm stereo, tilt steering column, and probably many things I don’t remember now. Upon picking up the car the first thing I noticed was that the steering wheel was off by 90 degrees. There were other defects, I wrote a list and took the car back to the dealer a few days later. I guess they fixed all the items on my list because I don’t remember other problems. Up to this time our only car was a 1971 VW Type III fastback. It was slow, uncomfortable specially during the summer with those black vinyl seats. But it was very space efficient and didn’t consume much gas. I remember one day struggling to get the dirty laundry hamper into the back seat of the Buick. The Buick was a much bigger car I shouldn’t have to struggle to get that hamper into the back seat. I never had any problems getting that hamper in or out of the VW. From that day on I resented that Buick and it wasn’t long before we got rid of it. Never missed it.
This Buick was my last New car purchase.
As much of a GM fan as I’m not and as many GM vehicles as I’ve had I’ve never had a bad one. I suppose my only bad GM experience was with my ’89 Sedan DeVille which managed to eat 2 water pumps within a month and a half. Not a fun water pump to replace as the damned engine has to be jacked up on the passenger side to get at all of the fasteners. Of course, it may have been due to the elcheapo pump I used the first time…
2000 Olds Alero. Went into great detail in the COAL article, but it had…a litany of problems, not the least of which was the infamous ignition switch that would cause the car to cut off for no apparent reason while driving. Replaced that on my own dime as it failed well before the recall happened.
As a sort of cruel joke, we got a number of recall notices offering free replacment well after we’d gotten rid of the car.
It was bad enough to turn my wife off GM permanently. For herself, and I think if she had her way, for our family altogether. Though she had to deal with the car for four years before I met her (and it) and its antics had already begun.
Family member recently bought a 2007 Cobalt LS, 4 door automatic rental car special. Paid $2000. Had 120k miles on it, nice body, paint, and interior except for stains on the seats. She managed to rear end a BMW 3 weeks after she bought it in the rain, needed front tires and no ABS, I think it’s the last year before ABS was standard. Can’t really blame the car for the accident. I managed to get it repaired for $1200 plus $600 for body parts.
The airbag service light was cycling on from the day she got it, and they did not go off in the accident. The airbag lamp still cycles on and off, I doubt the bags work. Although if they had gone off, the car would have not been worth repairing anyway. The power steering was kicking in and out, along with the steering lamp coming on. Luckily it had not had it’s recalls done, and in addition to the steering motor replacement, had the ignition cylinder and switch replaced. The recall steering motor fixed that problem.
The front end rattles, the sway bar links are worn and loose, I got a pair of new links off Ebay for $16, still need to install them. At 129k miles the engine quit running, luckily close to home. Timing chain plastic guide broke, thrown the chain off 4 links. It was pure luck the interference engine somehow didn’t hit the pistons with the valves, so a chain kit with tensioner and a hell of a lot of work got it running again. There have been 3 tensioner redesigns, hers was version 2, now updated to version 3. It ran good for an 1800 miles California road trip. At 132k miles the battery went dead, it was the original so can’t really fault that. A month later the alternator died, just replaced that a couple of weeks ago.
It also has a check engine light on, but this was a result of cracks in the plastic air inlet manifold from the accident so can’t blame the car for this. Still looking for a used one, Cobalts are few and far between at U pull. Uses a quart of oil about every 700 miles.
Hope it behaves itself for a while, quite a few problems for the mileage even after excluding the accident related damage. Wish she would have bought the super clean original ’87 Jetta I bought with her in mind last year, she could have had it for $1000 from me, with the new tires and brakes I installed and running perfectly, but she is unwilling to learn to drive a stick shift. And I can fix the VW blindfolded, I’ve been keeping my ’86 Jetta on the road for the last 25 years and 300k miles.