In our GM DS series, we’ve mainly focused on their products from a market-competitive viewpoint. Obviously, quality issues and the ownership experience were a huge factor too in the demise of the Mark of Excellence. The gen3 Camaro DS had a postscript by an owner who had to take his car back to the dealer 46 times in the first year. That may be something of a record, but I know many of you have suffered through painful GM withdrawal symptoms due to serious issues with the quality, reliability or other aspects of your GM cars. Here’s your chance to share them; hopefully it will be a therapeutic exercise.
My wife had a 1998 Pontiac firefly. It was great on fuel but scary to pass anyone on the highway. She bought it new for $14k CDN. I had all the service done on time according to the manual. One day around 110 000 kms the car overheated and wreaked the head gasket and cylinder head. I couldn’t find anyone to fix it in the small northern Alberta town it broke down in as they were all to busy fixing oil field trucks. Got $200 for it. No more GM vehicles for me since then and even the old air cooled vw vans I used to run could get more mileage before needing a rebuild.
the 98 Firefly was actually a Canadian built Suzuki Swift with a bit of badge engineering applied. usually a robust engine though the head gaskets do fail when over heated. I have seen many of these cars go 300k miles.
My GM experiences have been pretty good. The worst was the typical Northstar V8 headbolt failure in my 97 Deville. I bought the car used and pretty cheap 11 years ago. I knew of the risk but the best information I found suggested this happened to about one third of the cars and could be prevented by proper cooling system maintenance.
It turns out the failure will happen to every Northstar engine eventually, and occurs before the engine wears out or otherwise reaches the end of its lifespan.
The DS occurs because GM never completely solved this problem. Indeed, the most vulnerable engines were built for many years, for their premium brand, all with a known critical defect.
But otherwise, the 20 -odd GM vehicles I’ve had were very reliable and served their intended purpose well.
I had a ’92 Chevrolet Corsica, which I owned for about a year. Oh, where do I begin?
At around 12,000 miles or so, there was a small fire in the fuse box; it melted the plastic access panel which served as its cover.
The plastic wheel covers – styled to look like alloys – were held in place by the lug nuts, which in turn were covered by fake plastic lug nut covers, which were impossible to keep from falling off.
The speakers always emitted an annoying buzzing sound if the radio was cranked more than one-third of maximum volume.
The front passenger seat back would not remain in a fixed position; there was always an inch or so of play in it, so every time I was driving alone and came to a stop, the seatback would rock forward and then slam back into position.
The doors required a substantial tug to open from the outside, and when they shut, they made a clanking, hollow noise.
The paint was awful, particularly on the urethane bumpers.
On the plus side, the 3.1 liter V6 was smooth, peppy and relatively fuel efficient, and the climate control system was excellent.
My family bought mainly GM stuff for years, and I can remember only one car I would call a lemon, and even then only a qualified lemon. It was the 1961 Olds F-85 wagon with the brand new 215 cid aluminum V8. As a tot I remember my parents’ continual problems with overheating. Hindsight says that there may have been a partially blocked cooling passage somewhere, because that car ran on the ragged edge of the red “hot” light whenever the weather got warm. Which was a shame, because my mother really loved the car otherwise.
My own GM experience has been limited, and none of it has been on anything newer than 10-15 years old. The 63 Cadillac’s problems can be chalked up to age/abuse. The 84 Olds 98 suffered a failure of its 200-4R transmission right after I bought it (14 years old, 54K miles) and also from a seemingly unfixable automatic temp control unit.
The 89 Cadillac Brougham (13 years old, 87K miles) had an engine vibration that was persistent. My mechanic was unwilling to recommend spending money on a new harmonic balancer (which I believed to be the culprit) because he was not sure that was it, wondering if it might have been in the transmission. So, pretty minor stuff, and all attributable to old age.
I lost that same transmission in my ’82 Olds 88, and the 307 later suffered an undiagnosed vibration at stop lights – leading me to part with the car.
I’ve only had transmission trouble in two cars, and engine problems in one That 88 single handedly had two of the three issues. The Olds ended up being my last contemporary GM car.
Knowing that the B body was supposed to be among the best GM cars in the ’80s, considering other options from their offerings just wasn’t of interest to me.
A leased 1997 Astro. From day one, problems. Vacuum leak due to factory fuel injection installation without a gasket. Persistent vibration at 60mph. No amount of wheel or drive line balancing remedied. Rattling row 2 and 3 seat backs. Chewed up front tires despite repeated alignments. A/C knobs that fell off in my hand. My left knee constantly hit the power door lock control on moderate bumps. Dealer who treated me as a criminal for having problems from new.
I was sooo excited when the 36 month lease was over. I handed over the van, and promised myself to NEVER subject myself to another GM product…then walked over to the Toyota dealer across the street, where I leased a new Tundra. That was in 2000, and I have purchased a variety of Asian brands since, all of which offered total reliability and great value for money.
The GM vehicles my family owned (a ’67 Beaumont, a ’73 Impala, a ’77 Century and a ’78 Cutlass) weren’t bad cars, but the Impala and the Cutlass had issues. The Impala never had any mechanical issues, but it rusted out in a short time, and we took it off the road in 1980 and junked it a few years later. The Cutlass didin’t rust out, and we kept it for 12 years with no mechanical problems, but it was slow and had very sloppy build quality. We had to take it back to the dealer a few months after we bought it because the paint was flaking off – this on a brand new car. Still, it managed to survive three teenagers learning to drive in it, and I guess the lack of power from the 3.8 V6 could be looked on as a safety feature…unless you were trying to pass something on the highway. My friends and I called it the Gutless. The Century was the best of the bunch. For myself, the ’84 Cavalier I owned wasn’t a bad car. It got me around and was much better built than the Gutless, though it was a bit temperamental until it warmed up, and the shifter for the 5-speed was sloppy. I traded it at 180,000 km for a Nissan King Cab pickup that was a much better built (and running) vehicle. I’ve driven many GM vehicles since, mainly as rentals, and they’re much better than they were. Still, I lean more towards the Japanese cars for quality and reliability. They are generally better cars, and they’ve taught GM and the other domestic makes a lesson, though I’m not sure how well they’ve learned it. I had an Impala this summer for a week, and I really liked it, but I don’t know how well it would hold up in the long run to, say, a Camry or Accord.
My school district’s Drivers’ Ed had two Chevy Ventures and I hated them. Compared to the Family’s 95 Voyager and 05 Sedona they felt tinny and subpart on the roads of Tompkins County. The engine bay was cramped and electrical gremlins reared their heads.
The most effective way to avoid problems with GM vehicles is to never own one.
My first car was a ’53 Chevy. I was 19 years old at the time. (The Chevy was a tank, rugged and gave no problems).
Since then I’ve owned about 110 cars.
Not a single GM among them.
This, simply because style and power (what GM sells) were never high on my list of wants.
You just have to have the right instincts and a DS will never darken your driveway.
Agreed. GM was always good at one thing: sleds. Front engine, rear drive, solid axle sleds. They have never really cared two hoots about anything else in their North American operations, and in fact, now that’s all that is done in North America.
These body on frame vehicles have the same basic architecture as a 1955 Chevrolet. They are cheap to make so they are easy to supersize, and customers lap them up at very high transaction prices. There is tremendous brand loyalty, too.
These anachronistic throwbacks are now called “trucks,” although they rarely seem to haul much more than their owners.
Oh here we go, I’m unreasonably excited to share this.
In late 2014, I needed a capable SUV or truck to tow my track car. Several friends had used the GMT800 Yukon and Tahoe platform and loved it, had nothing but good to say about it. I test-drove a LOT of options and eventually decided on a 2005 Yukon Denali. Rated to pull 8300 lbs or so, built on a shorter Silverado frame, with the 6.0L motor and “slightly stronger” 4L65E trans (versus the 5.3/4L60 in the non-Denali and Tahoe).
I found a gorgeous, one-owner, locally-owned-and-dealer-serviced example a few days after New Years Day 2015. Had 125k on the clock and some recent services performed. I contacted the service department where it was maintained and they sent me all the records – everything had been done by the book, on time. All was well. I bought my (used) trailer shortly thereafter and set off using it as both my DD and Tow Pig. It was great for both for the first couple of months, and then…
Everything on it seemed to wear out at exactly the same time. I replaced literally every piece that made it turn (tie rods wore out, PS lines spewed fluid everywhere, pump burned up, steering box leaked and couldn’t be rebuilt). The rear HVAC completely gave out. One of the door lock actuators failed. The radio would occasionally refuse to power on with the ignition. I replaced the Hydroboost booster as part of the steering system but the brakes were still mushy.
The kicker was that the oil leak I was chasing finally became more of an oil gush. It leaked so much oil that when I moved out of my rented townhome, I had to pay to re-seal the entire driveway because it was eaten away where I used to park this stupid thing. I was chasing the leak for months. Valve cover gaskets, valley pan gasket, a few other odds and ends.
I finally took the truck to my local mechanic and said “Gary, just fix this damn thing.” He called me that afternoon and said “look, we know what you use this for, we know you, and we know what the book value of this Denali is. Go get it washed and trade it in for a newer truck because it’s not worth fixing everything.”
Turns out it needed both oil cooler lines, the oil pan gasket, AND the rear main seal replaced. This was on top of the transmission occasionally slipping into 2nd pretty hard, the center diff of the AWD leaking, and the hard brake lines starting to rust out.
I knew GM had the ignition switch recall. Turns out, they also were subjected to a class-action lawsuit about the GMT800 trucks’ brake lines rotting away. GM got out of the suit, claiming that replacing hard lines every 6 years or so was “routine maintenance on any vehicle” no matter where it lived. Mine were only starting to fail, and I had two friends with Denalis have theirs go out while driving. One had his empty car trailer hooked up to the back. The other one’s wife uses the truck to cart their toddler around every day.
I couldn’t believe the attitude taken by GM as a company about both the ignition switches and the GMT800 brake lines. I’ve owned a lot of old cars (old BMWs, really) that have been in various forms of utter disarray, and none of them have treated me as poorly as my 2005 Yukon Denali.
I’ve got absolutely nothing nice to say about GM as a company after my experience, my friends’ experiences, and the reading I’ve done. My money will never again go to supporting GM.
I traded the Denali in, at night, for a used F-150. The sales manager didn’t even drive the Denali, just commented on how clean it was. I muttered something about how a pickup really fit my needs better and nearly laid a set of elevens as I left the lot in my newly-acquired Ford.
Good riddance.
I bought a new 6 cylinder, 4wd, 3 on the tree GMC Jimmy in 1974. I know – nobody bought this stripper except me. I didn’t even get the optional back seat though I did get an incredibly shabby canvas convertible top. There were a few serious problems which I largely ascribe to youthful abuse but they were all readily and relatively cheaply resolved because it was a GM vehicle and anybody could fix them.
The Jimmy was about 2 years old and still mostly intact when a large nut fell on my feet as I was driving a country back road. I stopped and searched the underside of the dash for a location and was unable to find an obvious spot for it. I got back in and drove off and never replaced the nut with no apparent after effects in the 3 following years I kept it. I never bought another GM vehicle but I still miss that truck.
Actually in that time period GM sold boat loads of i6 powered strippers all through the Southern Sates ~ We’d get them in as bargain priced used cars/trucks, clean them up and re sell them here in Sunny California, some folks looked for these here, not many but they weren’t too hard to sell .
-Nate
1990 Cutlass Ciera. 100,000 KM. 3 sets of inner tie rod ends, 2 sets of ball joints (all Moog), all struts, 2 sets of front tires after it broke the belts, all 3 ignition coils, ignition module, fuel pump wiring, crank position sensor, harmonic balancer, big PCV grommet that blew out several times when it would backfire.
All this in a year.
What a piece of sh!t! Ye Gods.
That is not common on any A-body I have owned, worked on or sold over the years. About the only thing I have seen on this era of A-body cars is an occasional crank sensor on the Buick 3300 V6 or a failed coil pack with high mileage. These are issues that affect many a foreign or Domestic car with age as so many VW owners can claim with loads of failed coil packs on those lovely turbo engines.
I’ve only owned one GM car – a 2001 Vauxhall Corsa with a 973cc, 3 cylinder engine. I only ever had one problem with it – it was rather slow.
Tough call between a 91 z34 with constant alignment issues and a front axle that FELL OFF in traffic. Complete electrical failure and passenger door paint failure. Traded in at 36k.
Or a 98 Montana with the usual 3.4l issues ending in a seized engine at 69k.
A distant third is the 85 s15 jimmy with all its carbureted 2.8 v6 issues.
Yet I took the plunge on a 95 impala ss and loved it despite the crooked rear axle and steering column ignition lock failure. And the mismatched plastics.
5 hondas have been very good to me since then.
As you know, our 1981 Impala with 267 V8 was pretty bad, but the worst was the 1983 Buick Regal.
Dad bought it used after my sister took over his Dodge Colt. The 3.8l V6 with 2.41 rear gears was no barn burner, but at least it cruised nicely on the highway, looked pretty good, and was comfortable to drive.
Then one day the rear wheel had a puddle of brake fluid around it. On disassembly the brake backing plates had rusted until a wheel cylinder had torn out. We fixed it and kept driving. How can you mess up a brake backing plate?
Then one day the rear bumper looked crooked. We checked it out and the whole frame had rusted out behind the rear wheels, which was a common G body issue. The body was holding the frame up, and our mechanic confirmed it wasn’t safe to drive.
Dad never said exactly what he thought about having to send a perfectly good running nice looking car under 10 years old to the scrap yard, but he never bought another GM vehicle, and neither have I.
The A/G-body cars were generally decent cars, but their rust resistance was poor. The same went for the much beloved B-bodies. I like both platforms, but I have owned enough of them to know that it is a never ending battle with rust. Unless you stayed on top of the rust and oil rust proofed the cars, they rusted pretty quickly. Modern designs are vastly better at resisting rust.
That said, my family were early adaptors of rust proofing. Ever since my dad’s almost new ’65 Impala rusted badly, my dad always rust proofed all our cars, and I did the same after I started owning cars. That made a big difference on these cars, and is the reason my brother’s old ’86 Cutlass Supreme is still on the road today.
Interesting comment about the rear frame section rusting out. I don’t know if you’ve ever been up to the Barrie Car Flea market but there used to be a guy that specialized in rear frame repair kits for the ’78-88 A/G-body cars. A friend’s brother had a 80’s Cutlass Supreme and I remember him stopping by the shop with a drooping rear bumper. I knew right away the rear frame was shot and brought the body shop manager to convince him the car was done. We fixed the car enough to get him home but then I later found out he cobbled it together and kept driving the thing for a few more years as it was mechanically solid. He was lucky the MTO didn’t catch him.
Yeah, never been to the Barrie meet but I’ve seen his kits online. Not only is it about 24 years too late 🙂 (the Regal left around 1992) but we weren’t tooled up to do a repair that heavy. It was also Dad’s daily driver and it couldn’t be off the road for weeks / months.
It got replaced by a Mercury Tracer LTS, a vastly superior car in every way…
Sorry, I hope you didn’t think I meant that your Dad should have fixed the frame on the Buick. I just mentioned the frame repair kits to reinforce that these cars had such a rust prone frame that there was a business setup to deal with the problem. The fact is that they were rust prone cars, certainly not as bad as some in the past, but I’d say worse than the average 80’s car. Unless you took preventative measures they rusted quickly in a Canadian environment. The point is, an owner shouldn’t have to take all these preventative measures to avoid that kind of serious corrosion.
From what I can recall about the kit it went beyond the scope of even the average DIYer, requiring serious metal surgery. I am sure those that did invest in fixing the frames were likely owners of more desirable A/G-bodies such as the Monte Carlo SS or Buick GN. It wouldn’t be worthwhile in a DD average car and certainly not a V6 G-body. I haven’t been to the flea market in years, so I am not sure if they website you’re referring to was the same guy.
I own a 1979 Malibu coupe that I have owned since it was new. I had it rustproofed when new and except for the inner bottom of the driver’s door it is pretty much rust free. Here in southern Indiana many of these and their BOP cousins also have the rear frame rust problem. Mine is solid, however, when it was new I noticed that right behind the rear tires are stamped in large oval holes in the frame. Not sure why they are there, but they are in the perfect position to catch all the salt and mud the tires throw off . I have always kept this hollow part of the frame cleaned out and painted inside. Of course it isn’t much of an issue now since I only drive it in dry weather and never in the winter.
I drove numerous A/G body cars through the horrible Winters of Upstate, NY and never ever had either of these issues. Ditto my folks and grand parents. But then I sent my cars through the car wash every now and again which sprayed the undersides. I also hosed out the frame rails once a year as did my parents. Never had any major rust issues with any A/G or B-body car. The same couldn’t be said of most Asian makes of this time era which disintegrated after about 4-5 Winters. It is quite common to still see one of these or a Ford Panther still running around. Ditto the A-body’s, H and G bodies, F-150’s and SIlverado’s and even 90’s Mopar’s with the occasional K-car or stretched variant.
71 Vega…. hands down the worst. Rust, overheating, total engine disintegration within 3 years. No other GM car has come close.
When do we get to see the DS for FoMoCo and Mopar? I remember a number of forgettable cars from those two manufacturers.
While Mopar has had plenty of scares before joining GM in bankruptcy court the writing had been on the wall since the late 70s. Mini vans and the Horizomni prettied up the bottom line but they never had the dominance of GM and merely to have survived from 78-08 shows over those years they did more right then wrong. Lee Iaccoca himself voted for the Aspen/Volare twins as Deadly sin #1
Fomoco for all its problems has not been as close to the drain as the other 2, and even at their nadir were able to pull out on their own. Sins, maybe even felonies, but not deadly ones just yet.
“I remember a number of forgettable cars” Help, my brain hurts!
Ford’s salvation was financial. The company arranged for big lines of credit, and when the crunch came, was able to borrow its way to survival until it could turn things around.
Chrysler had been robbed of its substantial cash resources by Daimler before being cast off (what Daimler really wanted all along was the cash, and to hell with the company, they didn’t want the competition from a strong Chrysler anyway). The Germans didn’t leave enough for the company to survive into the 2008 recession and new owner Cerberus failed to merge another of its subsidiaries, a finance company, into Chrysler Finance…which it kept anyway when letting Chrysler go bankrupt.
My 1979 Fairmont sedan was the deadliest of sins. That car single handedly swore me off from Ford’s until more current. My A-G body cars were far superior in every way save the non roll down rear windows.
>When do we get to see the DS for FoMoCo and Mopar? I
My worst experiences by far have been with AMC/Jeep.
My Chrysler experiences were almost as bad. Ford and GM were better, by comparison.
They’re in the archive, you just have to search for them. I can’t speak for Paul’s sins deadly or otherwise but he does seem to attach a lot of Catholic imagery to GM specifically (Deadly Sins, Saint Mark of Excellence, etc). Maybe it started with Garrison Keillor…
His Deadly sin articles are 90% GM and the rest for Ford and Chrysler or other.
Don’t hold your breath. I’ve had good experiences with my GM cars.
Chevrolets, one Buick and mostly Holdens. My current Commodore has 180,000 Km on it. Other than regular maintaince, its needed one fuel pump.
Engine is original, ditto suspension, and drive line. Oh, I’ve got one rear shock that is weeping oil. Another GM DS! What a POS to need rear shocks at that age & mileage!
I’m so over the never ending recycling of the General’s DS. More repeats here than network TV.
My worst, best, and only GM experience was my ill-fated ’98 Saturn SL2. Gave great commuter service for 42000 miles, then suddenly refused to start one afternoon. Finally convinced it to fire up for a trip to the dealer, who shrugged and said they couldn’t find a problem to fix. Still wouldn’t start reliably at home, though, so I finally gave up. I have problems considering a GM product to this day.
Not sure it was a GM issue…probably previous owner(s) but here is my worst GM car/truck experience:
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/cars-of-a-lifetime/coal-1990-gmc-suburban-out-of-the-frying-pan-into-the-fire/
In retrospect, because of the body mount, and systemic mechanical failures, I suspect this vehicle was in a flood and put back in service. It had a dealer sticker from a part of the state that is flood prone.
1967 Camaro. Base 327, Powerglide.
Left rear axle shaft too long, kept blowing out axle seals and soaking the brake shoes in oil (dealer claimed “wear item not covered by warranty”) until I went in person to the zone office 3000 miles short of warranty expiration and complained, upon which the dealer finally ‘fessed up and did it right.
Engine burned oil at a quart every 300 miles at 40,000 miles.
Carburetor accelerator pump needed replacement of its plunger every 10,000 miles, after that it would hesitate from a stop…first a little, then a lot, then it would stall.
Transmission burned up the high clutches at 30,000 miles. After 12000 miles, from an almost-stop at cross streets, it would start to downshift but slip, then bang into first gear. WHEEE—BANG! Transmission was rebuilt but at 55000 miles it was doing it again.
The left engine mount broke; the rubber-to-metal bonding (read that as GLUE) broke. This caused the engine to tip on acceleration and the throttle linkage would jam open. This was the subject of a GM recall wherein GM used a cable to restrain the engine, but mine was totally broken and replaced by a new design with interlocking parts that limited movement if the rubber bonding failed.
And it wouldn’t have been a very good CAR even if all that stuff didn’t break. GM cars at least were supposed to ride well and be quiet. But this one rode like a buckboard and the thinly padded, slablike seats didn’t help. It was noisy inside. It was cramped in back, rear seat was virtually uninhabitable for more than a few minutes. Ventilation was drafty in the front, nonexistent in the rear. The rear axle on its one-leaf springs hopped on acceleration and hard braking. The front drum brakes overheated in normal driving (California freeways, mostly) and the linings would crack, causing the car to pull sharply to one side as the servo-action of the brakes took hold on the side with the cracked lining.
The Camaro was replaced by a Slant Six Plymouth Valiant Signet, a far better automobile even if slower and not as sleekly styled; it HANDLED better than the Camaro and its ride and seating comfort were far superior.
I had a 1979 Cadillac Eldorado Diesel, too. At least its engine was still running when it was traded. It needed a $25 (1980s price) fuel filter every 5000 miles when it could clog, even though it had a Racor water separator. The vinyl roof shrank from beneath its mouldings. The headliner fell down. The extra-cost Firemist paint flaked. The front end wore out at 24.000 miles…excessive free play in the steering and looseness in the ball joints. But it rode well, was quiet and handled decently.
84 v6 Camaro I had in the early 90s, I replaced the T-5 twice & the rear gears once. I wasn’t too mad about those parts as I was young & hard on it. The worst thing to happen to that car is the frame area at the steering gear box cracked. I guess it was a common issue because of stress and not rust. I put on z-28 sized tires/wheel & sway bars but didn’t get the chassis brackets. The holes were already there for them so I got a pair & had the crack welded up. I liked the car otherwise.
My first new car was a 1976 Cadillac Eldorado Convertible, with every option available except the alarm system and metallic paint. When delivered, the dealer (apparently angry that he had given a $1,600 discount as it was ordered before the “last convertible” mania had begun) just rolled it off the truck and did not prep it. I picked it up in Virginal and drove it about 270 miles home. What a day! But, not quite. A suspension bolt broke, the taillight screws were rusted, cruise control broke, the gas pedal was so abrupt that it was dangerous, the passenger recliner broke, the glass rear window shattered, three tires had to be replaced within 90 days, the paint was unacceptable on a Chevy, etc. I finally wrote to Cadillac and asked for a warranty extension, it was gaining on me! A field rep contacted me and asked me to drop the car off at the dealer. They provided a Seville loaner and kept the car for two weeks. When I got it back, it was perfect, they even Blue Coraled the exterior. It ran and looked great for 80-90k miles. The point was the incredible bad build quality, coupled with the almost cynical interior materials (wood tone contact paper, molded door panels, “wood like” fancy plastic moldings that had mold flashing showing…) finished me with GM for a long, long time.
Here’s a picture of where the crack happens & the reinforcement bracket holes, the brackets should have been on all f bodies.
This is the bracket installed, there was one called the wonder bar that was on Iroc Camaros only. It bolted above the sway bar.
Only GM I ever owned was a ’93 Geo Metro. Not a bad car within its’ limits, but was uneconomical to fix when the balljoints wore out as they were pressed in at the factory and required replacement of the A-arms!
Ford had the same official service procedure for decades, for ball joints. A new ball joint always required a new A arm and bushings.
Of course this did not apply to the aftermarket. Replacement ball joints were widely available that were installed on the existing arms.
have you all noticed that grease zerts are no longer installed on suspension components like they used to be? this is the main reason all these front ends are failing prematurely. every 90’s ford explorer is a squeaky beast because of this. gran marquis and the ford equivalent as well. but all manufactures are guilty, not just ford!
Yes, from the ’60’s through to 2000’s, so many Fords had no grease fittings on key components like ball joints and tie rods. I’ve collected many old RWD Fords and use this as a quick and easy way to tell if front end work has been done.
If the parts have grease fittings, they’ve probably been replaced. No fitting, probably original….. and worn out.
The sealed units tend to last longer on a mileage basis, because they’re just that…sealed. The downside is when they get old, and the grease becomes hard and waxy, they have to be replaced.
I’m surprised the (independent) mechanic I used didn’t know this – I could see scamming for labor but not parts, where’s the profit? I figured that if nothing else Maruti-Suzuki in India must’ve come up with something more field serviceable.
Separate ball joints are going the way of The Dodo, we stock more and more control arms every month. Sure they cost more upfront but you get new bushings and there isn’t a chance the tech won’t bend or break the arm.
One word: VEGA! Need I say more…
I drove a rental Cobalt for a week in Atlanta back in 2008 and spent the entire week fiddling with the seat trying to find a comfortable driving position. My co-worker thought it was hilarious. Another weekly rental in Boston was a Buick Century. When leaving the car if I pushed the lock button on the remote the doors would lock and then immediately unlock. After a few stops I would just shut the door and leave it. The doors were always locked upon return. Was this a feature or was this particular car haunted?
Never owned a GM car myself but drove many company cars and they seemed to handle the abuse better than the other makes. One chevy passenger van exploded it’s alternator and the shrapnel took out the rad and valve cover. That same van would eventually crack it’s block. Another caprice wagon was returned at the end of lease with it’s engine in pieces in the back of the car. Threw a rod from lack of oil and no maintenance in 100K km A Lumina sedan met the same fate for exactly the same reason. Those cars were never assigned to me but occasionally I was given them to drive the car pool and there were a few times I refused to drive them due to the poor condition of the brakes/tires.
A couple of memorable family member owned cars were the Quad 4 that developed a rod knock at 221K km and a sunbird 1.8 ohc that rounded it’s cam lobes a couple of times. Then there was the 2.8 Crapalier that siezed up from no oil. “What do you mean by check the oil?” “What do you mean change the oil? What’s wrong with the oil that’s in it?” Some how it was my fault they drove them til dead never having opened the hood for years. Can’t fix stupid.
Two similar stories, First one, my mechanic had an engine in pieces on his bench, looks at me and says, “3 yr old corvette, (this was 1976) 55,000 miles, never checked the oil”. Second one, my younger sister, 1982 Cavalier, wouldn’t start, I checked the dipstick…only oil on the very tip of the stick, and it was like tar. She bought it new, it had 22000 miles on it and never bothered to check the oil. She was very lucky that the engine responded to an oil change with no apparent damage.
1968 Buick: Well assembled, but defects were designed in from day 1.
As long as it did not rain or there was no traffic was OK.
Cooling system for 350 engine was only 12 Quarts, 1/2 to 2/3 the size in other GM 350 V8s and would overheat every time was stuck in bumper to bumper traffic for more than 15 minutes. Because there was no overflow tank the boiling coolant would flow onto the ground and then to have the car run again when cooled down needed to add fluid to radiator.
Distributor was in the front of the engine and it and the plug wires would get wet and water would soak into the contacts if it rained and the car would not start in the morning if it had rained the night before. Had to use a can of a spray to dry distributor and wires to enable the car to start.
1968 was the first year of coolant recovery system on GMs and it was exclusive to Buick that year. It should have had one. It was ballyhooed to the moon on their TV
ads.
I guess I can add my two cents to this love fest. My last GM car was purchased used with only about 25,000 miles on it. A ’94 Cadillac Seville STS. it was purchased in 1996 and at 27.000 dollars it is still the most expensive car I have ever bought. It was a great looking, driving, spacious car. It was pretty good for the first 50-75 k, then the problems started coming quickly. The engine main seals started leaking oil. A couple of starters, radiators, rear leveling and a/c failure. At the end, the body, paint and especially the interior were still beautiful but I was just tired of it. I sold it for 1.600 dollars with 132k on the odometer. I was disappointed that GMs flagship really wasn’t built to hold up to the long haul. Hence I haven’t lusted after any Cadillac newer then 1979. I know that I owned it long enough (about ten years) for it to become just an old car. I don’t think that we will see many modern cars on the road, restored, fifty years from now. Cars are just too complicated and expensive to fix once heavy depreciation has set in.Still most new cars will provide up to 150,000 miles to the original owner. Can’t say that about cars built in the 50s and 69s.
Having only owned 2 GM products (a ’93 Century and a ’55 Chevrolet 210), my ownership experience is limited to the annual brake job on the Century. Otherwise, no big whoop.
However, I’ve driven a ton of GM products that were in fleet service. None were breathtakingly bad, but they did leave one scratching their head:
The ’07 Silverado (current assigned vehicle). Ball joints wore out faster than on a Ford and the clock resets itself to 12:00 on any sort of whim. I’ve put 62,000 miles on it in 3.5 years; the dash has started to crack within the past year or so.
Impalas with horrible alignment from the factory.
G-Series vans that seemed put together with spit, hope, and bailing wire.
Overall, I cannot say I’ve had any horrible experiences with GM products, just some befuddling experiences.
My family has probably owned more GM products than any other brand. I can say though that we really haven’t had a bad GM car between my parents and my siblings. That said, my family is generally made up of people with an above average knowledge of cars, and we all knew which GM’s to avoid. Even those in my family that aren’t as car savvy always seek advice from those that are.
That said, I did work at GM dealership for some time starting in the 1990’s, and I saw some horrible vehicles there. I think the worst car I remember was a Cadillac Catera. It was years ago now, so I don’t recall the exact problem the car was having, but I do know that the head mechanic tried numerous times to repair it but couldn’t get the car right. We eventually called a GM field engineer who worked with our best techs but after numerous attempts and hours of labour the car was deemed unrepairable and GM bought the car back from the owner. I also recall the diesel tech in our shop saying that the 6.5L diesels would put his kids through college. We swapped out more of those engines than any other, and they weren’t overly common. The FWD Cadillacs of this era were generally problematic and most techs called them Cadil-scrap for good reason. The lower end FWD cars, like J-cars and L/N cars were just poorly made and assembled with cheap parts.
My last GM ( I’ve owned five ) was an 8-year old used 95 Chevy Lumina sedan. Everything worked when I got it except the AC, which I had fixed immediately. By the time I sold it 14 months later the white paint started peeling on the roof and hood, the parking brake cable broke ( a common occurrence — you could the cable hanging low on the majority of old Luminas ), tie rods needed replaced, replaced the alternator, several dash lights went out, the front passenger side power window stopped working, then the rear drivers side power window stopped working. When the driver’s power window stopped working, I unloaded it for $500. Haven’t owned GM since.
Biggest piece of sh!t I’ve ever owned, and I had 78 Cutlass that needed a new diff, had the shifter fall off, and rusted above the rear side window at 8 years old and less than 60k miles, which always left a nice pool of water in the rear passenger footwell after a rain.
I had a 2010 Cobalt LT and that was the last GM product I’d ever buy new. Complete junk is an understatement for that piece of scrap, automatic transmission went out very early (I think around 67000 miles). The ignition switch had “the issue” even though gm initially claimed the 2010’s were not affected. Ate tires pretty often too and the interior quality was ghastly compared to my early 90’s Corolla. Even the mileage wasn’t spectacular, at least the AC was cold! I’d take a mid 90’s Cavalier over a Cobalt any day though. You can pick up Cobalts at true value now (nothing) lol.
The steering shaft on my 2007 Cobalt LS went bad at 8,000 miles and ten months old. That one had me shaking my head.
My personal worst GM car was a 1986 Pontiac 6000-STE, I bought it used at 13 years old and 90,000 miles.I promptly blew up the 2.8 v6 at a heady 55mph and 3500 rpm. It then needed shocks (including fixing the self-leveling feature), struts, brakes, power steering lines, A/C compressor, reupholster the front seat, replace all the speakers (blown, not because I wanted to have a killer stereo) repaired the factory radio to retain the steering wheel controls, fuel pump. It was starting to need a rack, and cradle mounts, ball joints, and a bunch of other little things. I sold it with 120,000 miles on it and two years later.
Family worst was a tie between the 1984 Olds Delta 88, and sis’ 94 Olds Achieva. Both died mechanically long before their time with neither one making 140,000 miles. The Delta 88 ate 3 TH-200 transmissions and one valve. the underAchieva, well, the infamous Quad OHC timing chain issues kept cropping along with various modules dying. The 92 LeSabre was initially a lemon, but proved itself after the warranty ran out – it was flawless. Under warranty, it had to be towed to the dealer about 4 times, after that, it was the proverbial swiss watch.
Anything with a 4T65E! My wife drove a 2000 Century and a 2004 Impala, both with the 3100/3400 engine, and at a certain mileage, the transmission would shift harshly into all gears after about a half hour of driving.
In the Impala, I installed a shift kit, and it mostly solved the problem. Apparently, when the transmission gets some miles on it and slips a bit, the computer jacks line pressure up to maximum, and every gear change is HARSH. Since the shift kit speeds up shifts, the computer never gets the message to jack up line pressure. When the transmission shifts hard, it also emits a whining noise whenever you accelerate. I hear cars with 4T65Es whining all around town to this day. Even when I traded it in, the Impala would still hang in “neutral” at a stop and slam into gear as the engine revved up (yes, the fluid was full).
Anyway, lots of people on the internet seem to have this problem, but with two cars in a row with the same issue, I’ll never buy anything with that transmission again. I can’t believe they never fixed that problem in five model years (and probably longer!).
There are Sonix repair kits for this issue on the aftermarket along with several others. We had a few 2000-2001 cars go through our dealership with this issue and a good transmission service and some Trans X bought the customer several years before the pressure solenoid had to be replaced.
I would take a 4T65 or any Ford or Chrysler junk Ultra-drive in these years.
Saturn Ion. Twice. We purchased a new Ion and it was ok except for the lousy seats and the super irritating automatic door locks. Until the check engine light came on for the evap system. The dealer tried 3 times to fix it and even brought in their specialist to no avail. We asked for an identical replacement car and got one, after a few weeks, the same problem arose. Lemon law attorney and a trip to Toyota solved the problem. I was beside myself to see that the General had fallen so hard. I’ve been working on an ’03 GMC 1 ton Duramax and am ready to burn a few engineers and bean counters at the stake. What a lousy excuse of a vehicle.
I can’t say they were mine, but my boss of 8 years wife’s 87 Sedan ‘d Ville and my dad’s 88 Suburban were complete junk. I called ’em “below horrible”. I was indeed a eye witness to their many problems. And I personally picked both of them up at the various dealer’s they were sent to a few times as well. Boss’s wife didn’t leave GM but purchased one of the Olds 98’s that inspite of being blandly designed turned out to be quite reliable. Identical to the one from a couple of CC’s ago. My dad went back to Ford. My family were not import buyers. Even though by then most were made here. My dad was an old fashioned midwest union guy. Our other GM vehicles were ok, like my dad’s 69 Chevy C10 ( owned from 69 to 81) and their 91 Corvette held up pretty well. So no other real DS disasters to speak of.
An Isuzu hombre was my first new vehicle. It wasn’t that bad of a truck overall, but the dealership experience for warranty service was terrible. From the time I bought it, it had this issue with the front lugnuts…they would loosen and the wheels would make a clicking sound. I’d tighten them, and they’d loosen themselves in about 500 miles. So I took it to the dealer. 5 times. The last time I took it in, I may have been an asshole. So, they fixed it, by swapping the sae lugnuts for the next size smaller metric version and impacting them on. I didn’t find out about it until I had a flat and couldn’t get them loose. So, anyway, I’ve not bought a new GM since, and won’t again.
FYI,
My father worked for the Oliver rubber company back in the ’50’s. They made the rubber body sealing gaskets, window and door seals used by the big three. He told me that GM spec’d the cheapest rubber available while Ford and MoPar used better grades.
The only GM car which I have ever owned was a ’69 Chevelle which was ten years old at the time. The interior stunk of mildew (due to numerous interior leaks and the trunk would fill with bucketfuls of water every time it rained. I have never experienced the level of body leakage in any other brand of car that the Chevy did.
I can vouch for GM water leaks. A 68 Chevy Biscayne, a 70 Impala, and a 70 Pontiac Catalina, all leaked around the back windows and trunk. They all stunk like mildew too. Ah, the good old days with the rose colored glasses off.
My grandmothers (which I own now) 74 Impala stayed rust free until just 2 years ago. Then just like magic, the rear window channel started disappearing. I’m barely keeping on top of it. But at least the rest of it is holding together.
Interesting. This might explain why my various 70s and 80s G-van’s door seals were shot/torn/missing before they reached 9 years of age, but my Fords have excellent original seals at 40 years.
Hi Paul,
I have had very positive and rewarding experiences with the GM cars that I have owned.
The 55, 56, 57, 58, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 67, 68, 70, 75, 79, 81, 82, 84, 85, 86, 93, 95, and 96 Chevy BelAirs, Impalas, Rivieras, Buick Elektras, Pontiac Parisienne Broughams, and Safari Wagons and Roadmaster Limited Wagons have been great cars. I am still driving my 65 Impala SS convertible, my 1985 Safari Wagon, my 1986 Parisienne Brougham, my 1993, 1995 and three 1996 Roadmaster wagons. One of my 1996 Roadmaster Limited wagons was featured in a Curbside Classic Post last year. My success is due to keeping with the cast iron Chevy drive trains with rear wheel drive. The Roadmasters have 225k-275k and look showroom new. My economic equation with cars is based on spending no more than ten cents per amortized mile. The only cars that I have that equal the GM longevity are my Volvo 740, 940, 960 and V90 wagons which are capable of 350k miles and have been driven same.
I enjoy reading your posts. Gary
Well, there was the 69 Camaro with the 307 and the 3 speed auto – 2 years newer than G. Poon’s 67 described above, but with the exact same problems – broken motor mounts and broken rear leaf springs. However the car that guaranteed I would never considering buying a GM car actually belonged to a Japanese guy working at my wife’s company. He was only going to be in the States for a couple years with his company and wanted a new (1989) Z-28 “ because I’ll never have another chance to own one“. I helped him buy one; He was shocked at how crudely and how cheaply built it was and how old fashioned (solid rear axle? Really?) it was. He liked driving it though. However right at 12,100 miles the right front wheel bearing failed. In those days, GM still only offered a one-year 12,000 mile warranty. So, when we went to the dealership, the first answer was “Tough luck, buddy“. Embarrassed for America in front of my Japanese friend, I spoke to the Service Manager and he came through with a free repair. However, he solved the problem, by lying to General Motors and reporting the mileage as 11,100 rather than 12,100 because otherwise they wouldn’t pay for the repair. This was a clear message for me that GM as a corporation had absolutely no intention of standing behind their products beyond the absolute minimum required. Either the Service Manager had no “Good Will” budget from them, or he had already burned it up on similar problems. Either way, GM clearly didn’t give a damn.
At the same time, I was driving an Acura Integra with a 4-year, 50K mile warranty, and had recently had my muffler replaced at the 15,000 mile service. Oddly I hadn’t noticed any problem and hadn’t asked for even an examination of the exhaust. I just happened to notice it was listed as warranty work on my invoice -no charge. Of course though, I asked the Acura Service Manager about it, and was told “we noticed some rust spots and that shouldn’t happen on a car with 15,000 miles, so we replaced it.”
Guess which company left the impression that they really wanted me as a repeat customer, and which obviously didn’t give a hoot?
Worst- 95 quad4 alero. Alternator, lower control arms rusted out, atf fluid leak, oil leaks,,,cheap shit interior, It rode like garbage…punishing ride and the 4t60e transmission would up shift as fast as possible andthe quad4 would start bucking at 45mph. Then it lost gears 3 and 4. I hated it so I drove it for a year with 2 gears till it shit the bed.
Then my next car 3800 powered regal was a gem as far as reliability, fuel economy and power goes. It had the same transmission with the same shift points so it could handle 4th gear with the torque of the 3800. That’s how cheap gm was. They wouldn’t even reprogram the shift points for the 4t60e trannys in the 4 bangers.
Not mine but it would probably be my Dad’s Tahoe that he special ordered in 1997 and the transmission died with 400 miles on it…Hasn’t stopped him from buying another one as he’s on Tahoe number 4 but this may be the last…one of his daytime running lights is out and apparently the bumper needs to be removed to replace it or something ridiculous though that’s not his reason for switching cars. Or I can’t forget my Grandparent’s early 1980s Regal Sedan that wouldn’t start due to an ignition switch issue but that may have been due to age…I remember waiting in a Publix parking lot in Tampa for many hours for someone to come and fix it…Just remembered that my mom had a ’81 Century Wagon (bought new) that had a serious overheating issue for most of the time we owned it. A Vega Estate Wagon was traded in for the Century Wagon…My family has owned a lot of questionable cars from many brands yet we’ve never said…”I’m never going to buy another (insert name here)”. My personal GM experiences have all been in rental cars. Probably my least favorite GM rental car would be a Buick Encore…slow and felt like it would tip over, switched it out for a Verano. However, I’ve recently rented a 2016 Cruze and 2 2016 Malibus and would choose them over a Corolla or Camry any day.
My dad’s 75 Electra Limited coupe dying during a return trip on a fishing expedition to Maryland. The transmission. Dad always said GM’s Hydra-Matic was tempramental. It died a couple of more times before he died, and my mom traded it in for a brand new 85 Buick Regal Limited Coupe.
Interesting considering the 1985 Regal would have come with the Metric 200 transmission which was known to be weak and the 75 Electra would have had one of the best transmissions available at the time GM’s THM 400.
Surprisingly my worst GM car was not the Vega I owned for a few years in the seventies. Sure, it had its share of problems but I was young enough then that they didn’t really bother me that much. I had grown up working on my cars to keep them mobile and was still willing to put in some labor on the Vega.
Instead, the worst GM car I’ve owned was a 2001 Pontiac Grand Prix GT, purchased new from Wright Pontiac-Cadillac here in Evansville. I mention the dealer’s name as my experiences with the dealer contributed to my dissatisfaction. The Grand Prix (with the 3800 V6/AOD combo) actually was not a bad car to drive; it was reasonably peppy, got decent gas mileage and the front seats were comfortable. The problem was that the GP snacked on power steering pumps, requiring a new one every 6-7 months. I don’t know if this was some sort of design flaw or something unique to this car but every six months or so it was the same thing, the power steering pump would begin to squeal and you knew it was time for a new one. Needless to say I got to be on a first name basis with the service manager and service writers at the Pontiac dealer. The process was always the same, I would drop the car off on my way to work, pick up a rental car, and then wait for the late afternoon phone call telling me that I needed a new power steering pump. This was always a two day process as the dealer didn’t have a replacement power steering in stock and one had to be “shipped in”. After the third or fourth time I asked the service manager why they couldn’t keep at least one power steering pump in stock and take a day off the process. I was told that management wouldn’t let them do that.
When the extended warranty ran out after five years the Grand Prix only had about 42,000 miles (I hadn’t even had to buy new tires) but there was no way I was keeping the car and be out of pocket every six months for a new power steering pump. I traded it away for a Toyota Solara and have not been tempted by a GM product since. Oh yes, sort of an addendum, when GM axed the Pontiac brand they pulled the Cadillac and GMC franchises from this dealer and reassigned them to the local Buick store. The company is still in business selling used cars.
My guess would be a misaligned PS pump mount or bracket. The service advisor should have addressed this issue under warranty instead of mindlessly authorising repeated pump replacements.
Oh, I agree, and I’m pretty sure that I mentioned this to him, at least once or twice. Like many people he took the path of least resistance and hoped the problem would go away. In a sense it did because I traded the car for something else and never darkened their door again. In retrospect I wonder why someone at GM didn’t begin to question all of the pump replacements (all under warranty) and push back at the dealer.
Very few techs take the time to flush the steering system when they replace components, same as after a compressor grenades, the crap floating around the system ruins the new pump.
_THIS_ ~ NAPA has a nifty power steering filter that has a magnet inside it for just this purpose ~ you install it in the return hose and presto ! all the crap is filtered out, all you needs do is change the fluid once or twice until it remains clear and sweet smelling and you’re god to go .
Lazy Mechanics piss me off .
-Nate
Same with transmission coolers! Flush that thing out when you replace/rebuild a transmission or you’re asking for more of the same.
That was obviously an alignment issue that the dealer should have caught. We have seen 1000’s of cars go through my buddies dealership with this same exact power-train combo and never heard of this before.
Except for the power steering issue the Grand Prix was not actually a bad car. I refuse as a matter of principle to buy a four door vehicle for my personal use. As time goes by there are fewer and fewer two door cars available, at least in my price range. The 2001 Grand Prix coupe was stylish (except for the lower body cladding that Pontiac slathered on most of their cars then), comfortable and reasonably pleasant to drive. It was not a hot rod by any stretch of the imagination but it would keep up with traffic and would also return 30-32 MPG at 75 MPH. As long as I wasn’t paying for the repairs the mild inconvenience of being without the car for a couple days every six months was not a big deal.
I have not really been tempted to purchase any GM car since then. I did look at the revised Camaro when it first came out but was not impressed; the seating position was so low that it reminded me of the driver’s compartment of an M60A3 tank. I honestly can’t think of any current GM vehicle that even remotely interests me.
That’s easy, 2005 Chevy Equinox.
My family bought the Chevy Equinox on Labor Day weekend 2004, we had a 1996 Chevy Blazer that was getting a bit old and tired, but it was having problems and my mom wanted a new car. She liked the Equinox, it was the size that she wanted, it had enough room for all of us and friends, so we bought it.
Now, most of the problems I can remember went to that car being past its sell by date. It had transmission problems with it slipping out of gear, the leather seats cracked and wore badly, it was developing squeaks and rattles. Coolant managed to get into the engine one time, and once we moved back to San Diego, not a day went by where the car wasn’t at the dealership for some issue.
On top of that, it wasn’t just very good. The Blazer we had may have been older, cruder, and not as refined, but I remember it feeling better than the Equinox. The car wasn’t powerful, it wasn’t comfortable, it had a terrible HVAC system, the interior was still pretty cheap looking, it didn’t get very good gas mileage for a crossover, and everything seemed like accountants played fast and loose with slashing stuff to save a buck.
Amazingly, the car lasted 200k miles for a long time, finally meeting it’s end when my sister got into a car accident it in, totaling the front end and putting in end to the giant gold menace. My sister replaced it with a 2001 Subaru Forester, and while I have my gripes with that car, it didn’t feel like the penalty box that the Equinox was.
Of course, it is highly ironic that you posted this today. Considering that as I was driving my friend home, the engine to my Cadillac ended up overheating on the highway and I needed to call AAA to get it towed for a diagnostic. Hopefully, there’s nothing expensive and terrible that needs to be solved, but the fact that I stood in the rain for a good half hour while waiting for the truck isn’t how I wanted to spend my weekend.
Your almost 20 year old Northstar overheated and you “hope that there’s nothing expensive and terrible that needs to be solved”?
Bwah ha ha ha ha!
Oh dear. I’m sure Joseph knows the risks and is putting an optimistic spin on this. Unlike most of us he does not have transportation alternatives.
Cars will overheat for other reasons so his optimism is reasonable.
Good luck Joseph…please keep us informed.
Well, I got it back today. Thankfully, the overheating wasn’t caused by something wrong with the engine, and there was no damage sustained to it. The bad news was that my radiator had busted, which required a replacement as well as a coolant flush, combined with a new battery it was a 1K repair job. The car’s fine now, and it doesn’t look like there’s any more problems so far (He says as he crosses his fingers and prays to Henry Leland’s ghost that nothing goes wrong a month or two from now.)
Glad you are safe Joseph. Sorry it cost you $1,000. Hopefully, the car will be good for a while.
We’ve owned 5 GM cars and while three were junk, two were rock solid:
76 Cutlass – bought with 110k miles for $400. Got another trouble-free 50k miles out of it before it died during a cold winter when I was reluctant to go out and check the oil frequently enough.
95 Saturn SL2 – bought new. Got 200k trouble-free miles out of it before we sold it to some numbnuts who quickly destroyed it through neglect.
As for the junk:
83 Malibu – Think it had the 3.8 V6. Bought with only 60k miles but never ran right, was super slow and wouldn’t start if you let the gas tank get below half. Fortunately it was stolen and destroyed a few months after we bought it.
83 Century Coupe – 3.0 V6. Slow and guzzled gas. Bought it at 65k, lost the transmission at 80k. Car was in good shape otherwise so got it rebuilt. Then a month later the engine self-destructed. Had a factory sunroof that constantly leaked.
96 Cierra wagon – bought it with 30k miles. Had a front end shimmy nobody could seem to fix. Within a year the interior started falling apart and the windows would fall out of their tracks. Once it hit 60k it would break down every six months like clockwork and require a $300-$600 repair. Destroyed in a car accident at 90k. I got $4000 from the insurance company and used it as a downpayment on a Honda Odyssey. It’s been Honda and Toyota ever since and the difference is mind-boggling — I never fully appreciated how insultingly terrible GM cars were until I owned something better. It’s like GMs sole goal in designing a car was to deliberately make it into a big “f_ck you” to their customers.
Those Buick 3.0 carbureted V6’s were junk. Built between 1982-1985 they were essentially a higher revving 231 V6 built for transverse mounting. Why they bothered making this engine when the Chevy 60 degree 2.8 was not only smoother and quieter it was also much longer lasting in these light weight A-body cars is just another mystery of GM.
I can attest to them being junk. I had a 1984 Buick Century Limited Coupe with the infamous 3.0 V-6. Three engine rebuilds in 70k and I was done. I liked the Century itself so much that I bought an ’87 with the 3.8 SFI V-6. One of the best cars I ever owned!
I liked my Century too, apart from the mechanical issues – my first 2-door car, first car with power windows and door locks, cushy velour seats, and the huge sunroof could be taken out and, with the windows down, practically made the car into convertible.
Also, I think you and I have had this same conversation here before…
Yes we did some years back! My sunroof leaked like a waterfall too!
My worst experience came from a car which is not a true GM car but belongs to its galaxy, namely a korean-built Chevrolet Spark.
I rented one when I was going to the family hometown in Corsica.
Driving a small manual underpowered car in Corsica is a big fun : you push the engine, make quick downshifts and upshifts, cut through curves, making your own private rally run.
Well, the Spark was just a big bore. Engine was buzzing like a vacuum cleaner, reluctant to gain RPM, the gearbox was uninspiring, the electrically assisted steering has an arcade-style feeling and the brakes were kind of on/off. No way to do your own ramly with that car.
All in all, it was one of the most uninspired car I’ve ever driven, a true appliance. Exactly the opposite of sparkling. Calling it a Chevrolet Dull would have been closer to reality.
Also had a 81 V6 Chevrolet Malibu. I loved that car but I reckon it has the worst built-quality I’ve ever seen, much worse than french cars of that era (whose bad built-quality is notorious), nearly entering Lada territory…
On the other hand, I’ve been the owner of 79 Caprice for 3 years. Except for some initial troubles caused by a long period of immobilisation, I’ve done 40.000 km without major trouble. Not bad for an almost 40 yo car.
Worst: 1998 Jimmy I bought new. Repeatedly cut off, sometimes on the highway at 65mph. Sometimes in traffic. Very dangerous, obviously. Ignition switch replaced twice under warranty but it kept happening. Traded it for a new 2001 4Runner and never owned another GM anything ever again.
Best: 1990 Century I bought slightly used in grad school. It was cheap and comfy. Kept it in good shape but drove it well over 100,000 miles. Got what I paid for it as a trade in value. No joke. “Free” miles. Not one thing broke or failed.
I love the A-body cars. At least if they are 1984 and newer without the Buick 3.0 2BBL V6. We still have customers coming in asking for one, especially the wagons with he bullet proof 3300 Buick motors.
I had a Cierra wagon with the 3.1 V6 and it was decidedly non-bulletproof.
The 3.1 60 degree V6’s have a reputation for being troublesome. Theoretically, they shouldn’t be, but they are.
The fuel injected 2.8L in my 1988 Beretta GT should have theoretically been as bulletproof as the carburetted version in my 1981 Citation. But it wasn’t.
The Beretta was the biggest piece of garbage GM car I ever owned. The 1991 Saturn SC2 I replaced it with was the best, hands down.
Our 95 Saturn SL2 was our best GM product.
I’ve owned and regularly driven four GM products.
1966 Pontiac Tempest four door – the OHC6 was already dead when I got the car, so I swapped in a SBC. It was fun, but I only kept it about a year and sold it to have a down payment on a Suzuki Samurai. It was pretty reliable as I remember.
1971 Chevrolet Vega sedan – easily had the most problems with this car, but it’s also still the one I would rank first or second as cars I’ve liked best. Being my first, I learned to wrench on it, and it had over 220K miles when I used it as a trade-in. Handled great, even after the heavier Buick V6 swap.
1982 Chevrolet Cavalier Type 10 hatchback – two main problems come to mind with this car. First, the Used dealer did not disclose prior body damage (my first purchase at a dealer), and the smog pump siezed at around 90K miles. I fixed it with a shorter v-belt (bypassed it, in other words). Yes, it was buzzy and slow to build speed, but it handled like it was on rails (I did a bunch of mods). Another fun car, despite its unrefined nature.
1987 Chevrolet Spectrum four door sedan – this rebadged Isuzu was about as uninspiring a vehicle as one can imagine. Its draw for us was that it had four doors and we were expecting our first child. Drove 33K miles in one year, by which point it was a rattling, oil-leaking mess. It would be replaced with an ’89 Honda Civic Hatch, and was the last (purchased*) GM product to soil my driveway.
*I also had possession of my deceased paternal grandmother’s ’77 Nova four door for a few months before selling it for my Dad.
Tempest.
Vega notchback.
Like, Ed. More rear seat room as well. Still good looking after all these years.
As the owner of a 4.1 Buick V6, i’ve wanted a Vega for the transplant. Alas, everyone with a Vega assumes your going to SBC it into a drag car so Vega’s have become horribly overpriced. Amazing considering it was a worse (usually) car than a Pinto which are still (sometimes) available for a fair price.
Cavalier Type 10.
Sputum, er, Spectrum.
What else but a new ’72 Vega! Fortunately I had a front row seat to observe this fiasco but didn’t own the turd. My future ex-wife tolerated this heap for 18 months and that was it. The disaster by which all others are judged.
My Saturn ion. This is maybe my 8th or 9th gm vehicle, and ironically the most expensive car I had, purchased for $4400 cad when it was seven years old. Every suspension component, many of them twice or more, THREE manual transmissions, (each time its been deemed to be output shaft bearings, not that I’ve ever run it dry, and there are certainly no mods putting too much power down, oh no….) An appallingly cheap interior, and an intermittent no start problem that meant many tow truck rides before shorting out the clutch switch (with a paperclip).
It lacks any fun to drive feeling, save for the fact that I’ve resigned myself to the fact that I will be the final owner, and can treat it accordingly.
I think much of the Opel engineering was well done and I love the smooth and efficient ecotec engine, but the plastic body panels and generally low quality mean this will likely he my last gm vehicle. Shame, too, as I want to like general motors products.
I can say, amen, Alexis. But the polymer panels [an asset] and strong engine and trans [automatic] are the biggest positives of my 05 ION.
Ironically, I’ve have only had out of pocket expense on the 2nd set of sway bar bushings at 64,000 miles.
The rest was covered under warranty, recall and extended recall. GM lost a lot of money on warranty costs. It’s no wonder they can’t make money on small cars.
BTW: GM gave itself a Boss Kettering Award in 2002 for that POS “low draw” ignition switch.
After 11 years it finally works as well as the one in my 63 Valiant. Now that it’s fixed I think I’m good for another 11 years and 65,000 miles.