People certainly tend to become creatures of habit. Even if you aren’t prone to it, you know those who are. Sometimes you just need to challenge them (or yourself).
Realizing this, I have been thinking outside my box lately.
My beloved ’93 Buick Century is what has prompted it. It has been a great car, but despite it having just under 65,000 miles, time and deferred maintenance is starting to make its ugly presence known. If we stayed closer to home, it wouldn’t be a big deal. However, our trips are either five miles into town or over one hundred–there is nothing in between. My parents and in-laws are starting to become of a certain age; Mrs. Jason’s parents are closer as they live 110 miles away with mine living 230 miles away. One must keep a firm grasp upon the realities of life.
Realizing the totality of every vehicle I have ever owned has had a Ford, Dodge, Plymouth, Chrysler, or Buick nameplate, I challenged myself to think outside my box. So in an effort to expand my horizons, I recently test drove…
…this spiffy diesel powered Volkswagen Jetta. It was couple of firsts for me; the first VW and the first European nameplate. I have ridden in numerous examples of both, but have never partaken.
It was very nice and the heated seats were terrific for the 15 degree Fahrenheit day. Best of all…
…it had six forward gears I could choose from. It was a hoot to drive except that the console was entirely too close to my right leg. I did not buy it, and I’m still deciding my direction.
As an aside, my criteria was a Jetta with either the 1.8 liter gasoline or 2.0 liter diesel engine hooked to a manual transmission and not painted white. Out of 96 Jetta’s on the lot, this was the only one that fit that criteria.
I have triumphantly stepped out of my box, which leads to my question(s): When was the last time you stepped out of your automotive box? What was it? And, were you pleasantly or unpleasantly surprised?
Stepped out twice. Always have preferred Fords (and American cars in general) but way back when I bought a ’75 Volvo 164E, and several years later a ToyoNova. Regretted it both times.
Im not sure about this one…out of the box has been my box since day one, having had all sorts of trash with character from renaults to old cop cars. Owned a honda once, a 77 cvcc civic, never a Toyota, and currently DD a 06 TDI jetta. Buy the jetta, change the TB when you have to, and smile, they are a hoot! We get 45 mpg average, and FWIW, if I had to say, an older manual TDI is the cheapest cost per mile going, as you can get a older one, say 2000-2005 in decent shape and mileage for 5-7 k, and never sell it, just keep rolling up the miles with reg oil changes and TB changes. I know other things will wear, as they will with all cars, but other than a Prius, nothing consistently gets the fuel economy like a TDI, but the Prius used are double to triple to buy. Just never, I repeat never get a automatic or DSG TDI and expect to keep it out of warranty. Go manual, and have fun!
A predictably catastrophic Fiat 130 Coupe forced me to buy a cheap runaround. Datsun 280C saloon. I would have been more prejudiced against Japanese cars than almost anyone else I know before I bought this car. Completely, and I mean completely, changed my way of thinking.
Ahh…a 130 coupe. I’ve heard nothing but horror stories, and that includes one from an original owner when they cost the same as an SLC and had factory parts support. They’ve invariably been tolerated because they are so beautiful, but even that routine has its limits. Please write that episode up for our education! BTW, I’ve never owned one but almost bought a pair of NOS RHD headlamps from a junkstore in Castlemaine years ago, but my right thinking wife decided there were better options to spend $2200 on. So I left with spiral bound 356B owner’s manual instead but kept thinking about the 130. Last sighted a 130 sedan in the wild about 3 years ago – white with red leather – very unexpected. Other than that it would have to have while been watching “The Mechanic” with Charles Bronson!
Yep, that story for the right moment. I was talking to an old friend about it last weekend. He had a DBS V8 for a while, and he was freaking in admiration at my Coupe ownership! Of course we ended up having a mutual lovefest. I always figured I’d replace the headlights with twin circles a la 124 coupe (ducks flying beer bottles), its actually the rear lensware I’m mostly worried about. Without those, the whole design is lost. I think the last NOS sets went on the Frua Rolls Royces.
*Holding fire – temporarily*
Nevermind about Frua, I bet the ambers went cloudy and look pretty ordinary by now. Time to engineer a new batch, sell to the world – and recoup just pennies on the dollar. It will continue a familiar theme…
Yep. With LED and 3D printing, things are looking on the up for lensware.
Don’t have the Coupe anymore, so story comes with another spotted example. Saw a black one driven by a beautiful female about a year ago. Alas, mobile phone/driver laws precluded capture of said example. I am in love, however.
I hadn’t heard of the Frua Rolls Royces Don, but now that I’ve google-imaged them I suspect I’ll be blind for weeks. Even when I close my eyes their spectacular hideousness is burned on the back of my eyelids. I’d rather something as pretty as the 130 coupe was emblazoned there… Not sure if we got the coupes here, but we did get the 130 sedan, a particularly fine one was for sale recently. But let’s face it, as a Nissan fanboi, after reading your words “Datsun 280C”, I became all misty eyed and lost interest in anything else 😉
260C article on the cards. Stay tuned.
😀
Bring on the Japanese Broughams please !
I recently bought an Olds Bravada because I got into the mood of helping someone close to the wife and I. Fourth Olds. Three have shafted me soundly. No more GM mid sized SUVs for me.
I have always gone with the least powerful available engine in any car I’ve bought. However when buying a used Suzuki Grand Vitara for a posting in Haiti, the best deal available to us on short notice was the V6. Turned out to be ideal for driving around the twisty hills above Port au Prince, where you often encounter slow moving trucks and have very few ( and short) opportunities to pass.
I stepped outside of my box at a fairly young age.
My first several vehicles were all manual transmission-equipped American-made trucks or SUVs.
Economic circumstance and dumb luck (combined with a recent engine and tranny replacement in one of said trucks) put me in a position to purchase my mother’s automatic 4-cylinder Camry. Needless to say, the price was right (but fair). I couldn’t say no, even though I considered it a huge step down from 4×4 stick shift bad-assery. The last thing I wanted at age 22 was a four-door commuter car that screamed “practical!!!”
Of course, that Camry became the best car I’ve ever owned, giving me 180,000 flawless miles on top of the 85k it already had. I still own it, though it is on reserve with a broken timing belt repair forthcoming—the first time it has ever left me stranded. In addition to being reliable, cars of the Camry’s nature are almost invisible to law enforcement—seriously, try it—and that was a major advantage to early 20s me.
Things have now changed money-wise, and I’m able to once again afford a gas-guzzling V8 stick-shift 4×4 3/4 ton ‘Murican truck. But I supplement it with—get this—another Camry that I purchased from my mother (this Camry replaced her last Camry).
The moral of the story is: if you want to own a giant domestic behemoth-mobile, always keep a cheap Japanese car on the side (or two).
Amen brother
You are preaching to the choir here. I just love the reliability and daily friendliness of any Toyonda vehicle. They go for years on only the most rudimentary maintenance.
So do Panthers 😀
While I love Panthers, you cannot roller-skate in a buffalo herd, so they are not really a good option here.
You can’t roller skate in a buffalo heard, but you can be happy if you’ve a mind to…
Having just test driven a Jetta Sportwagen TDI as part of our protracted car search, I concur that it’s a fun drive, although ours was automatic.
Don’t you step out of the box every time you get out of your Scion?
Just as I do whenever exiting my son’s 89 Grand Marquis.
Nicely played 😀
Bingo! 🙂
We love our 2013 TDI Sportwagen. It’s Toffee Brown, with a manual. Zero problems so far at 25k. Averages 42 mpg even with some city driving.
Tee-hee!
Jason:
If you decide to stay outside the box, and continue to consider the VW Tdi, spend some time on tdiclub.com first. Lots of useful information there, including that the Passat Tdi generally gets better fuel mileage than the Jetta, especially on short trips, due to using Urea Injection rather than a Diesel Particulate Filter for emissions control. The burn-off cycle on the DPF tends to use a lots of fuel if you are mostly making small trips.
Hearing things about VW transmissions. Both in the press and via friend of friend.
Manuals are reliable as dirt. DSGs, not so much.
That is very good to know. I asked the salesman (who reminded the wife of Tintin) about urea; he was clueless. I had noticed the EPA ratings for the Passat to be higher and wondered why.
My research on BADs (Big Assed Diesels) of the Deere-Cat-Detroit-Cummins persuasions, indicate that the urea treatment eats up about one gallon for every 20 gallons of diesel. Last time I checked they weren’t giving urea away, but I have no idea what the stuff costs. Point being, urea comes with a cost. And where do you buy the stuff?
@Kevin, where do you live? Lots of Truck Stops here in the great American Southwest. Urea is cheap bought in that bulk. I assume with the popularity of diesel trucks that most Auto Zone and NAPA carry the stuff too.
Dan, I live in Salt Lake. I base my comments on urea from research I did a couple of years ago for a new rail system in northern California that would make use of RDCs (rail diesel cars). I don’t drive a diesel, but we (the Team) were concerned with the operational realities of running with urea. Rail operators don’t always place playing by the book as a priority, and under EPA Tier 4, if you let your urea run out, you, as they say, are f***ked. The system shuts down. This tends to piss off commuting customers. Deere and Cummins, at the time, were adamant that they would come up with a Tier 4-compliant system that did not require urea. After our client lost the bid for this particular rail system, I lost contact with Tier 4-compliant diesels. In essence, urea is a band-aid, and a potential pain in the ass, as is the whole Tier 4 scene.
When doing my fleet gig (an other duty as assigned) I purchased six Ram 5500 trucks all using urea. This was in mid-2010; it was not cheap or plentiful at the time. Actual usage was supposed to be around 3% to 5%, very much in line with what you have found.
At this point I’m thrilled with the idea of a diesel, but I’m not sure how thrilled I would actually be with a diesel.
I love my diesel! Smooth, quiet, economical. Having said that, being old-tech it’s not quick. I suspect a lot of the smoothness and the 5,400rpm (!) redline are due to it being an un-stressed straight 6. Four-cylinder diesels I’ve driven have not been terribly pleasant places to be. Back in 2010 I drove a brand new BMW 120d a co-worker got as a courtesy car while his 135i was being serviced, and I was horrified at how noisy and coarse that engine was. Loads of grunt mind you, but ruined the car. I’d rather have smooth and quiet.
They have big jugs, I think 2.5 gallons, at Walmart for one place. I’m sure many auto parts stores carry it too.
Yep. Usually in the oil aisle alongside the Chevron Delo and Shell Rotella T.
Our Touareg TDI used urea (called AdBlue by VW). In 10,000 miles it uses less than 5 gallons. It’s available for under $4/gallon at Autozone. Total non-issue.
its still got a DPF and Dual Mass Flywheel? Is your local towing service friendly?
My 2011 Jetta TDI with the DSG averages about 36 mpg, all city driving.
I’m getting high 30s on Winter Blend (’13 Beetle TDi, 6 speed manual, no urea). Low-mid 40s on straight diesel during warmer months.
I stepped outside of the box when I drove my cousin’s new VW Passat diesel a few months ago. I could not believe the fit and finish of the car and his fuel mileage has been sinful. I would like to have one for a month to get it out of my system, but then again it might leave me addicted.
Actually, the vehicle I traded for my 500 was a bit of step out of bounds.
After I bought my recumbent, I found that a Ford Focus sedan did not make a good recumbent bike hauler. I would up with a used Kia Rondo, thinking I could get it paid off before the major maintenance bills would come due. I didn’t plan on moving from Rancho Cucamonga, CA to Rensselaer, NY or paying $400 to replace a spark plug.
I looked around, but knew I didn’t want in to debt for the coin a small CUV would run, and I wanted better gas mileage now that I was not taking a train to work. As I said before, I started out with the 500L, but wound up a plain 500. so far, so good.
Yikes! 400 bucks for one spark plug? When Mark Miller Subaru in Salt Lake wanted around $600 for a 30K mile service, I asked my wife why. She said that the service manager told her she would need spark plugs and an oil change (synthetic). She had had the oil changed at the dealer a month before (I guess their computers weren’t working or the svc mgr didn’t know how to use one). Plus, spark plugs are part of the emissions system and by law must make it to 75k in Utah, otherwise, it’s a warranty issue. I mentioned this to my wife. And gosh-all-hemlock, after a call to the thieving bastard dealer, these charges were rescinded. My wife got her new Subaru two weeks later at Nate Wade Subaru, a couple of blocks north. Caveat emptor.
It had a V6 engine, and of course they bad module was on the rear, which meant ‘rocking’ (tech’s term) the engine to get to it. Probably didn’t help that it was at the dealership for its third recall under my ownership, and the Kia franchise had gone through a game of musical chairs. It went from being an adjunct of the L-M dealer to a ‘You have a pulse? We can get you in a new car!’ place. The FCA dealer is BBB+ rated, and so far, they seem ok.
Jana,
I thought Kias came with a 100,000 mile warranty. Is this another example of trying to pull one over on dumb babes? My wife has two undergraduate degrees along with two masters. She ain’t no dummy. Take that, Mark Miller!
A friend of mine recently bought a new flagship KIA. It has had a pampered life living in a closed in garage and hand washes. It has less than 5,000 miles on it and the clear coat is peeling. The fight is on! If I had not already heard of these issues with KIA I would believe his car had been damage in shipping and repaired.
I hope he will sale the car, take the hit and go buy himself a new Lexus ES where the dealership we deal with would not let peeling paint be an issue.
Got some bad news: Korean cars get electrical problems after the warranty is up. That is five years. Korean cars are some of the most rational designs in the world, designed to last to specific time and distance. Right around 100,000 km, your Hyundai or Kia (same thing, really) will start with check engine lights and sensor replacement. These are a pain and not cheap at a dealer, where most fools go.
They are cheap, though. A stripper Elantra L goes for $12,995, a good three grand less than the same Corolla. The Corolla is still worth it, especially at resale or you want to drive it into the ground. The Elantra is great if you want to keep it five years and sell it.
It will be interesting to see how mine plays out. My mechanic tells me that most problems he has seen on the older ones are caused by cash-strapped owners who dump them at the end of the 100k warranty after a lifetime of deferred maintenance. Ours will certainly live an easy life: adult driven, garaged, and about 12k/yr, half of which is on interstates. Still, your concern is one of the reasons I went with the stipper – less to go wrong and not as much invested if everything goes to hell.
If you buy used, they warranty is only good for 60,000 miles – it had 67,000. And yeah, they pulled the ‘Little Lady’ routine on me.
Unfortunately, I stepped out of the box with a used 1998 Volkswagen Passat I bought in 2002. I traded in a 1994 Accord with 153,000 miles on it to purchase the low mileage Passat that caught my eye on a local dealer’s ramp in front of the showroom. It had only 24,000 miles on it and was a 5-speed turbo. One drive and I was sold. My wife loved it too. Unfortunately, it was a car plagued with electrical problems. The A/C failed on a hot summer day, the power windows would mysteriously open and close on their own, and the turbo went at 35,000 miles. There were constant issues with the coil pack so at times it would not start right away. Volkswagen was kind enough to help with some of the repairs because it was now out of warranty. I never felt like I could trust that car and traded it for a new 2003 Accord.
I am still hearing these stories about VW and for that reason I do not have the guts to own a VW or Audi, but they sure are nice looking cars with a great fit and finish. One day when I am old I will regret not having taken a chance on one.
The late 1990s through mid 2000s were not good years for VW. Sadly, my new ’13 Beetle is already exhibiting signs that VW is still getting its act together. This one will probably be my last (new) VW.
I was wondering if that was going to happen….sorry to hear it, though. I’m curious; what are the issues?
I like to step out of the box when renting a car. The risk is very limited. It is a great way to experience a car if you are looking to get another one or not.
Examples: ’86 Dodge Colt (or was it a Mitsubishi?) It matched my ’86 Mazda 323 hatch quite well. O.K both are boxes.
A Dodge Shadow with 6 cylinder engine, a hoot to drive but would I buy it? No.
Mid ’90s Kia Optima, not bad but not convincing.
Early ’90s’ Grand Am. I couldn’t stand the warning bells, It’s worse than living next to the catholic church in a German town.
2000 Grand Prix. Now that was a nice car to drive. Consumer Reports called it mediocre. I have no idea why. Even the kids noticed that “Pontiac Power”.
’03 VW Passat TDI Combi in Germany and France. Wow, unbelievable, going 225 km per hour while the family sleeps, planted to the concrete like on rails. 50 miles per gal Diesel. But here in the US, reigned in by speed limits? That’s wasted money.
Test driving used cars is another opportunity: Lincoln LS V8. That’s a very nice drive.
’03 Mazda 6i: what a nice handling car. Double wishbone front suspension is so much better than McPherson truts.
Why is that “out of the box”? Because my box is a ’03 Ford Windstar minivan.
And the best opportunity to go out of the box is provided by Exotics Racing in Las Vegas and their competitors: 7 laps in a Porsche Cayman with a driving instructor for about $350 is definitely worth it. They have Ferraris and Lamborghinis and Audis as well.
It’s not bad to stay in a box that works for daily driving and then get something different or exciting for a short time when opportunity arises.
Your Grand Am story reminds me of one of the only times I’ve driven a rental. My friend flew out to Oregon to see Steely Dan at the Gorge, in Washington. He rented a P2Cruiser in Portland, and, for reasons I don’t recall, I drove most of the trip there and back. Anyway, the car ad an alarm beep if you drifted above 65, which is the max legal speed in Oregon. However, the limit in Washington is 70, and most traffic cruises along at 75ish, so we had hours of an annoying beep to listen to along with the stereo. Awful drive.
I could fall for a Chrysler product. It would be designed by Engel.
Wolfgang,
I attended a Catholic boarding school run by German-American monks. My dorm room was close to the bell tower. I applauded when lightning knocked out the bells. Temporary, but much appreciated.
Poor Quasimodo! Blitz und Donner!
Couldn’t remember his name, but his face rang a bell.
Intrusive center consoles are increasingly normal these days. I hate it.
I first thought outside the box when I bought my first Toyota. I know, not that far outside the box. But I was a dyed-in-the-wool buy American man.
I’ve stepped out twice, to the best of my recollection. An ’81 Accord sedan, and an ’85 Prelude. The Accord was definitely an eye opener, very reliable and comfortable for such a small car. The Prelude was fun and sporty, but the electronic system sucked, the car was essentially 50 million rust molecules holding hands by the time it went, and eventually the engine grenaded itself-it reminded me of one of my favorite sayings; a$$holes come in all colors.
That’s easy. After owning and driving nothing but Volvos for sixteen years, I bought my first Lincoln Town Car this past October. A car I’ve always loved but never thought I would actually own. Now I may totally switch over to Lincoln. The new MKZ is pretty sharp…
Tom, tell us it ain’t so! No more Volvos?
Time will tell…
I bought an FSO 125P because it was cheap and a genuine little old lady car with 11,000 miles.I was living in a war zone where good cars were damaged by drunken scrotes.An 8 year old cheapo was left alone when there were much costlier cars to pull mirrors off and slash tyres.I had it for 6 years and apart from a blown head gasket and a leak of hydraulic fluid when I drove over a piece of wood was totally reliable.I’d previously had mainly big 6 cylinder English Fords and Vauxhalls and a Mercury Comet and an AMC Javelin (both 6s)
Similar story. A friend was tired of getting his car damaged by vandals, so bought a ratty-looking rear-engine Skoda. Not only was it rather crummy-looking, but here in Australia most people wouldn’t have known what a Skoda was! He kept it until he needed a truck for work. I’m not sure how reliable it was, but he had at least two spare Skodas in his yard!
Reliability aside it would have been a good move just to have parts available.
Gem, please enlighten we unwashed. What is an FSO 125P?
Polski Fiat? based on the Fiat 124.
Yes not the horrid wedge shaped hatchback
Actually Wolfgang its worse than that- the Lada was based on the 124. However, the 125p was based on the ‘sportier’ Fiat 125 with twin headlamps. However, before getting all excited, it is worth remembering that this uses engines even more ancient than the 124- the 125p’s engines were from the Fiat 1300 and 1500 which dated back to the 1950s. Sporty they were not. However, having almost bought one, I can say they do have their charms. The engine is from the 50s and easy to work on, disc brakes all around (probably the only Comecon car that can stop), and a very cool interior with a strip speedometer like on a Volvo Amazon. In the UK they were always either a turquoisey blue that faded into powder or a red that faded into a powdery pink.
Yet another version of the Fiat 125, made by Poland’s FSO. Don’t think NZ got the 125P but we did get its heavily revised (to be more awful I believe) FSO Polonez sibling. You can’t mention owning a 125P without a photo and more details Gem!
The Polonez came with an early immobilizer: It was a hammer attached to the underneath of the bonnet.
CC did a feature on them last year.It’s a 1960s Fiat that was made in Poland with the OHV engine from an earlier model.
In buying my first car, I had it narrowed down to the small Volvo V40/C30 and the new Ford Focus. I wanted a smaller European car, so I got the Ford since it was a federalized version of the one they were selling in Europe. Also figured it would be cheaper to maintain.
I’m not into small FWD cars, but every time I see a Volvo C30 I want to leap out of the box and buy one. They look fantastic and are available with a red interior, what’s not to love!
I’m went out of my box and bought a box.
I usually drive Ford vehicles, but I really wanted a Honda Element. Almost everyone I spoke to about it was asking why I would want such an “ugly” vehicle, but I really wanted one. I looked and looked and set myself on getting the 4WD version, but here in Canada prices aren’t the same as the U.S. so it would cost me $35k+ (with taxes included). I kept hesitating and for a while just never moved forward.
In 2010 while looking for a new vehicle, I happened to stop by a local Honda dealer who had a brand new 2009 4WD Element in the show room with a sign that said “make an offer.” I froze. It was what I was looking for and the final price was absolutely amazing (I later found out that local dealers here did not like having them on their lots and they were quite eager to get rid of it).
I sat on whether to get it for a couple of days and then decided to take the plunge. That was 4 years ago and the vehicle has been amazing. There are still people who question why I would drive such a vehicle but I do like my Element. It can carry the most awkward of items and it’s been absolutely reliable. I also have become quite fond of the service I get at my local Honda dealer (they are much better than my prior Ford dealer).
I like the Element. Test drove one in 2007 and again in 2011, but both times found something else that fit our needs better.
Came close to buying one when replacing our totaled ’98 Caravan. The ’98 Grand Caravan we ended up getting was a great choice (still going at nearly 280,000 miles), but I always wish we had gotten the Honda (4wd, manual) instead.
I was close to getting a new Element in 2010 or ’11, but by that time the manual transmission was no longer available. I already had a Honda with an iffy automatic so I passed.
Ahh, the Element, the car that was supposed to be a surfin’ mobile and ended up being bought mb men with grey bears and Tilley hats. Instead of surfboards it carried model trains and garden Gnomes.
I liked the Element, but just could not do the asking price. Shame, really. I rather liked the “hose it out” interior and the plain black plastic body panels. That and the general reliability of a Honda, you couldn’t go wrong. I could see an awful lot of 2CV influence in the design, and that really appealed to me.
Honda had a hands-down winner. Too bad the company didn’t see it that way.
Unfortunately, the “hose it out” interior feature is not true. While it is easy to clean, taking a hose to it is not possible.
Every car has a ”hose-it-out” interior. Most just don’t look too good afterwards.
“Honda had a hands-down winner. Too bad the company didn’t see it that way.”
Honda thought they had a winner but the buying public didn’t see it that way, which is why it was left to wither on the vine and then discontinued.
I can’t think of a very solid, recent example but I have always been a lover of Japanese cars. A friend of mine was given a ’95 LeSabre something like ten years ago, though, and as much as I’m ashamed to admit it, I had very negative views of American cars before then.
I was disappointed with the Buick until one day when I rode from Columbus to Dayton in the back seat and was able to cross my legs and write a letter without the pen budging; it was that smooth. Since then, I’ve had a very open minded view of cars; I really love almost all of them.
I have stepped out of several boxes. Most recently, the first car bought with over 200K (96 Odyssey) and my first post-John Riccardo Chrysler (99 Town & Country).
Most recently, I stepped out of the box in buying a new 2012 Kia Sedona. I have never owned a Korean car, and was kind of leery. However, I was a price shopper. I might have been able to do as well with a Grand Caravan, but was leery of Chrysler’s new V6 (that seems to be turning out OK) while the Kia carried a 100K powertrain warranty. The Sedona was an accidental discovery that I found after testing a Sorento. “Holy crap, honey, look at the sticker on this one.” I think I got the most reasonably priced 7 psgr vehicle out there. Even better, I have been very happy with it.
Another out of the box aspect is that my prior new cars had both been fully loaded. This one had ZERO added equipment (and we had to search hard to find one like this). So, yes, my strippo Kia is a big out of box moment for me that is turning out nicely.
I think we’re about to step out of the box a bit for our next new car….stay tuned.
Amphicar?
You, of all people, will heartily approve! Stay tuned….it’s a ways away; I need to get it here.
Oh great a low mile 2008 TL, I heartily approve.
Nah, he made the owner of the 72 LTD an offer he couldn’t refuse. It’s not business, its family.
My money is on a Pacer with a powerglide and olds diesel swap
Maybe they just got the F100 fitted with an a/c unit?
F150 King Ranch? Or a new Ram Big Horn with the 3 liter diesel V6?
A 1980 Impala wagon with 300,000 miles set up to run on propane?
Acura TSX Sport Wagon…
Hmmm; what makes you say that? 🙂
You already ordered a 2015 Jeep Renegade ?
It’s hard to go wrong with a diesel VW with a manual gearbox. VW’s have improved their quality considerably in the last few years as well.
As far as stepping outside of my box, hmmm, I’m a die-hard Volkswagen guy and the ’87 BMW 325 was really far outside of that box and being that I grew up in Ford family the Ranger wasn’t really much of a stretch……
Good question, and I’ve stepped out of the box with car choices 2 times since 1994 (was it really that long ago??).
1) 1994. I had just turned 20, was in the final year of my BA, and owned a 1971 Ford Escort 1300 which was fun but v e r y s l o w. I always loved the style of the Ford Sierra, and in January ’94 an ’84 2.0 Sierra wagon turned up on the lot in my small home town. It was incredibly rusty and didn’t run so well, but was incredibly cheap. So I stepped out of the box and bought my first ever auto-trans car! It worked out very well, as although I’d previously though autos were for old people, I quickly grew to appreciate how smooth it made cruising. In fact, of all the cars I’ve owned since, all but two were autos.
2a and 2b) 2002. The ’86 Honda Accord auto I was driving had blown the engine (not my fault!). I’d always been intrigued by 1988-93’s C33 series Nissan Laurel, because they were genuine pillarless 4-door sedans, and came with so many awesome straight-6 engine choices. A ’92 ‘Grand Extra’ sedan turned up on the local lot really cheap (oil burner…) so I stepped out of the box and bought my first ever car that was a) white, and b) diesel. I thought white diesels were only bought by people who hated cars, but I quickly changed my mind. The white helped the nice styling stand out, and the old RD28 diesel was smooth and quiet, and could do 1,000km on a tank. This box-stepping-out ended well, as I’ve had two more diesel Laurels since then, and my current one is also white!
I should point out, no one else in my family is willing to try a diesel, but I’ll never have anything else now. Diesel is a lot cheaper than petrol here in NZ, and diesels are generally so much more economical! So box-stepping-out? Successful!
Your Escort 1300 was slow? A girlfriend from way back had an 1100 – automatic. THAT was slow!
And mine was a manual trans with a big carb etc too! It had identical performance to my cousin’s 1600 auto Esky. I’ve never seen an Escort 1100 auto before – the few 1100 manuals we got were glacial enough!
Yeah they make a Morris 1100 look like a performance car, I drove one once, walking is faster.
Outside of the box for me was a 2013 Regal GS. Although, I grew up in a GM family, so its not that far out. Actually, you can say it was totally in the box. Except that it is 4 doors instead of 2, I have 270 HP and a 6 speed Manual. You can still find new 13’s on Dealer lots for ~30k. (and if you look really hard a new 12 or 2 are kicking around as well)
How do you like it? There is a 2012 pearl white 6 speed at a Cadillac-Buick-GMC place that I sometimes pass by and browse after hours, I sat in the GS and it feels really nice.
These are really nice cars and a screaming deal used. I would buy one.
Just saw a base 2013 Regal locally here, new, for $34,000 and I am sure cash would get you $30k on a GM car. That is a great deal for a German made car. I have driven the Regal and they are really nice and feel solid. Not top of the heap but good and at low prices.
On the other hand, an Accord EX-L four cylinder is a very nice car and similar money. There is a huge array of Accords on the road here, true roaches. They seem to thrive on abuse.
Their actually Canadian made now, the first run was from Opel, but they switched to Canadian production midway through the first year or so, I would like to drive one to see what it’s like.
I looked at a 2011 recently at a local dealer, with all of 19,000 km on it. The car was a base unit but still very nice. The 2.4 was not exactly a powerhouse, but adequate. The best part was the price: the haha price was $16,900 and they would have taken $15,000 for it. New it was $39,995. A new 2013 can be had for $32,000 around here. Really a good car for that money.
I sat in a new 2014 Regal the other day. It was really sharp, and I could see that as a potential car for me. And I’m a 26 year old guy! Granted, my current car is a 2005 Impala LS…
Test drove a 5 speed 1999 Saab 9-3 convertible on a whim a couple of weeks ago. I’ve never driven a Swedish car or a turbocharged car before. I was surprised how much I loved it. If it wasn’t so thrashed, I may have seriously put an offer on it. Interior bits were a bit shabby though.
I just stepped out of the box for my new car – after years of suv’s starting when i was 16 (1967 Scout, 1976 Scout Traveler, 1985 Jeep Cherokee, 1992 Grand Cherokee, 2001 cherokee) i bought a Subaru Impreza. Much easier on the gas budget now that I’m commuting 80 miles a day. AWD is a must because of the winters.
Despite my passion for Amercican V8 iron, I’ve been toying with the idea of snagging a curved windshield Super Beetle and souping the hell out of it. 2168 cc with dual 48 IDA Webers, a mild Engle cam, remote oil cooler, mild lowering job, and classic 8-spoke Empi wheels.
I think I finally found my box … I started with a well-used 76 Courier mini pickup, went to a new 4-cyl/5 speed 87 Mustang, to a new 96 Cherokee 4wd (also manual), to my wife’s cast-off Miata, to a 100K-mile Explorer. So what do I have now? A Subaru of course, 6 cyl. Outback. Fits both the car-ish and truck-ish side of my automotive box. I sure wish it came with a manual though.
OK so my Daily Drivers and cars I often drive: 2004 F150, 1967 Mustang Convertible, 2005 Pontiac Vibe (wife’s car), 2009 Pontiac Torrent (in-laws-car)… all with much in common.
Stepping outside my box is how I view the fleet cars that I get to borrow from the district I work for. Over the years I’ve driven 1999-2007 Ford Tauruses, 2003 Ford Excursion V10 4×4 (talk about a school bus!), 2005 Equinox V6 AWD, a variety of 2000-2006 Tahoe/Yukon, and even 2009 Dodge Journey SXTs with FWD V6, third row seat and few other options.
I consider these drives to be extended test drives – could I live with this car? How does it hold up to abuse? Fleet maintenance in the districts view point consists of gas, oil, air for the tires, and tire changes. They keep vehicles for 200,000 miles.
Verdicts: Taurus is a great first car for a kid now that they’re 10 years old.
The Excursion drives like you need a CDL to own one and drinks gas in a way that would make a late 60s Fleetwood blush.
1st generation Equinox, LOUD inside, 3400 V6 is over-matched and revs to a point when entering the freeway that makes you fear for its longevity. The interior is cheap and awful. It seems designed to make you go buy a Suburban.
The Tahoe/Yukon hold up to abuse in a way that would make the biggest GM fanboi proud. I’ve driven examples with 100,000+ abusive district miles and you would never know they had more than 50,000 if you didn’t look at the odometer. Tight and well constructed. Oddly driving one usually pissed me off because I felt like every GM vehicle could be that good if the General gave a damn.
As much as the “pre-Fiat” Journey is criticized by the press, I liked it. My wife is pushing for a “three row” CUV but I’m a wagon man at heart. The old 3.5V6 was decently powerful, the 6 speed auto was solid, the interior was like a Swiss army knife with the hidden compartments and thoughtful little touches. The ride was even pleasant.
I’ve never owned a “Crisis-lyer” but I’m thinking 2011 (the depreciation is huge) 3.6 V6, 6 speed auto, AWD, three row – Journey. I’ll pretend its a 300hp AWD station wagon. She’ll be happy and I’ll be happy.
Having worked in GM service the time of this Equinox model, I can attest the cars were total, throwaway junk. All the GM stuff was crap, not nearly well enough made compared to their competition.
The Tahoe is one of the nicest vehicles I have ever driven. Even the early ones were good. Lots of power, good handling, a nice interior and quite good reliability showed GM could make good vehicles, if you were willing to pay a premium. The Tahoe has never been cheap and you are looking at $50k to start an a nice one at $60k. Lots of profit, so a nicer car.
Sorry if I sound especially bitter or snippy (and this isn’t directed at you in particular, you just reminded me of it), but why do people see full-size SUVs like the Suburban, Excursion and Expedition EL as behemoths when they’re not any bigger than a regular cab/long bed version of the pickup truck on which they’re based?
I mean, unless you consider a full-sized pickup truck to be a large vehicle, and I sure don’t, compared to tractors and medium tru….
Okay, I think I just answered my own question.
Yes David, they are all behemoths.
“Sign in the window said for sale or trade, only last remaining dinosaur Detroit made. $700 was a heck of a deal for a 400 hp jukebox on wheels…”
Dan,
check out this review
http://www.allpar.com/reviews/2011/journey-lux.html
the owner views his journey as the replacement for the SWB caravan
Shhhhhhhhhh…. don’t say that. Even though it would be my vehicle she refuses to be seen in a minivan, even in the passenger seat.
In the Nineties when I bought a ’74 LeSabre Luxus convertible as a daily driver. Don’t ask me what I was thinking. It was the automotive equivalent of a boat in more ways than one (ie. a hole in the water you pour money into).
After 35 years of Toyota’s, VW’s, and Nissans in 2011 picked up a Cadillac CTS.
Kept it for 3 months, then traded for an Infiniti M. Took a bath…but I love driving and if I’m not happy I’m reminded every moment behind the wheel.
My first car was outside the box; since then I’ve stayed inside it. Started with a ’70 Olds 98 with a 455 V8 4bbl, 365 hp and 500 some ft-lbs. of torque. Every car after that has been a foreign made 4-banger.
When Baby Number One was imminent, we decided the Suzuki Samurai was not a good family vehicle and traded on a humdrum four-door Chevy Spectrum. Sold it after a year. Horrible car.
Spectrum always sounded too much like “speculum” to my ears.
Should have bought a Chevrolet Celebrity, at least by the mid 80s it would have been well put together and sorted out. 😉 At least better than my first model year 1982 was.
There is a very 80’s looking corporate park near a friend of mines office that is named “Spectrum” which always makes me think of this car.
Think outside my box? HA! After a loooooong line of Citroens, Peugeots and Renaults- something near 1/2 of them grey market- I bought a ’99 Mercury Sable wagon. 8 years later and too much money down the drain, I now have an ’88 Mercedes 300TE wagon. You know- the one with the hydropneumatic rear suspension.
**chuckling** Think outside the box, he says….
Coming from a family which has bought Japanese from 1965 Datsuns on, I stepped out of the box by purchasing a Citroen AX GTi.
Great little car except when it tried to kill me with total brake failure….twice.
At that point I decided to step back into Japanese box, lest I end up in a pine box instead!
Stepping out of the box… for me, being an European, means I’m seriously contemplating buying a used US car, how about that.
Regarding your Jetta – how much more would it cost to get a Passat instead? I don’t know about current TDI engines… Up until least Spring I had a VW Golf which I bought new in 2007. It had a 1.9 TDI engine (105 horsepower version) coupled with a 6-speed manual and I absolutely loved it, good torque curve coming already in low rpm and ‘short’ gears, so the car was quite nippy and fun to drive for what is essentially a relatively modest workhorse diesel. In about 6 years of ownership, nothing went wrong with the engine or the car in general. Oh and it didn’t have a DPF which is basically a good thing.
On the other hand, I had the opportunity to drive the 2.0 TDI engine in a 2009 VW Touran and recently a 2013 VW Tiguan – and was not overly impressed. The engine only begins to wake up when approaching 2000 rpm and particularly in the newer Tiguan the vibration and noise were quite unpleasant (especially vibration).
Regarding DSG reliability – could somebody tell something more? In fact, My wife and I currently own a 2010 VW Touran with 1.4 TSI engine and DSG and a few months ago, one of the clutches had to be replaced (the one for even-numbered gears). Thankfully under warranty but the warranty has just now run out, I fear the future.
I hope it will continue to run OK because I totally fell in love with automatic transmissions. I like the combination of modern turbocharged gas engine with a DSG, it’s so smooth and quiet, for my taste gasoline + automatic is the only way to go… (unless you have to really drive a lot, like 20 thousand or more kilometers per year or more which I fortunately don’t have to)
I’m gonna watch my words on this. There is anecdotal evidence pointing to rapid deceleration when driving at speed. There was a Coroner’s inquiry over here recently, but I believe VW was cleared.
There are more articles, but start with this:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-08-02/coroner-vw-volkswagen-road-accident-melissa-ryan/4859790
I think I got into a box with my current car. I used to drive one “out there” car and the VT is as conventional as it can be. Still an easy & beautiful drive.
I couldn’t resist the urge to have something “unique” and got a Saab.
My “outside the box” would be called today “go back to 4 cylinder”
Does driving on the other side of the car counts?
Saw a LHD Porsche 930 today. Just can’t bring myself to drive LHD on Aussie roads.
I learned to drive in LHD. Took me 6 months to get full confidence down here. Got my Aussie license in a manual car… that felt weird (I still can’t downshift properly on RHD)
Being said that, I’d give LHD a go.
For me it’s a sightlines thing.
Dad spends half the year in Italy and whenever he comes back he drives in the lane closest to the middle line just in case his mind wanders a bit and he can quickly correct himself. Hasn’t happened yet, touch woody Buick.
I understand what you mean re: gearshift hand.
To me, multi-lane divided highways would seem to be much harder to get used to driving in RHD countries than little two-lane roads. Maybe that’s not actually the case; I don’t know, never having tried it.
I was a dyed-in-the-wool compact truck owner (Toyota…700,000 miles on 3 of them) when I found myself needing more passenger space. In 2000, with great trepidation I bought a 1992 Accord with 135,000 miles. Fell in love. Perfect size, nice power, great handling, great visibility, comfortable as all getout. A few minor repairs and sold it for 75% of what I paid for it when I moved overseas on 2005. My very favorite car ever. And no one builds anything like it now…the combination of size, clean styling and solidity is just not around.
Convincing the parental units to get me an OG900 or 9000 CSE/Aero as a first car (either with a stick please).
Closest I’ve come to moving out of the box was the Volvo 850 (I think that was the model, it was the five cylinder one) we looked at in the mid-nineties. The Volvo was a good car but it was going to be my wife’s daily driver and she thought the V6 Camry that we ended up with was much smoother and quieter. If it was going to be my DD I would have taken the Volvo. I have owned a couple of VWs and my wife and I have had 5 different Toyotas between us; I don’t consider those brands to be out of the box. Actually I did come really close to buying a used Fiat 124 Spyder ca 1977. Fortunately for me I realized that I didn’t have the money or the tools to keep it on the road; it was fun to drive though.
Being 21 and still on my first car, I guess you could say I’m still assembling the box.
Back–way back–in the day, I bought a pristine AMC Hornet Sportwagon. It was my first and only AMC product, and I loved it. Why I traded it for the VW Rabbit From Hell I’ll never understand.
I think my out-of-the-box days are behind me. I’ve had an International pickup, five Studebakers, a 1955 Packard, half a dozen or so 1957 and 1958 Plymouths, three or four Chryslers, a DeSoto station wagon, a highly-modified Dodge pickup, a 220S sedan, a 230SL, two Ford pickups, three or four Chevy pickups, a Rover 2000, an Opel 1900 sport coupe, a 383 4-speed fastback Barracuda, 4 or 5 other A-body Mopars including three really rare ones, a 1984 RX7, and six Honda Accord sedans. I want a 2005-2009 Mustang GT but haven’t made that happen yet.
Nice selection!
I can’t really say I have a box, I have owned all kinds of different vehicles and loved most of them for different reasons. I have kind of always wanted to be the kind of guy that sticks with some brand or type loyally…. I have friends who are “Jeep guys” or of course GM guys or Ford guys, truck guys, etc. At one point I was almost a Honda guy and I suppose I still do like that brand the most of them all, even though they lost their sporting edge. But it’s too hard to pick just one!
I have owned 3 VWs, my first car was a VW, my current car is a VW and I have shopped the newest crop of VWs recently. All I can say is, if you are going to stay outside your box then by God lease it, don’t buy it. Getting a good one is a total crapshoot and you won’t know for 2+ yrs whether or not you have a good one. You will want to have an easy out. After a lifetime of cheap to fix, simple, relatively reliable domestic cars and possibly a history of being able to defer maintenance, you are considering a brand that is known to require fastidious expensive maintenance and has relatively expensive repair costs when they break, which can sometimes be quite often. Traditionally the lease deals are pretty good too so you can get a good deal and not have to eat the poor resale values either.
What you say in your second paragraph is great advice and it has all crossed my mind. Perhaps part of the reason I haven’t pulled the trigger yet.
I once purchased a 2003 4-cylinder/auto Toyota Tacoma extra cab pickup, thinking it would be a good compromise daily driver—carlike features with the utility of a pickup. I was horribly mistaken. I am typically a manual transmission guy, but this one fell in my lap at the right price. MISTAKE. I was reminded that I hate automatics. They seldom up shift when I think they should, and the NEVER downshift when I think they should. The real issue however was the fuel consumption. I never did better than 22mpg on the highway–this with an underpowered 4-cylinder. My company’s F150 with V8 can achieve 21 under the same conditions, with far better power. The Tacoma was also very bouncy, poorly sound insulated, and generally uncomfortable.
I sold the truck after 90 days–for more than what I paid for it. I am now back in a manual transmission compact sedan (Kia Forte). This car is comfortable, shifts when I want it to, and is great on gas.
I will never buy another compact pickup!
After 6 years of keeping my niece’s 89 Jetta GL running (now at 275K miles), I did what I never thought I would do. Two days ago, we picked up a 96 Toyota Tercel. Totally base, 4 speed stick, no ps, left mirror only, no ac, just seats, brakes and steering wheel. I hope to be hearing from her a whole lot less in the future! And the day after we got it, as new tires were being installed on the Toyota she called and said no coolent in the radiator of the Jetta. I told her fill it up and get it over to my house. I now have a parts car for my 86 Jetta. Her car has broken down more in the last 6 months then mine has in the last 23 years. New axles, alternator and battery will soon be on my car. The Toyota has 157k, timing belt and clutch were replaced at 110k. Seems like a good deal for 2k, body and interior are good, runs great. My Jetta has been pretty much trouble free, the one she has been falling apart the last year. Like once every 3 weeks! Never bought a japanese car before, I have a feeling I won’t be seeing her much for a long time. I hope!
Tercel update. Sept 2015 needed to replace starter at 180k. Don’t get many car related phone calls from her these days. Turned out the Jetta had blown it’s heater core. Clutch safety switch bypass, rubber stop on brake pedal for stop light switch, and door speakers for radio were all the Tercel needed during the first month after she bought it. Probably now about time for a new timing belt. Motor is non-interference, according to forums. Holding up well so far.
I’ve gone out of the box several times. The biggest one was when my wife made enough noise about my old Dakota SLT extended cab, that I gave up and said enough. Her choice: A 2001 Pontiac Aztek. I initially couldn’t see past the car’s outer styling, but the rest of the car was great.
At the the time I was less than crazy about the choice, I’ve always been more of a muscle car guy, and if it wasn’t a hot car, then it was a discreet car (i.e. didn’t attract attention). The Aztek was so unusual at the time, it was like we were the center of attention everywhere we went.
Eventually I got used to it, and we really came to like the car. We’re on our third one now, but as the newest ones age, we will probably have to replace ours with something else. But until then, I plan on enjoying it until it dies.
I’ve had:
Olds Cutlass S
Olds Cutlass Supreme
Plymouth Roadrunner
Dodge Power Wagon (Biggest turd, by far of all my vehicles).
Pontiac Trans Am
Chevy Impala
Chevy Camaro
Chevy K5 Blazer
Dodge Caravan-First, and last FWD vehicle.
Chevy S-10 Blazer
Jeep Grand Cherokee
Chevy Camaro (Bought and sold same day for big profit!)
Jeep Grand Cherokee (Hated it more than anything I’ve owned)
GMC Sierra 4×4 Ext cab.
Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab 4×4 Loved everything about it but the mileage.
Dodge Charger R/T
Dodge Challenger R/T.
As you can see, I’ve avoided Ford totally. By the time I got my license in 1972, their styling had gone into the twilight zone, and they wouldn’t exit it until about 2000. They seemed to make their cars ugly for ugly’s sake, and since every one of my dad’s Fords were total garbage, I’ve never been able to really consider buying one, except in 2000, when I actually thought about an F-150. For an hour or so. Right now, there are no Fords I would buy, but I wouldn’t ignore a great deal on an F-150, if I was looking for a truck. I would still probably buy a Ram instead.
I did the flip side of your outside the box thinking. For 20+ years I have been a dyed in the wool vw fan! owning some of their most unreliable products (according to lemonade car guide anyway). A couple of bay window vans first gen rabbit gti, Jetta, vanagon and a 1992 turbo diesel Jetta. I always did my own work and about the only system I never had to take apart was the transmissions (lots of clutches though).
Anyway after looking at what I could get for the money on a newer Jetta to replace the old one, I ended up getting a 1998 Nissan altima for $100 less than my 92 Jetta with 100 000 kms less on the odometer. I wanted to get a larger sedan than the Jetta with a standard transmission and 4 cylinder engine. It took me quite a while of searching and it doesn’t get anywhere near the fuel mileage but so far the repairs have been cheap and the parts are in stock. The first thing it needed was a rad cap the local auto parts store had it in stock on a Sunday for $12. I said to the parts counter “what do you mean I don’t have to wait a week or 2 for it and pay $40?”. I guess being made in the USA with mostly Japanese parts probably helps.
I think I might have to get an old air cooled bug so I have something to tinker on though.
I’m trying to find a way IN to the box…:-) I’ve gone all over the spectrum with my “extended test drives”.
The closest thing for me was a ’92 325i. Never owned a “premium/prestige” make before, and nothing with climate control, heated seats, etc. While it was a blast to drive, I would never buy a used one out of warranty again. Even doing most of my own repairs, it still became an unreliable money pit after about 125,000 miles, and not perfectly reliable at half that mileage.
At the same time, in 1999, Dad purchased a new Camry. My kid is still driving it at close to 300,000 miles and the idle valve is the only chronic problem the car has ever had.
A new Honda Fit Base functionally replaced the BMW. At least I experienced the “Ultimate Driving Machine” once in my life.
Given my preference for large, RWD, and BOF, I think ultimately I’ll end up raising the box to a big SUV like a Tahoe, or Escalade (and keeping an older Cadillac or two for weekends).