Up to this point, you’ve enjoyed several long C.O.A.L. posts from me. This here is going to be my shortest C.O.A.L. entry, because this was the car that I owned for the least amount of time (about 5 weeks). This car came to me by way of being in the right place, at the right time. It’s because of this that I can say that “I won a Caddy!”
To catch you up, I had traded my 1993 Mercury Topaz (COAL) for the Party Wagon 1977 Dodge Aspen station wagon (COAL) to head off to college. It’s now Spring Break of my freshman year at New Mexico State University. No big trip for me, I was just going to return to Albuquerque for spring break and spend the week relaxing at my parents house. As I’m getting into Albuquerque, I tuned my radio to my favorite local station. During commercial breaks, they advertised that on Saturday they would be doing a live remote from a local dealership and would giving away a car. I honestly didn’t think much of it, until the next day. It was a family affair at my brother’s high school baseball game. Mom and I were in the stands, my dad was coaching and my brother was out on the field. They had a double header with a couple hour break in between.
Mom and I had some time to kill during the break. I remembered the radio commercial and we headed over to the dealership the radio station was broadcasting from. It was only a few miles away from the baseball field. The premise was the winners (there would be two) would be able to purchase a car for $5. I filled out my entry form and then wandered around the lot. I wondered which of the cars I would be able to select from, if I were chosen. I made a mental note of which car I would select, if I had free reign of the lot. My memory seems to remember a teal Z24 as the car I had chosen.
The car I wanted. Not the car I got.
Time for the drawing. The DJ selected a toddler from the audience to pick from the box. His hands were sticky with candy, and he pulled out a clump of entry forms. The DJ snatched one from his hands, and read my name over the PA system! I walked up and was congratulated, as the hulking beast of a car came around from behind the building. I filled out all the paperwork, handed over a $5 bill, and was now the owner of a 1983 Cadillac Coupe deVille.
[The big steaming pile, 1977 ‘Party Wagon’ in the background.]
This thing was a big….steaming…. pile…… of crap. The ignition switch was reluctant to turn, and when it came to life the engine rattled and sputtered. It was the 4100 V8 engine, and it barely got out of it’s own way. The only way to get it moving was to floor the engine and hope that everything jerked together at just the right moment to provide forward motion. Eventually, it would. I managed to get the thing to my parents house and park it.
The car pretty much remained parked at my parents house until the title came in the mail. I drove it once or twice before I went back to school. The only thing I really remember about it was the trip computer at the bottom of the dash. The yellow LCD display contrasted sharply with the old school wood and strip speedo that it had in it. It would tell you instant MPG. Most of the time it was single digits, jumping to 99 when you would coast or come to a stop. Once, I got it to read 0 mpg for about 5 seconds during an uphill acceleration “blast”. That’s my one fun memory from the car.
As soon as the title came in, I promptly drove it to a “We Pay Cash For Your Car” lot. The guy offered me $300, and I snatched it up immediately. I turned $5 into $300, and can say that “I won a Caddy.”
That was an easy $295 profit. But would you have kept it if it were a same-year Eldorado? I myself am quite smitten with the 1979-85 E-Bodies (Eldorado, Riviera, Toronado), even if I was not alive during that time period.
I love the E-bodies too but not that engine. At least the Riv and Toro got to keep the 307 V8 which was an anvil of reliability compared to the 4100.
I drove a 1980 Riviera once. Engine seemed pretty strong, acceleration was pretty good. This contrasted with an 82 Eldorado I drove which was well appointed but pretty anemic.
You probably had the standard 350 V-8 in the ’80 Riv that you drove jerseyfred. My Mom’s ’79 Riv had the 350 and it was a quick car. Honestly, those cars were heavy enough to warrant the 350, but of course fuel economy was all the concern back then so GM felt the need to discontinue the 350 after 1980 and make the 307 the largest engine available in the E-bodies. In fact, the ’81 Rivs had the 4.1 V-6 standard, with the 307 optional as well as the 3.8 V-6 Turbo and the 350 Diesel. (The Riviera unlike the other E-bodies still had the option of the Turbo 3.8 V-6 throughout its seven year run which I personally have never driven, but was told provided good acceleration in them.)
Funny story about the 1981 Riviera and the new standard V-6. My brother-in-law was working for a huge Buick/Chevy dealer back then. His boss was a rather pompous, arrogant man, who didn’t like to be told what to do and was in charge of ordering all the in-stock vehicles. Well, he had somehow forgotten or possibly not known that the Riviera went from a standard 350 V-8 in 1980 to the newly standard 4.1 V-6 in 1981. He “pre-ordered” three Rivieras with the V-6 in them! I can remember the three cars vividly as my brother-in-law thought it was quite the joke on his boss for doing so. Those cars sat so long they all had a birthday – and finally were sold at huge discounts the following year to some unfortunate souls that didn’t drive them first or care that they were horribly slow.
I heard the 4100 was pretty bad. A friend of mine bought an Allanté on a whim last year; fortunately, it had neither the 4100 or the 4500. It was a ’93, the final year for the Allanté, so it had the 4.6-liter Northstar. How typical of GM to get things right just as it cancels a car.
I believe my grandmother had an ’83 Riviera (brown exterior, brown landau top, brown leather) with the 307 V8 when I was very little. She said it was a gas hog and a land-yacht, but perfectly reliable.
The FWD Northstars are a whole new bag of trouble.
The 4.5 and 4.9 V8s are quite solid reliable engines.
Indeed. Troublesome is the word. And beside that, the only FWD-Northstar I’ve ever driven that didn’t have torque-steer for days was a Buick Lucerne Super.
By contrast, a family friend of ours has a 2006 Cadillac STS-V (supercharged 4.4-liter Northstar V8) that has been the epitome of reliable. I think they got all the kinks worked out of the Northstars by the early 2000s, though they are generally still nowhere near as solid as the LS series.
The RWD Northstar engine is a different engine than the FWDs.
Same here, the Eldorado especially. GM got those exactly right.
I occasionally read, but do not comment at TTAC. I see your balanced and informed comments there. Welcome, and hopefully we see more of you here!
Thanks for the warm welcome!
I would not have kept anything with the 4100HT V8. Too bad it wasn’t an 1980 model, then it would have had the 368 V8.
I’m wondering how a clever auto-company advertiser could turn that 0 MPG event into a positive: “Full throttle in the 1983 Cadillac de Ville – as uneventful as idle in a normal car!”
In reality, it is so hard to give away a car. Imagine the excitement if the right car went to the right person. In this case to one of our friends in the Brougham Society. Instead it is thought a flaming pile and sent away for peanuts. Reminds me of Paul’s story of when he came into possession of an 86 Seville. We all have our tastes but I expect a little more love from a car lover.
The way I see it, John: the car landed in his lap. He did nothing to get it. He suddenly had a car. Why bother wasting time trying to find the “perfect” buyer when you can flip it for a quick profit? Particularly if he was having to pay for registration and insurance on it. He probably had other things going on, and didn’t want this surprise gift to become a burden.
Brian, that is a surreal experience you had. I’ve had dreams in which I’ve unexpectedly come into possession of a car and had to sell it. And selling a car is a much bigger pain in the ass than buying. You’ve gotta list it, deal with tire-kickers and no-shows. Wouldn’t it have been so much better if you had won a car you actually wanted to drive?
Gimme a ’77-79 Coupe de Ville with the 425. Hard pass on these 1980s C-Bodies. Uglier styling and horrible engines.
Yep, I agree with William. The author was a college student at the time with limited time, money, and space. Plus the car had issues. As a good friend of mine says “sometimes free can be too costly”
Flipping it was absolutely the right thing to do. College was his priority and a well used luxury car is often a money pit.
In late 2000, my sister who was then driving a near new Mustang, joined her husband (who owned a M-B E something sedan) at the open house and new model intro from the new S-class sedan. They both dropped cards into a “box” for a door prize drawing and my sister won a new S-class…the grand prize.
After deciding to keep the car, and driving it for a few years, my b-in-l traded it for another new E-class and my sister traded her now 3 year old/barely used Mustang for her 1st Prius. (She has since moved on to a second Prius.)
Yeah, it probably had a better chance at finding the right owner being sold….the lot got a cheap no haggle deal and may have actually fixed the issues or at least sold it for a reasonable price since they didn’t have much in it. And a $5 broken gas-hog is no bargain for a broke student.
Exactly!
Should have kept it, swapped in a big block Chevy (or even an old Caddy 500) and won more money surprising Fox Mustangs with it.
Aww, it’s a pity it sucked, a Cadillac would’ve been a lovely ride.
I have to say, as much as I love the big Caddys from that era, I would have done exactly the same. I’ve been there….wrenching on an old beater in a college dorm parking lot using borrowed tools, covered in grease up to your elbows, hoping you’re pulling the busted part, and especially hoping that Joey (who worked at an auto parts store last summer) knows what the Hell he’s talking about…. as sundown approaches. Degree of difficulty: 6
(Includes no experience, borrowed tools, wrong tools, no manual). To reach degree of difficulty 8 add: no ability to research on internet, and drunk/stoned and disinterested friend. To reach degree of difficulty 9 add: girlfriend who wants to help, light rain.
+1
I very well may print out this post and frame it! It basically sums up my college experience, though to reach level 10 you need to add: darkness has set in, flashlight has failed and you put the last few bolts in hand tight by Bic-lighter illumination and tape a note to the steering wheel reminding you to tighten those bolts in the morning before you leave for work. Oh yeah and you’re out of beer…
A prize worth $300 is more that I’ve ever won. Better than a kick in the you know where. Hopefully you didn’t need to invest any gas money in it.
Nice ROI on a rig that wasn’t worth $295 when new….
That is why it was still still alive and kicking at 15 years old. What small mindedness.
Seems it was twitching, more than kicking.
Reminds me of the old stereotype about GM cars running badly but running forever albeit badly.
I know, right?!
And why do we think the dealer was giving it away? Other than cheap publicity, they probably chose this particular marvel of GM rushed engineering to avoid selling it to some poor unsuspecting customer. Or more likely, dealing with the hassle of sending it to auction to be sold for scrap value, so it could be crushed. I’m glad our writer was able to sell the hot potato and pocket some cash.
Assuming the pictures are the car, it looks rust free, dent free with factory wheels and plastic fillers in attendance. Assuming further the engine was tired and near it’s end, it probably covered 150k miles with average usage. It probably outlasted most 4.1s and indeed 1983 Mercedes 3.8 V8s in their much more expensive S class. They also were underpowered and short lived due to bad timing chains.
At this point in the Caddy’s life it comes to a crossroad. Either it gets some tlc or is driven into the ground. In an ideal world, an enthusiast of any age would expend a slight effort to get the car another chance. He might find himself rewarded for the effort by a higher price as a fellow enthusiast does not think of the car as a financial instrument the way a car lot does.
My first thought was “Why would the radio station take a chance on ruining their reputation by giving away a car that barely runs?”
Second thought: “Raffles are meant for vocational gamblers, not for people like Brian who suddenly decide to take a chance. Gamblers are all about looks, not function. Perfect fit.”
Chances are the car giveaway was the dealership’s idea. The station just promoted it. No major broadcasting corporation would ever lend liability to such a stunt.
I’ve done live car remotes for over 30 years. The ONLY one EVER that drew a crowd featured a chance to buy a car off the lot for…I don’t remember, $1? $100? (It took place back in 1999-2000) It wasn’t a lot of money and the theater of the whole thing was indeed a draw.
So people filled the entry box and waited to hear their name called.
And the prize car?
A dozen-year-old H-body Park Avenue with a bearing rap. I don’t think it was capable of being driven off the lot. And after an engine swap and state inspection, you’d have about the same amount of money in it as its book value would’ve been had it been in good condition.
Yes there were hot dogs and balloons, and all the trappings that come with such an event.
FWIW, the dealership (premiere FoMoCo franchise with three locations in the Pittsburgh market) is not only still around but well-branded and successful with a good reputation. And yes, the proprietor, same one who concocted the car “giveaway” all those years ago, voices the commercials.
Most importantly to this story, I don’t remember that they ever attempted to repeat the stunt. If you’re going to attempt something like this, realize that the public catches on really quick. You get one shot.
Car dealers can be an impatient breed, much to their own detriment. There are no shortcuts to successful brandbuilding, and from my experience, that’s what live car dealership broadcasts are all about. Present the message clearly, play up the specials, give everyone who comes to my prize wheel personal service with a smile…
And hopefully, tomorrow or next week or next month, the seed you planted results in an “up” for the dealership.
I have no idea what ever happened to the Park Avenue. At least you got $295 for your Caddy, ahem, er, “prize”…
When people bring up the HT4100 it’s usually to complain about how horrible they were and what they did to Cadillac’s reputation. My complaint is how many of these beautiful old Coupe DeVilles they took off the road.
Even if the HT4100 wasn’t a boat anchor, they were severely underpowered for a car that size, even more so for the full sized Sedan DeVille and Fleetwood Brougham. I don’t need a barn burner in my Brougham, but it better damn well be able to handily best an old diesel Benz or Volvo!
C/D tested an HT4100 82 Eldo at 15.2 seconds to 60. Not great by a long shot but the 83 gained 10 horsepower to 135 and a shorter final drive. It was not falling behind many diesels of the era.
Motor Week tested the same Eldo Touring coupe but of 1984 vintage and got 13 seconds 0-60 from the 135 HP HT 4100 so they weren’t as slow as many make them out to be. 5.7 diesels were far slower at around 16-17 seconds to 60 so the 4100 in proper tune was much quicker at the time.
Fun story ! .
Reminds me of the mid 1990’s when lots of So. Cal. Auto Dealers would have events where if you were sitting in the driver’s seat when they called upon that car, you’d get it for $99 .
I always thought I’d go give it a look but didn’t so the Brother of a guy I worked with got a running un dented VW Beetle for $99 . SWEET .
All the vehicles offered this way were sub wholesale beaters but not necessarily junk .
-Nate
Knew a guy when we were both fresh out of college. He entered a raffle at a grocery store and won a brand new Mustang. Being a little smarter than the average early 20s guy, he kept his Saturn and sold the Mustang. Made a very nice profit.
Actually that might be a Fleetwood Brougham Coupe, even more desirable (and rare) than the CDV.
Yeah, it looks like the Fleetwood Brougham Coupe to me as well. Different roof treatment for sure and it appears to have the chrome trim wrapping down the sides of the raised section of the hood as well.
Sweet story. Big score for 5 bucks, you made serious profit.
I’d a gladly given you 300 for that fine ride!
Agreed. The chrome rocker extensions, that vinyl skullcap configuration, crest in wreath trunk lock cover, and (hard to see) apparent spears down the hood dome make it a Fleetwood.
Cool story, Brian! It’s always great to win something, especially a Cadillac of any vintage or condition. And I get why you had it for only five weeks. When I was college aged, the last thing I had time for was to place a classified ad in the newspaper (remember those? LOL) to try and find someone who actually wanted the car. It just wasn’t for you, and you can actually claim that you won a Cadillac. What a great story for an icebreaker at a party.
lovely body, bad engine. Yep, not a car for someone without cash and time.
What is it with old Caddies and prizes? Probably around 1976, at the age of 12, my family went to a Jesuit high school fundraising carnival. I spied a drawing for a 1957 or so Cadillac Coupe DeVille. It was in okay shape, and not my favorite colors in black and yellow, but I was smitten by the idea of winning that cool old car – something I’d never really seen before. I’ve thought about that car occasionally for 40 years.
My dad groaned and grumbled things about that car that did not seem complimentary. I’m fairly certain I / we didn’t throw in our buck, or whatever. While getting that car now for a buck would be a windfall, probably not so much in 1976.
In the late 1990s, as an established adult with a garage, I came across a beautiful 1964 Impala SS convertible in front of a supermarket being raffled by a church. I all but don’t gamble, and have bought exactly one lottery ticket in my life, but that day I easily dropped at least $20 on tickets. I REALLY wanted that car, it was all I could think about until the drawing was held. Alas, it was a very successful raffle for the church, and my tickets were among thousands sold that did not win.
Did you have any expectations that you’d get a car in decent shape, even if not a make and model you liked?
In the spring of 1972 a good friend of mine won a Buick convertible in one of those promotional giveaways, this one was near the end of the college semester. The car was a 1962 Special convertible, complete with the V6, automatic transmission and what appeared to be mold growing in the back seat foot wells. We bombed around Lexington in the two or three weeks left before we went home for the summer; I remember one time having eight people in the car, which was a notable strain on its performance. Bob did drive the Buick back to his home in Paducah (around a four hour trip) but once his dad saw the car in the light of day it was history. It would have cost much more than the car was worth to even fix the safety issues so it was hauled off to the boneyard.
This is a very rare Fleetwood Coupe. IT cost 50% more than a Coupe Deville when new. This was GM’s flagship and the aspiration of every Guido back then, even more than a Trans Am.
Wow, I wasnt expecting this COAL to bring out so many comments in both the positive and negative. I’d like to add a little bit more context around my decision to perform a quick flip.
The car was located in Albuquerque. I live in Las Cruces, 210 miles away. Trying to sell a car to the “right” buyer, in the days before the internet, was a no-go. I did not trust that the car would make that trip down south, which would have then allowed me to try and sell it locally there.
I had no problem driving the Party Wagon up and down the freeway. It was older, had more miles on it, but every issue on it was a known issue. The Caddy was a big huge bucket of unknowns. No one in my family had ever owned GM. I knew very little about it. Why did it have so little power? What caused the bad shake above 45 mph? These were all unknowns and as pointed out, a broke college kid living in the dorms I didnt have space or money to figure out the unknowns.
Yup, I flipped it to a We Buy Your Car place. It was easy to do. My guess is that they probably turned around and sold it to someone who turned it into a lowrider. The low rider culture is strong in New Mexico, and big Caddys like this were one of the more popular rides. While I myself do not enjoy lowriders and would never own one, I have a lot of respect for that community because they also take care of older cars and keep them on the streets. They pour just as much blood sweat and tears into their passion for cars as I do.
Hearing that you guys are saying that this is a Fleetwood does give me a slight twinge of pain, but not enough to make me regret my decision. I dont remember it having any Fleetwood badges on it, it was just listed on the title as a Coupe DeVille. I always did like the styling of those big 80s Caddys, but not enough to trade out my beloved Party Wagon for this one. Had it run properly, I might have considered it.
If the situation were to occur now, I absolutely would have kept it and given the car thr love it needed to get back in better mechanical shape. If I had more space and more money, I would be the “crazy cat lady” of old cars. Lol.
Given your circumstances, the fast flip was very likely the smartest decision. You were able to drive the car under its own power to the buyer, a condition that may not have lasted long.
If you had putzed around trying to find the “right” buyer, and the car suffered a suffered a major malfunction, you probably would have been selling it for $50 bucks for tow-away scrap.
I did sell a few cars using newspaper want ads before the internet, but it was a process that took a few weeks, and there was no way to screen buyers like you can by reading their replies to Craigslist.
Nicely said and clarified!
No worries Brian we would have all done the same thing. Hate to tell you this but if your car didn’t say Fleetwood anywhere and instead had a “Brougham D’Elegance” emblem on the C-pillar then it had the super rare D’Elegance package with the pillow top seats. Live and learn my friend!
In case you come across another, the easiest and cheapest fix for a blown HT4100 is to pop in an Olds 307, which was never available on the Coupe. There would still be plenty around if they came with that engine. A casual perusal of CL in my area shows there are 17 1980-1992 Cadillac Brougham sedans for sale — none with the 4100, six with the Chevy 305 / 350 and a 11 with the 307. It’s a very reliable engine and much less of a hassle to swap in than a SBC which requires notching the frame and getting the FI to work.
I’ve been told Cadillac provided a factory-approved dealer kit for the 4100 -> 307 swap, it was very much in demand.
I wish I had some better pictures to refer to of my actual car. Damn. Looking over some photos on the internet, it’s clear that this was an actual Fleetwood based upon that vinyl roof and the smaller rear windows. It might have said Fleetwood on the right rear trunk, but I can’t be certain.
Looking at some photos of the d’Elegance package interior, I do know that mine did not have the pillow top seats. It was a cloth interior, but it does look like the d’Elegance could have been had in cloth (at least what i am able to determine).
Last night I got a little bit of a memory jog from my mom regarding the fate of the Caddy. I forgot this little tid bit. Between 6 and 12 months after flipping the car, I got a call from an impound yard. The Caddy had been abandoned on the side of the road, and I was still listed as the registered owner with the New Mexico Motor Vehicle Division. I informed the guy that I was not the owner of the car and could provide a copy of the bill of sale if he wanted to see it. After that, who knows what happened to it. :-/
I don’t suppose you kept a record of the VIN? Carfax might have an interesting tale to tell!
Nope, unfortunately not. That paperwork was gone when my parents moved houses.
Definitely an interesting story, and kind of a shady move by the car dealership to unload a very rough trade that otherwise would have been low-dollar auction fodder. Just the same, with the right engine, that would have been quite a desirable car, but in the condition it was in, I understand that getting *some* money for it with a minimum of hassle was a much more attractive proposition than getting a little more out of it with much more work sunk in. Even as a college student, your time has a decidedly nonzero value. And you did make money on the deal!
Maybe the car is still out there somewhere with a rehabbed engine, hydraulics, and 12″ wires. A better fate than the boneyard, at least!
I love those old Cadillacs, but you did it right. The issues could have been endless: suspension, engine, and those years had the relatively new ECMs and hi-tech digital fuel injection to go along with the boat anchor engine. It’s not like it was a ’76 Coupe DeVille with a few rust spots that needed a carb rebuild. It would be a risky, costly project even if you did have the time and money to fix it. Pragmatic thinking and fun story.