In the last installment I took a gamble on a faraway project that turned out to be rather more rusty than expected. All that could be done was lick my wounds and move on. This time I vowed to set eyes on any potential car before committing to a road trip and trailer rental. Having owned a few rusty project cars in the past I have discovered and I do not find rust removal an enjoyable process so I focused on my search on finding a solid body as the top priority.
Photo from ad
Often with winter approaching sellers can find themselves motivated to move any projects on that they themselves are not going get to. I had been watching a semi-local 1961 Pontiac Laurentian sedan that had dropped price a couple times in the past few weeks. I noticed the seller had again dropped the price but this time drastically. Immediately I called him to gather a few more key details. He claimed it ran and was almost rust free. From the description it sounded like a promising candidate and an appointment was made to view the car. Again I recruited my friend and old car hunting partner, Rod, to come along as a second set of eyes can be invaluable especially as prospective buyers can tend to view cars through rose colored glasses.
Rather than taking a trailer right away we took Rod’s Lincoln Town Car. What better way to view a big, old boat of a car than driving up in another one? This time we were visiting a rural property about a hundred kilometers away.
With Rod at the wheel I was able to take a few photos of the drive up which was a nice bonus.
The location was quite secluded.
Upon arriving at the seller’s property we were presented with an old car paradise. Or maybe an old project paradise to more accurate. His land was an oasis of interesting vehicles on the southern Alberta prairie. As we entered the seller’s very large but friendly dog bounded over to greet us followed shortly by the seller himself.
Besides the Pontiac we had come to see a 1951 Cadillac Coupe DeVille and a Volvo 123 GT sat out front. The Cadillac was also for sale and practically oozed patina. If I had a few more dollars in my pocket I could have been easily swayed over to the big Caddy.
The Volvo 123 GT is the rare sporty model of 120 series and the seller mentioned he had several others but they were likely destined for sale overseas. This model apparently commands top dollar just not in Canada unfortunately.
But back to the Pontiac. Having learned a lesson from the Frontenac the inspection started with the usual rust traps. The trunk, rockers and floors are common trouble spots on almost any old car but the Pontiac was incredibly solid with just a touch of rust in the rear wheel arches. The car had all the signs of being a dry prairie survivor.
The interior was brittle but complete and as a bonus even included an original owner’s manual.
The six cylinder engine easily started although it ran off a bottle of fuel (a whiskey bottle visible behind the thermostat housing) rather than the gas tank. The seller mentioned that the water pump had a bad bearing and one could indeed feel the free play in the bearing. The car wore stock partial hub caps on one side and Impala SS covers on the other.
The seller wanted an extra two hundred for the Impala caps which I declined actually preferring the stock chrome units. Before we agreed on a price I asked for a self-guided yard tour just in case something more temping lay out there.
His yard was full of lust-worthy automotive treasures of all kinds. The collection included a large number of desirable Volvos that were obviously his passion. Mostly 1960s era 120 series cars with perhaps the largest concentration of 123GTs anywhere.
Several P1800s and a handful of later 140 series cars rounded out the Volvo selection.
There were also a number of Fargo Power Wagons from the 1960s as well as a more common and well known Dodge variant.
The rest was mostly a mix of American and Canadian vehicles that were perhaps bought from an opportunity rather than theme. I would estimate the total at close to fifty vehicles all together.
Frustratingly he did have a pair of Frontenacs one of which appeared to have a solid body. It also featured missing trim and would have been ideally paired with the rusty one I had previously passed on. If only I had known of their existence a week or so before!
Quite a few of the yard vehicles had more potential value than the Pontiac but would also require more work to get back on the road. I was looking for a straight forward project this time around so a deal was struck for the big Pontiac. And yes there are three pedals present in the driver’s footwell.
To understand this Pontiac we need a little background on the Canadian market and GM at the time. The Canadian market is only about ten percent of the size of the U.S. market and thus a full line of Pontiacs could not be justified. At the same time standalone dealerships for marques in GM’s portfolio were not possible especially in the less densely populated areas of Canada. So GM organized its dealer lines into Chevrolet/Oldsmobile/Cadillac and Pontiac/Buick/GMC. As the lowest rung member Chevrolet would have received the largest volume of sales but again not every town could support a dealer of each type. To solve this issue GM attempted to equalize sales between the two dealerships streams by offering more entry level Pontiacs. A hurdle to this strategy was the steep duties levied against automotive parts and vehicles not produced in Canada at the time. Cadillac, Buick and Oldsmobile with their larger profit margins were better positioned to absorb these costs while the lower priced Pontiacs could not. The solution was slowly increase the use of Canadian produced Chevrolet parts in these Pontiacs until they because mostly Chevrolet under the skin with styling that aped their Pontiac cousins from the south. The result was for many years Pontiac had sales numbers that approached Chevrolet’s.
For 1961 American Pontiacs got a newly designed perimeter frame while the Canadian models stuck with Chevrolet’s “X” frame. As a result the brakes, suspension, wheels are identical to a 1961 Chevrolet Biscayne or Impala. While the base engine in a Chevrolet Biscayne would have been a 235cid straight six the Canadian Pontiacs received a related but larger 261cid modified from light truck duty rated at 150hp. For those that required more power a 283cid Chevrolet small block V8 or 348cid V8 was optional depending on trim level. The Laurentian is the mid line model slotting in between the base Strato Chief and more plush Parisienne.
Like many of the Canadian car names the Pontiac Laurentian was named for Canadian person or place. In the case it was the Laurentian mountain range in southern Quebec. This particular Laurentian is a fairly bare bones example with the six cylinder engine, a three speed manual transmission as well as manual brakes and steering. It certainly makes the engine bay clutter free which greatly eases the effort of maintenance and repair.
While doing up the paperwork the seller insisted we check out his house before leaving. Like a scene out of American Pickers it was jam-packed with antiques and interesting items. We returned home again without a vehicle in tow but not disappointed as I had purchased the big Pontiac. Now to drag it home.
The whole Affordable Classic series:
- The Search Is On
- Landed One – 1961 Pontiac Laurentian
- Dragging It Home
- Assessment and Planning
- Little Fixes
- Shocks and Brake Removal
- Disc Brake Mounting
- Cooling and Fueling
- Back into the Brakes and Other Odds and Ends
- First Drive!
- Last Minute Fixes
Love those 61’s, what a great way to spend the day!
A large Pontiac with an inline 6 cylinder engine and “3 on the tree”, I realize that 60 years ago that wasn’t so odd, but it just seems so strange on a 58 year old car.
As the manufacturers starting understanding that adding optional items as features made money for them instead of just for the dealers, you see less and less “optional” items on cars. We will not see a 1990 full size domestic with an inline 6 and three speed manual, but they were fairly common in the past, especially with the lower priced marques. Pontiac of Canada was a lower priced marque, so it makes perfect sense.
While I am sure that there are all kinds of statistics, I believe that there were probably more of these than you would remember. Just as there were more early Mustangs and Camaros with inline 6s, V8 motors were often optional, and a pricey option at that. Same with automatic transmissions, AC, and the like. The fashion of collectors from the 70s and 80s was to find a car with every available option on it, or clone one to have it look as it came that way from the factory. Now, we value “patina”, option delete (think radio delete, where not having something adds to value rather than subtract), and base or stripper models being considered as more valuable.
“… think radio delete…”
Radios were options, too before the 70s/80s, so item wasn’t really “deleted”, just not installed. More like “no radio”.
But, the collector market uses delete term, overall.
Yes, we used to call it “no XXX” rather than “XXX delete”. By simply calling it something else, it has caused it to add to the price rather than decrease it.
Sweet car David! I am so jealous. Any rural Pontiac in Ontario would be a hopeless rusty mess.
Love that Fargo PW with the tire on it’s hood too. What a property!
It was an amazing property – I only showed a small portion of what was there.
Always been curious about these Canadian Pontiac variants since I first saw them as a young boy on a family vacation to Canada in the late 1950’s. As a car crazy 6 or 7 year old I could easily name the make and model of any American car, but boy was I confused when I saw a 1954 Pontiac with Chevrolet tailights. And all those apparent Fords with Mercury trim and names like Monarch and Meteor.
On my many visits to Canada since, Pontiacs always seemed to be predominant. Was this Laurentian the Canadian version of the U.S. Star Chief that was longer on the rear than the Catalina?
Not sure about length but it shares the same 119″ wheelbase with the Catalina. The barely fits in my garage – I had to disassemble the work bench I had to make it fit.
No; it’s actually shorter than the US Catalina, because it sits on a 119″ wb Chevy frame.
David, great story!
The ’61 Canadian Pontiac was actually the exact same overall length as the US version and had same 119-inch wheelbase. My dad bought a new ’62 Laurentian. He loved that car but always said, “It’s just a Chevy.” Full-size Pontiac was best-selling car in Canada from 1962 through 1965.
Tony, quite right you are. But that was a one-year only thing in ’61. In ’62 the Catalina/Ventura got a 120″ wb, although I suspect the bodies were still the same length.
I was thinking of the 1965 and up versions, where the Canadian bodies were actually shorter than the US version, as well as the wb being 3″ shorter. And I assume the same was the case pre-1961.
Is this the same Tony Hossain who used to write articles for Car Exchange Magazine?
Wheelbases, length, and front/rear overhangs for the 1961-1965 Pontiac Strato Chief * and Catalina :
1961 Strato Chief*: 119″; 209.9″; 33.5″/57.4″
1961 Catalina : 119″; 210.0″; 34.0″/57.0″
1962 Strato Chief*: 119″; 211.6″; 35.2″/57.4″
1962 Catalina : 120″; 211.6″; 35.7″/55.9″
1963 Strato Chief*: 119″; 212.1″; 35.5″/57.4″
1963 Catalina : 120″; 211.9″; 35.9″/56.0″
1964 Strato Chief*: 119″; 210.4″; 37.4″/56.6″
1964 Catalina : 120″; 213.0″; 36.4″/56.6″
1965 Strato Chief*: 119″; 214.6″; 38.0″/57.6″
1965 Catalina : 121″; 217.9″; 36.2″/57.4″
When thinking of the Canadian. Chevrolet-based Pontiac – think Chevrolet. not Pontiac. Unlike the US Pontiacs the Canadian Pontiacs were all on the same chassis, wheelbase and body. No extended wheelbase and no extended trunks that looked like you were hauling an aircraft carrier behind you.
The Canadian Pontiacs were priced just above the Chevrolet. The Pontiac Laurentian 6 4dr sedan went for C$3061 and weighed 3559 lbs. The Chevrolet equivalent was the Bel Air 6 4dr Sedan – C$2992 and 3652 lbs.
Awesome find David! I look forward to seeing this car compete in the beater challenge. I love that you found a Canadian car, and a Pontiac to boot. The Canadian Pontiac is really the iconic Canadian car of this era IMO. They were extraordinarily popular for a reason, they were good cars and offered great value for the dollar. One minor point though, the 348 was also a Chevrolet engine, not a Pontiac engine.
I have some great memories of these early 60’s Pontiacs. My dad’s best friend had a ’62 Parisienne 4-door hardtop with a 283 for some time. When he sold it I tried to convince my dad to buy it for me (I didn’t have my licence yet), but he refused because it had floorboards like that Frontenac you looked at. I also remember as a young child frequenting a pick-your-part yard that had a very complete ’62 Parisienne 4-door. My brother and I used to play in that car for hours on end while my dad pull parts. I ended up scavenging several parts of that Pontiac as keepsakes.
Thanks. I had that correction on the 348. Canadian Pontiacs are still popular today as classics although mostly Parisiennes or Beaumonts.
Three on the tree, manual steering and brakes. This car is basically theftproof. Anyone young enough to wrestle the manual steering probably would crash before they figured out the manual brakes, and that’s only if they could figure out the column shift manual tranny. Most of the people who drove cars like this way back when are too arthritic to try.
Believe it or not, when I took the classroom portion of driver’s ed in 1995 our textbook still included a diagram of the three speed column shift pattern. So even though I’ve never actually had the opportunity to drive one, I at least understand in theory how to shift one. I have no idea if someone say a decade younger than me would have received that same education.
When I got my license in 1970, my dad made sure I knew how to shift–he didn’t have anything then with an automatic. I learned on his 4-on-the-tree Mercedes, then transferred to a ’41 Chevy with three-on-the-tree. I never had power steering or power brakes until I bought a ’70 Torino Brougham, with the usual 302, Cruise-o-matic, power steering and (grabby!) power brakes. Glad I learned how to do things manually!
I had a neighbor who had a 4-on-the-tree Merc. I was amazed when I first got to ride in it.
I seem to recall the Canadian Pontiacs having Chevrolet frames, thereby not sporting the Pontiac “Wide Track” look. The wheels were moved inboard and I always thought they looked odd for that reason.
Instruction on driving a three on the tree was in our books here in Ontario in 1984.
Never thought I would drive one either until the winter of 87 when I was working at Canadian tire and we had a 74 Maverick come into the shop. There buy working on it didn’t know how to drive it.
What a great car! Somehow the Pontiac body and the 6/3 speed combo overcome my distaste for the way these drive. It is no sin to drive like something from 1951 when the basic car really is something from 1951. 🙂
I am guessing that this uses the good old Chevy steering gear with the ratio that results in 6 full turns lock to lock? If nothing else your biceps should be improved by the end of your trip. I look at this and the theme song from the old TV show Naked City comes into my brain – the NYC detectives in that show drove 61 Pontiacs in many of the episodes I watched.
There are a few other older touches like the six cylinder did not come with an oil filter. The one in my car is an aftermarket by-pass unit.
From the brochure on steering:
Steering – Precision Ball – Race gear, overall ratio 28:1 standard, 24:1 with power steering*
*Optional at extra cost
David, best of luck! What a great find. I had the same engine in my 1957 Chevy 210 sedan that I purchased in pretty much the same condition 30 plus years ago. It ran great and parts are still readily available for the Blue Flame 6. Some cleanup, wheel cylinders, brake lines, a tune up, coolant flush, fresh fluids (don’t forget to check the rear diff) some good tires and an Indian blanket over the seat and you should be good to go!
Surprised that the Volvo P1800’s have not been scooped up by now. The bodies look to be in great shape!!
I think that this is a picture of it on the trailer – https://www.flickr.com/photos/daveseven/36630993173/
Yes – that is my photo – tune in next week for the hauling home story.
Dave, this is a great choice. I love it! Welcome to the world of straight six, three-speed motoring. And what a fine motor it is; the 261 is the most desirable of the Chevys of this generation, and not that easy to come by anymore. It’s a torquey beast, and powered some mighty big Chevy trucks and semis back in the day.
Now the only thing missing to make it perfect is an overdrive. 🙁
From what I have heard the 261 was effectively just a strong in everyday driving as the base V8.
Probably the 292 didn’t make it into the Cheviacs, but I can dream!
Imagine my confusion in the late ’70s as a young teen boy buying U.S. new car mags and looking at the Bonneville and thinking, “That’s exactly like the Parisienne we get up here!” It wasn’t until the late ’80s when the Parisienne name went away and we got the Bonnie up here in Canada too. A friend of the family has an ’83 Parisienne that he bought brand new and I recognized it immediately for what it was – a Chevy Caprice with a Pontiac front clip! It was a nice car, however.
Wonderful find and choice! I looked and Langdon Stovebolt is on Winter break, but this website has parts and really good advice for how to wake up that truck motor without going crazy.
One of my favorite examples of how young people really don’t know that much comes from my memory of Dad’s offer to buy a neighbor’s 61 Catalina for us as a school car. It was owned by an old German Batchelor Farmer from the neighborhood who never drove it over forty, and was just waiting for some young hooligan to get on it and burn out the carbon. But it was a two door post, way too uncool for us. Oh. well. I look forward to your reports of your rehab of this fine old car as my penance for that grave mistake of my youth.
Having lived in Canada for a short time back in the ’60s, I can attest most Canadian Pontiacs could be best thought of by Americans as a Chevy with Pontiac body/interior.
IIRC Canada did have the Firebird and I remember seeing a new GTO Judge when I lived there, but the stunning ’69 Grand Prix was the very first of that flavor, previous models had been Grande Parisiennes repeating the “Chevy w/Pontiac body/interior,” only on a Grand Prix-level scale.
As much as you may have wanted an “Eventful Frontenac,” even if the cars had been in identical condition, the Pontiac with its Chevrolet components will be the more affordable to drive and maintain.
And if you ever decide to swap in a good ol’ stone stock SBC 350 (the bellhousing is different from the old Blue Flames) with a simpler, one-wire alternator and HEI distributor, you have my complete support.
When on vacation in Niagara Falls, family went over to ON, and I was amazed to see so many full size Pontiacs.* Even though Chicago was a big Poncho market, the biggies there were as common as Fords and Chevys back home.
Then noticed the model names and my dad said, “Oh they’re Canadian cars”. In my 12 y/o mind I read Parisienne as “Par-si-enne”.
*I posted before about this, but like to reminisce.
Laurentian Pontiacs back in the day were a popular model in rural areas as many farmers didn’t want the frills urban buyers sought after. I see someone has stuck one of those long amber side-marker reflectors on the front fenders. Hah, haven’t seen those in ages! Its one of those silly after-market gee-gaw gadgets that take away from the appearance of an old car, like running boards.
David, the Volvo 123 GTs are highly desirable as you mention. I know two people in Edmonton who would really like to have one. One of those is a former Volvo dealer principal. A few years back he was on a quest to track one down and was having a tough time doing so.
He had a few still and would sell I believe but he knows what he has and what they are worth. I doubt anyone could anyone could get a steal of a deal on one.
Those Canadian Pontiacs are very familiar, thats what we got here mostly, locally assembled from Canadian kits, in fact a friend years ago had a Laurentian that model six tree on the tree painted glo pink, it was quite gutless being very tired mechanically but it could carry 12 teens crammed in, not the best handling at speed car either it met its fate one wet friday night with a hardwood powerpole buried a couple of feet in the passengers(left) side, my friend replaced it with a rusty Sunbeam Rapier from 1960 and while it drove better and was signifigantly faster and better at handling it was nowhere near as roomy and comfortable, Cool find I look forward to hearing more.
There used to be an immaculate dark green Volvo 123GT parked near my job in Seattle in the mid to late ’80s. Only one I’ve ever seen.
Congratulations and well done, Sir! I’m pleasantly surprised gems like these are still lurking out there. Chinese scrap drives have cleared out just about everything from these parts.
After reading the reports I want to drive the beater challenge too. First I need to find out how to keep below the dollar threshold.
Perhaps, as my wife would remark, I can scam an entry on the basis that no rational human would put more than $500 into the ride I’ve got? It’s been the subject of some discussion…
Fantastic find, can’t wait to read of its travels and travails.
That looks like it’s in amazing shape for 58 years old. I’ll be waiting for updates!
When I started pumping gas at Dad’s station in the early seventies it was not uncommon too pop the hood on a sixties family sedan and see a six banger staring back at me.
You got more of a reaction from me in those days if I popped the hood and saw a big block.
As an aside, my dad picked up a 63 Pontiac Strato-Chief sedan with a 327 4b Chevy and 3 on the tree from one of the locals cheap as he was getting into trouble with it with the local law.
No one expected a plain bare bones sedan to come from the factory like that and he was having great fun racing it.
For a moment, it looked like you were buying it from coldwarmotors on YouTube. He’s somewhere in the Alberta/plain provinces I believe.
He’s got a huge collection of iron that he slowly gets working on and does an unbelievable job with. His latest project is a Citroen.
I love Scott, Stella and Frankers, entertaining, informative and funny as hell.
Coldwarmotors… Just what I need – more reasons to watch YouTube! 😉
Nice, can’t wait for further installments!
Our family car back in the day was a 61 Chevy Bel Air 2-door, with the same flat roof, 235 six, 3-on-the-tree, no radio, and no power steering or power brakes. Looked like this one, except it was turquoise and decidedly did NOT have whitewalls.
No bumper guards either, which could have been helpful when a 63 Plymouth police car hit us from behind on icy pavement and broke one of our backup light lenses.
As for the GBC, you have keenly started with a few extra points = Good Job. 1960’s +200. Defunct brand +100. I would like to see you get extra points for the three-on-the tree. And maybe a few extra points for a Canadian car, just because. One extra point for being light blue. Seems that color helps cars last longer. Resist any temptation to sell parts off your car; there can’t be too many complete examples like yours.
Enjoy!
Please don’t do to this Pontiac what you did to the K-Car…cut a hole in the hood to fit an air intake scoop made from a painting tray!
No cutting planned for this one.
Did you ever find out what was wrong with K-car’s engine?
Nope – sold it off really quickly. After the fact I suspected that the timing was off. The transmission had a leak as well.
What a great find. One of the the things that I like about this car is that it has some delightful details that are baked into the design, even though it’s stripper. First, it has that great grille that curves inward at the top. Then it has the flat top roof, long bladed rear quarter “fins,” those clean oval tail lamps, and that side sculpturing that runs down the sides. All are included in the base price. Good luck with the beater challenge, can’t wait to see updates!
Sweet ride. I’m looking forward to seeing what you do with it. Besides the ’61, I also like the ’63 Parisienne (same age as me), and I’d love to cruise around in one of those old Dodge/Fargo trucks. The old Volvos are cool as well. The salt here in Ontario rotted out so many of those classics – I’m glad to see some of them in decent shape.
That yellow panel truck really needs a Frank Frazetta mural. Molly Hatchet 8 track optional, but strongly encouraged.
Were any of the Volvos at the farm the “Canadian” model? In 1964 Volvo opened an assembly plant in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia (an old warehouse on the docks) where they assembled the 120 series with “Canadian” on the trunk lid. After the 120 they exported some cars to the New England states. Volvo built a new plant in Halifax, but when Ford purchased Volvo they closed the Canadian plant.
I was wondering where is this find I would be really interested on seeing those Volvo
thanks in advance
levi