(first posted 2/24/2015) Those of our readers who keep current on automotive news may have noticed snippets about Volkswagen’s lackluster sales growth. Some bloggers have expressed vindication by the sales slowdown of the Jetta in particular, proving the alleged failure of VW’s Americanization of its sedans. But do that model and the Tennessee-built Passat mark a return to the bad old days of stodgy, slow selling cars? Let’s look to this German-built Quantum, in unfashionable four cylinder, front-drive, automatic trim, for some context.
Straight from the days of VW’s rapid US market decline, this vehicular equivalent of a pocket protector did little as an upmarket offering to shore up the company’s declining North American profits in the face of a strong Deutschmark and stodgy image.
Don’t get me wrong; I find Quantums very appealing, with their upright proportions, excellent use of space and tippy-but-grippy handling in the best European tradition (this was in the days before twenty-inch wheels and rock hard chassis calibrations). Sharing a platform with the Audi 80 (albeit with a semi-independent torsion beam out back in place of a solid axle) is also a plus; an owner so inclined could easily swap in a turbocharged five under the hood, and given the serviceable condition of the body, this particular Quantum is a great canvas for a gear head’s imagination (even an Audi 4.2 V8 will fit).
In 1982, however, there were few turbocharged Audi five-cylinders waiting around in wrecking yards, and even if there were, this was a hopelessly tone-deaf offering to tout as an upmarket family car. While thankfully devoid of Brougham influence, it is not a progressive design for its period. If anything, it was painfully dorky to behold.
Having rescued itself with the excellent Golf Mk1, the VW mothership decided to save money and design its second-generation water-cooled cars in house. That meant the crisp folds of the Giugiaro designed ’70s people’s cars were out, but instead of embracing the aerodynamic futurism that was so cutting edge in its day (think Ford Sierra), Wolfsburg decided to embrace a rather dour stylistic sensibility.
The reprise of the Scirocco, Polo, Golf, and Jetta have all been widely panned, but it’s the Passat/Quantum/Santana which is the most awkward and clumsy of the five, even if the disappointment was much less acute given that the original Passat/Dasher was the least pert of the Giugiaro-designed H20-coolers to begin with.
The flush headlights of the European market version would’ve helped the front end design a bit, but there’s no hiding that very long overhang. Moving back, there is a fixed front quarter light which serves no purpose beyond adding another vertical line to the car’s shape. Still, the Quantum is immediately identifiable as a Volkswagen of the era; dorky, but full of character. Age has been kinder to these cars than some of the more fashionable designs of the ’80s (think Isuzu Impulse, again by Giugiaro).
When new, though, it was a rustic looking device when compared to workaday domestic competitors like the Opel Ascona, to say nothing of the very clean GM A-bodies offered for sale in the US. The average contemporary consumer would had to have been a Volkswagen or diesel devotee to consider the Quantum in ’80s America.
Inside, things were resolutely functional; don’t let the chrome plating on the door handles (which are oddly more modern looking than the ribbed air-cooled VW pieces found on the otherwise suave 1984 Audi 5000) fool you. This dashboard would endear itself to hipsters today; it’s not as crude as a Volvo 240’s piece, but it’s intentions were far more modern when new and as such, it makes a great period piece. Its obscurity is an added bonus. Ergonomically speaking, the Quantum was a real success, with the radio and climate controls up high, where the Japanese generally refused to place them, and chair-height seats. It makes up for the quirky four-button steering wheel and console-mounted window switches. All in all, it’s a very likable space, in keeping with VW’s upmarket aspirations.
Those who could get past the severity of the overall package weren’t rewarded with much power, sadly, but they did benefit from Bosch fuel-injection. With no insane fast idling, simple emissions control and minimal hesitation, the system endowed the Quantum with drivability unmatched by many four-cylinder competitors. A good number of us forget what a breakthrough the better fuel-injection systems were in their day. With direct injection and turbocharging spoiling us with unbelievable torque these days–just look at the 1.8 in today’s Jetta–it’s even easier to lose perspective.
It’s too bad that, in 1.7 liter, four-cylinder form, the CIS injection system still resulted in a marginal 74 horsepower. That was great in a Rabbit or a Jetta, but even in the dark days of the early ’80s, people expected more speed to compensate for their insane financing rates, especially at nearly $11,000 for a base model in 1982. By comparison, a significantly cheaper Stanza gave its driver command of 94 horsepower, and the carb’d 626 still provided a torquey 83. Some compensation was available in the 100 horsepower five-cylinder engine which came along in 1983 (except for the three-door) for cars with the new GL5 trim level and by the end of the model run in 1988, power was up to a rousing 115 horsepower. For a public which still associated the brand with Beetles, regardless of interior quality and road manners, that sort of straight line performance was impossible to overlook.
That fuel injected five, in addition to the availability of turbodiesel and all-wheel drive offerings, did little to entice buyers. Bigger and more expensive than the likes of the Stanza, 626 or Accord, all of which were slicker offerings in the compact market, and less glamorous than the similarly priced but more powerful Cressida or Maxima, the Quantum had few direct competitors. Loaded midsizers from Detroit, like the A-body and extended K-cars matched it in terms of capacity and price, while low-end Saabs and Volvos most approximated the car’s more fundamental qualities. Even then, Volkswagen could never meet the Americans when it came to value or the Swedes when it came to snob appeal. Let’s not forget that water-cooled VW reliability was never much to brag about in those years.
Quantum possessed ride, handling and interior quality befitting of an Audi, but without the same cachet. For a certain kind of buyer, that made a lot of sense. For the majority of customers, it was slow, nerdy and relatively pricey; offerings like this nearly cost Volkswagen its place in the American market. Increased sales beginning in the mid 1990s kept them from abandoning the US altogether, but it would be a while before the lesson was finally learned: popularity in Europe doesn’t translate to mainstream success in North America.
Related reading:
Curbside Classic: 1974-1981 VW Dasher (Passat B1) VW Finally Enters The FWD Era
Curbside Classic: Audi Fox/80 (B1) – The Foxy Mother Of The Modern VW/Audi Era
What fuel injection system do these have? Do they have L-Jetronic or still K-Jetronic?
K-jetronic (CIS). None of the vw water coolers had L-jet, except for maybe the water cooled Vanagon
Okay, so it’s like contemporary Audis, with K-Jetronic mechanical injection and (in the U.S.) probably electronic ignition and a lambda feedback sensor?
Can’t say for sure, but Lamba feedback was added to 84 4000s, and 85 Golfs/Jettas in US. Probably added around that time to these as well.
I was thinking how dowdy this VW looked until I saw the photo of that K car or whatever it is, with that hideous rear roof/upright rear window. The VW suddenly looks great!
“Whatever it is” is not a K-Car, but a Pontiac 6000. It didn’t make it to the mid-1990s but its siblings from Buick and Oldsmobile did; and by that time, they looked their not-inconsiderable age. By that time even the K-Car’s last descendants had been discontinued.
At that, the A-body wagons had a sleeker rear roofline than the orignal sedans.
They also offered three-row seating – 8 passengers with the usual bench front seat – unlike this VW that was strictly a 5-seater.
The body text mentioned the Opel Ascona as competition, on its’ GM J-body. It wasn’t offered as a wagon on the Continent – Vauxhall cobbled one together for the UK using panels flatpacked from Holden in Australia – and a J wagon would likely have been substantially cheaper than the Quantum in America even in fully-loaded Oldsmobuick guise let alone a comparably equipped Chevy Cavalier.
Nice write-up Perry. Can’t even remember what these cars were called in Europe, but it wasn’t Quantum.
Fuel injection? I was given a stark demonstration of it’s effectiveness when I changed the spark plugs on my W124 the other month.
Had not changed them since buying the car 2nd hand over seven years and 55,000 kilometres ago; frankly I forgot about them entirely.
I was amazed to see the old one were in perfectly good condition. No oiling, no burnt ends, no soot. I changed them anyway and the performance improvement was quite dramatic. Thank you Bosch.
Volkswagen Passat in Europe, generation B2.
Since the 1996 B5 Passat this Volkswagen model does very well in the European D-segment.
Actually the sedans were called “Santana”
Mainly sold with their Scrooge-Diesel in Europe, slow, slow, tres tres slow but unbelievebly economical.
A car I’d always wanted to get out of, depressing black plastic interiors, very understeered FWD, much more then the competiton.
As Johannes Dutch rightfully states, IMO the first really good Passat that I really enjoyed and sold with nearly half a million K on the clock was my 2002 TDI B5 face lift model with 130 horses.
But that was a high line model having nearly all the goodies
And still, my collegues 406 Peugeot Diesel was still the better driving car with better seats !
TDI with 130 hp, this logo IIRC, with a red D and I.
More red letters meant more power, so TDI all red was the most powerful.
I had a Quantum TD for a while in the late 2000’s. I didn’t know there was such an animal until I saw it advertised for sale. Gas prices were on the way up, I had a long commute, and shale oil and crashing oil prices were several years in the future. Who was to say then that gas wouldn’t be $7 gallon in a few more years?
If you think 74hp is bad, try 68hp! It was clear from the test drive that the drive train was downright agricultural, but I was gung-ho for mileage at the time. The car’s general unrefinement finally wore me down, and I sold it. Most unpleasant car to drive I’ve ever owned.
I’ve had an Audi 4000 quattro for 15 years, and I might have liked a Quantum Syncro.
The front seats in the Quantum were pretty well flat. After the contoured seats in the 4000 quattro, they were a real comedown.
Just as well it didn’t come as a sport model: TDS anyone? 🙂
Even in Europe the pre-B5 Passats were just a sideshow of the successful Golf & Transporter. Although the B3 and the updated B3 (called the B4) did better than this article’s archetypal Naked German Chariot.
In this class (the middle class-midsizer, these days known as the D-segment) people bought Fords, Opels, Peugeots and Renaults in the eighties and early nineties.
Thanks for taking your time for another great write-up, Perrry. Sure miss the old school German cars of this era, those seats and ergonomics were amazing for the early 80’s. I had a friend in high school who had one in the late 80’s, and frankly I was quite jealous- especially after I realized that his father had purchased it for a song. The car was Teutonically serious and solid, yet comfortable.
My Father and I test drove new E-classes not too long ago, which made me appreciate a G37 rental I had for two weeks in California even more. The Infinity was more German feeling: stark and no nonsense. The Benz was a poor attempt of a Lexus- faux AMG accessories, ridiculous options, plastic bling and pleather. Where was the oversized clock? Scientific style gauges? Oversized steering wheel? “Real” MB Tex? Real metal? Only the gas pedal, power seat controls and door slam were old Benz. They would have never resorted to such silliness back then. VW/Audi and BMW have done similar.
“Where was the oversized clock? Scientific style gauges? Oversized steering wheel? “Real” MB Tex? Real metal? Only the gas pedal, power seat controls and door slam were old Benz. They would have never resorted to such silliness back then. VW/Audi and BMW have done similar.”
I get your point totally. But honestly? If they´d still built cars like that, they´d be a laughin stock and wouldn´t sell a single one of them except for those few that would go to nostalgia freaks.
The quality of MB interiors, even the S Class, is now crap. I drove my friend’s new E Class a short time ago, and there is absolutely nothing special about the car, especially the interior. Audi has a much nicer interior.
The nostalgia freaks are the only ones who actually praise those brands for their actual merits, Mercedes now rests on the laurels they praise, because other than the snob appeal there’s very little that makes Mercedes Benz desirable now.
Here in Australia Mercedes has been having something of an advertising blitz lately (meaning even I see the ads!). Must be having trouble moving the metal. I can’t say any of their current line-up appeals to me.
AMG seems more like an option package than an actual hot Merc now a days too, it used to be a real event seeing an AMG when I was a kid, now? it’s just another shiny badge on another ugly SUV
And probably ordered with an eye to resale value rather than actual capabilities.
why am i intrigued by these? slow and stodgy, yes – but the boxy styling, so practical and the simplistic interior styling just call to me (a siren song?). the size is also attractive. not a huge over bloated boat but larger than the small econobox offerings of the time. i’ve never driven one and cannot recall seeing one on the road until i was at least 27 so i know they were not very common in southern michigan. still, were i in the market for a car and this or some version of this were available it would be on my shortlist. hopefully updated with something more robust in the engine department! times have changed.
Wow. This is basically the car I learned to drive on (along with a ’74 Bug) and drove throughout high school, so this brings back a lot of memories. We had an ’82 station wagon with automatic transmission and the 74-hp, four-cylinder engine. As you note, the 5-cylinder didn’t come until later. The car was damn-near indestructible despite near-constant abuse, lasting 180,000 miles or so at a time when that was really something.
I always thought the Quantum was a handsome car, especially in the color we had (I think it was sand metallic), which was a really attractive light brown. I disagree that it was not a progressive design. Certainly, it wasn’t as progressive as the Audi 5000, but the 5000 came out the same year and was so far ahead of every other car being sold in America that it might as well have come from another planet. The Taurus was still four years away. Think of what Ford and Oldsmobile were selling in 1982, and compared to that, the Quantum was extremely modern and European-looking. If you looked closely, there were all kinds of aerodynamic touches (like the way the hood curved upward at the cowl to smooth airflow over the windshield) that were unusual for the time.
The car didn’t have a lot of power, but in the era of the 55-mph speed limit, that was fine. (Probably the perfect car to give to your high-schooler: it was almost impossible to drive fast enough to get into much trouble with, although I think I did get it up to 80 mph going downhill once or twice.) It was very space-efficient, and the interior was nicely designed. It had a good solid feel on the highway–you really felt like you were driving on rails. We need more cars like this: practical, well-designed, reliable, solid transportation without ridiculously overpowered engines and overly macho styling. If they made something like this today, I would buy it, but I realize I’m probably in the minority. I have no need for 300 hp. You can only go so fast on the Belt Parkway anyway.
The Quantum was sort of a poor man’s Audi (although the price, at around $12,000, was quite steep for the time), and we probably had one of the few Quantums in the U.S. without air conditioning. My father was a child of the Depression, thought A/C was an unnecessary expense that was only going to break anyway, and wouldn’t have it. Our local dealer had to search the Northeast for a Quantum wagon without A/C and finally found one in the Adirondacks. He was also annoyed that they forced him to “pay for a radio,” which came standard, and which he would rather not have. It was the worst car radio in the world, an AM/FM model that couldn’t pull in any stations that were more than five miles away. I changed that out once I started driving the car. The car also had a power antenna which only worked for about the first two weeks. After several trips to the dealership, we finally just unplugged it.
Good times. Thanks for the memories.
While you wax eloquent about the car, your comments are a perfect example of how the American car buyer can praise a rational, competent, modest automobiles as something they really want and “why doesn’t the manufacturer makes something like this” . . . . . . . yet when it actually arrives, the wallet stays snapped shut, and doesn’t open unless something flashier comes along.
You’re the kind of customer that is far and few between. As Volkswagen found out to its sorrow.
Its like with the ladies, huh? You want that reliable wallflower, that doesnt stray, stays at home, cleans the house, bakes, cooks, washes the dishes and does the laundry.
But eventually you will take home the one with the short skirts and the high heels, right?
I don’t know about that–good-looking, unpretentious, reliable, and low-maintenance work for both cars and women for me now that I’m a middle-aged gentleman. I’m not interested in the female equivalent of a Lamborghini. Too temperamental. I don’t have the mental energy to deal with that.
And of course, both need to be able to carry a 4’x8′ sheet of plywood.
I recently broke up with a Lambo type woman… what a ride, but dayum… the maintenance costs 😀 !!!
Actually, I managed to end up with a combination of the two.
Marrying her in April.
Congratulations, and best wishes for your future together.
I wasn’t being fair to today’s cars, which are so much better than the cars of my youth in so many ways, and less-expensive, to boot. My ’09 Accent is simple, low-frills, cheap, roomy, and reliable, so I really can’t complain. Recently, I’ve had my eye on a 2011 Elantra Touring which seems about as close to the Quantum as I’m going to find today: small outside but roomy inside, with a well-designed interior, good fuel economy, and good-enough performance.
Engines are too big these days. I doubt that more than 25% of car buyers give any kind of damn about 0-60 times or horsepower ratings. Most people just want something that’s quick enough, roomy, safe, reliable, and fuel-efficient. In the ’80s, engines were much smaller because efficiency was the word of the day and besides, with the 55-mph national speed limit, most people never even thought about driving over 65-70 mph, so there was no point to making ridiculously overpowered cars. I wouldn’t mind a return to say, a 60-mph national limit, if that meant getting rid of the overpowered gas-guzzling monstrosities that clog our roads today.
Leatherstocking,
You noted that your family’s 1982 Quantum wagon cost around $12,000, right?
According to my copy of Standard Catalog of Imported Cars (1946-2002) that I just consulted, a BMW E21 320i of the same year (’82) started at $13,295, not including freight and destination. From what I remember about them, the E21s felt somewhat crude and underpowered. I guess by that point, people were buying them just to have the roundel badge.
You had me until 60 mph speed limit.
I agree though that many pedestrian cars today have more power than necessary. In the last several years we’ve seen both MPG and power shoot up significantly in engines. The thing is though in the several years prior, where ~200 horsepower was generally the top engine’s output, power has gone up anyway, and I can’t help but think if the displacement was dropped so power would match the previous outputs, MPG would skyrocket.
Speed limit though? No. Modern cars are very efficient at high speeds, we have to live with ugly aero blobs because of it. 60 mph nearly defeats the purpose of having those aerodynamics, I may as well daily drive an Escalade.
I’m with you, but I don’t think many Aussie drivers would cope with higher speeds (100km/h here), to judge from the idiots I see around me.
Maybe we need to outsource driver licensing to Germany.
60 mph limit? All I can ask is “Are you nucking futs”??? My old ’96 Crown Vic gets better fuel mileage at 80mph than it does at 65mph. Why that is IDK but I roll with it. And especially out West the distances are just too long and dead boring to putt around at such a slow speed. Try driving I
the silver hatch – as a GL5 – that was mine!
Though the Passat is a lot more dumpier looking, I’m still surprised how much of Giugiaros lines is still felt over that whole package. Which begs me to wonder how much work was actually divided between VW and Giugaro. The cars lack the panache of a true Italian design, but perhaps there was still tie ins with the packaging? Considering Giugaro has the credit for the B2 Audi 80 design of 1978, which is the platform the B2 Passat is based on.
I agree. I never saw this generation Quantum as suggesting VW had moved on from Giuigaro’s work. Rather, I always felt it was blatantly milking GG’s pervious work on the Golf, Scirocco, and first gen Quantum/Passat. That was a big part of what made them so dorkily appealing…the styling continuity was evident, as was the naivete and conservativeness of VW’s in-house designers.
This wagon is just like my 1985 Passat Variant, except for the color and US-spec headlights. It has 1.8 liter carbureted DS engine and AT; used to have power steering but as of now has been converted to manual, which still requires quite little effort. I use this car mostly to carry parts for my other projects. Its a tough old fellow with 350 000 kms on the odometer (last checked in Germany in 1999 at 147 000). You can find a lot of B2 Variants in rural regions of Russia, Ukraine and Byelorussia – they are incredibly tough and, unlike the more sophisticated later VW models, very simple to repair, especially the 4-cylinder carbureted models. And, thanks to the production in Brazil, you’ve got a lot of affordable spare parts (there is a lot of Quantum parts in my car). By the way, I actually kind of like the styling, for a wagon. The sedan (Santana) is ugly, though.
Those are some pretty well maintained apartment blocks.
Great find. I remember puzzling over these in VW showrooms in 1985 as I was shopping for a GTI. On the one hand, they seemed solid and no-nonsense, the kind of car that appealed to my frustrated engineer side. But then they were ungodly expensive for what you got. I seem to recall these stickering in the $15-16k range by then, nicely equipped with the five.
VW back then had the unique ability to sell you a car that would appear to your neighbors and passengers as costing 20-25% less than you actually paid for it. Never a winning formula.
Nicely put.
I think, for sensitive drivers, the ability to drive fast without wind leaks (rare in the 55 mph days, I guess) or to go over pot holes without the suspension crashing through showed where the money went.
Great write up, from the former owner of an Audi Fox and as someone intrigued by the Dasher and Quantum…particularly the wagons.
HOWEVER, your “dismissal” of front quarter windows on these cars as being useless and just adding another vertical line to the car’s profile does not take into account the possibility that there may not have been room in the door to lower a large pane of glass completely or that such a large window might have been difficult to keep properly/noiselessly sealed at high speeds.
I agree somewhat that VWs sales malaise may be due to the stodginess of their styling but would like to believe it’s because buyers have FINALLY heard enough horror stories about the non-existent reliability of VW products and their lackluster dealer service after the warranty expires….and often before it expires.
There is a huge difference between “German engineering” and designed by Germans but not built by Germans.
Well on the Mk2 Golfs and Jettas, they were fully flush, but on the Quantum, they are not, so I don’t see the point. And it’s not such a large pane of glass that they couldn’t get proper sealing, especially given where the mirror was mounted. But, I don’t think they’re ugly, just outdated and weird. I actually like the character they add to the design.
And yes, agreed about the quality. So strange that this never hobbled the company’s products in Europe, where they were mostly seen as reliable.
My first car was a burgundy over tan 1986 Quantum GL5 sedan that I inherited from my grandparents when I turned 16 in 2005. I kept it for a year before I grew tired of its inability to start in weather colder than 40 degrees and having grown up near Milwaukee…. well you get the point. Had it been a syncro wagon with a 5 speed instead of the dowdy automatic sedan I might have held onto it longer, but a slick red Acura Integra really called to my then 17 year old self.
Maybe it was destiny, but once the Acura grew old and tired of the Salty Wisconsin winters, I found a burgundy over tan 04 Subaru Forester and fell in love with it for all of the ways it reminded me of my old Quantum. The same upright stance, the same high quality German feeling interior, and the same “excellent use of space and tippy-but-grippy handling”. Finally I was able to fulfill my teenage fantasy of a nerdy-cool northern European feeling AWD wagon with a 5 speed, only this one happens to be built in Japan.
Cheers for the memories!
I think that VAG is doing well here in the US. Because of one word: Audi.
I think that the Jetta/Passat are suffering from “Dodge Dynasty Syndrome.” There’s nothing really wrong, but there’s nothing to love.
It’s just “bland”,
I rented a 2014 Jetta from Zipcar recently. I had been looking forward to it because I grew up driving VW’s and always liked them for that special something they had that other cars didn’t. (Of course, they didn’t have the reliability of a lot of other cars either, which was the problem.) I was disappointed by how strangely generic it felt, and by the cheap interior materials. The radio had a black-and-white display that reminded me of the screen for a TRS-80. Not exactly a BAD car, but you’re correct–there was nothing to love, either.
There’s *one* thing really wrong with the Dodge Dynasty and its’ siblings. Styling a decade out of date on the day job one rolled off the assembly line.
Iacocca strongly believed there was still a market for the sheer look as an alternative to “jellybean cars”. There was – for already-amortized holdovers, but not for a whole new lineup that limped along as a fleet queen until the LHs were ready.
Nice write up, I haven’t seen one of these in years though cntemporary Golfs and Jetta are still common here. Since the debut of the first Golf, VW’s design language has been remakably consistent (and conservative). Perhaps that’s part of the problem, but when I bought my Mark VI Jetta that was a selling point. The car will not look dated the way the Civic will.
As to VW’s current sales, they may be disappointing but they’re still good by historical VW standards. The problem is not enough product in the pipeline, lack of a 3rd row CUV, and for some, too cautious styling (can you tell a difference between a 2014 Jetta and the “restyled” 2015? As to reliability, so far in four years my only beef is a split in the V-tex upholstery on the drivers side. Hopefully I didn’t just jinx it as it comes out of warranty!
The interior is almost a carbon copy of the ’87 Jetta Carat I once owned, from the seats, door panels and auto shifter/console design. It’s even the same steering wheel! Alas my experience with Volkswagen was incredibly negative. Would I buy another VW? Nein!!!!!!!!!
Ah yes the car that kept my uncle’s foreign repair service going strong during the 80’s and 90’s. They drove nice when new if sluggishly but cost a lot to purchase and keep up after the warranty ran out. Plus they were very plain and austere inside with black steering wheels and upper dash and door trim followed by nasty cat crap tan upholstery kind of like today but harder and cheaper looking. They sure did well in the ride/handling department though!
As for the current Jetta/Passat they are just too bland and other than interior volume do nothing really well. There performance isn’t top notch, fuel economy is still on the low end, even with the new 1.8T, handling has been softened and the front and rear look like they came out of the 90’s. Then there is VW’s very sketchy long term reliability which I can tell you first hand is very below average judging by the traffic at my Uncle’s foreign sports service center which see’s lots of high end expensive repairs on a daily basis on VW products.
Joe,
I have to ask – does your uncle’s foreign repair service center see Volvos in for maintenance and repairs, and if so what does he like better, the RWD cars or the FWD versions?
Almost every Volvo and/or European car repair shop that I’ve visited has told me that the FWD cars (i.e. 850, S60, V70 etc.) are way more maintenance-intensive and can break like a VW can. But the RWD cars are simple and relatively cheap to fix.
There is something very honest about the Quantum’s styling. And I really like that they are/were rare, even back in the 1980s.
Fast forward to VW’s troubles today, it’s almost like VW has tried too hard to appeal to folks in the U.S. They were always a little too European/quirky for the masses (although I liked them), but now the Jetta and Passat are arguably the most plain designs in their respective classes. Sure, they helped sales from where they were, but they don’t really inspire any excitement for a lot of people. I think styling is a large part of the reason that VW is so far from the ambitious sales goals set a few years back.
And there’s definitely something to be said about VW’s checkered reliability over the years. I bought a new ’12 GTI as my daily driver…and though it has been a perfect car for me–without any mechanical issues in 40k miles–I have this strong sense that it’s not something that would be smart to keep for a long time. Too bad, as I’d love to keep it for several more years, but I’ve heard too many horror stories. I briefly considered getting one of the new 2015’s (despite finding the styling even more boring than the old ones) until a service writer at the dealership told me off the record that there are a LOT of bugs to work out of them. Until VW gets reliability/quality up (real or perceived) they will never really compete with Toyota and Honda.
If your car is reliable, moe, I’d bet on that– not twice told tales on some blog boards. Or you could step backwards and buy an ’09 GTI, mine’s still running strong.
Meanwhile, I miss my Quantum wagon. Quantum Syncro, that is. It replaced an Audi 4000 Quattro, and did everything better. I loved the trunk space and the extra headroom, plus the rarity of it. If you spent your time, as you should, inside looking out, it was a near-perfect car. The driving position and seats were simply perfect, better than any car I’ve owned since. Visibility? Also perfect.
My main complaint, besides lackluster mid-20s fuel mileage, was the cooling system. I had to keep a sharp eye on the temp gauge when climbing mountain roads in midsummer. It seems that when they shoehorned the 5-cylinder in there, there was room for only half a radiator. But if the same car was available with, say, a VW 2.0 TSI turbo and a full complement of air bags, I’d buy another one tomorrow.
Before I bought the QS used, I consulted the service manager at the local Audi store, an old hand named Hans with an accent to match. He was impressed. “That was the best car VW ever made! It has a De Dion rear suspension!.”
It wasn’t just your 5 cylinder Quantum that had a weak cooling system; ALL water-cooled VWs had them. Plastic tanks that separated from aluminum radiator cores, plastic water inlets that oozed and corroded the aluminum under them, making subsequent repairs almost impossible. Heater cores that self-destructed, steel heater hose tubes buried at the bottom of the engine that rusted away, cooling fans that lost their bearings. Add to that the fact that one overheating would likely require a head removal, and… well, I think I’m pretty clear on that subject.
I have owned a lot of VWs and love the way they drive, but I just don’t have the fight in me anymore.
I know what you’re talking about, but it’s not the ’80s anymore. Modern VWs have reliable cooling and heating systems. It’s the electrical system that you have to watch out for. I just bought my first $200 headlight bulb, but with HIDs, you have to pay to play. The only other significant problem with my ’09 GTI was a failed ABS computer, which cost $1200. I think that could happen to any car, they all have one.
Find the car that suits you and don’t be so frightened, that’s my advice. VW has advanced to the middle of the pack of most reliability ratings (I recommend true delta.com), and with the low average repair rates of all today’s cars, that’s good enough for me.
Who’s frightened? I don’t buy new cars, and in the age range of cars that I buy (2-6 years old) it is pretty well documented that VWs should be avoided. You spent $1400 on two repairs. In the 8 years I have owned my daily driver, which was six years old when purchased, I have not spent $1400 total on repairs.
I do my own work and, while every used car I have had has not been perfect, I have seldom been surprised at what I got. I just would prefer not to spend $200 for a headlamp bulb. Mine are $6.99.
A parent of a HS friend of mine bought a Dasher wagon new. It was a great handling car and an attractive, to me then, orange color, but the cooling problems and rust starting happening very early. The rust was from driving on the salt covered roads of NW Washington, D.C.
In my experience, 1980s VWs were like 1960s/70s GM cars: if you bought one that was assembled properly, it would prove very reliable and durable. If not…oh, well.
I had a new 86 GTI in the late 80s–my roomate had a new 87 Jetta. My supervisor’s wife had a new 87 Jetta. They had problems, I did not (except a pinging noise. Dealer could not ‘fix’, and tinkered with something, car ran like crap, I told him to go back to original settings. I then learned that VW had missed some tolerances in the wrist pins or connecting rods, and engine would have to be rebuilt. Though car was under warranty, the thought of the incompetent dealer rebuilding the engine was not appealing, so I did nothing).
I suspect they did not keep their VWs as long as I did. Other than wear items (brake pads, tires) and scheduled maintenance, here is a list of what went wrong: around at 5 yrs old, 75k miles, a pin hole in the upper radiator hose. I taped up and limped home. At 6 years and 92k, radiator started to leak and needed replacing. A few months later, the fan relay wouldn’t work–I had HI SPEED or nothing. At 7 yrs and 105k, replaced the A/C seals. A/C worked again, but after it stopped working in 1996, I did nothing. In 1995, with 130k, I found a puddle under the car–water pump, had it towed.
Over 13 years, and 145k miles, I’d say that’s pretty good. But then, as now, VW dealers sucked, and I knew as many VW owners who hated their cars as who liked (everyone like the cars’ styling, performance, seats, etc).
My car was a little expensive relative to other cars, but proved to be the best car I’ve ever owned. So I’d say 1980s VWs were great cars…Golfs, Jettas, Sciroccos, and Audi 4000s (which were close to VWs), and probably…Passat/Quantums.
If somebody else considers VW ownership to be such a bold, risky enterprise, that’s alright with me. I’ve given up my other high-risk hobbies and I need to maintain a bit of my wild reputation.
I think I had pretty much the same experience with my ’86 A2 GTI…I had mine a bit longer, and did a lot of the work on it myself (it was not trouble-free, but was pretty easy to work on, and I didn’t find the cost of parts to be too bad and I did keep up the maintenance pretty well). I owned it for 15 years (overlapping my current ’00 Golf)…the cost per year was pretty low…I’ve had my Golf for about as long now….I agree the dealers are best avoided, and I’ve had pretty minimal contact with them in the 34 years combined that I’ve owned a VW so far.
I never moved up to the B platform, these were pretty costly and rare, though I did have a friend that bought one used, and he seemed to be pretty happy with it. Maybe people buying this price level may have instead gone with the Audi (my Uncle bought a 4000 around this time which he says is still his favorite vehicle)…not sure how much more the 4000 would have been back then vs the Quantum
I spotted one of those a while back. Amazing how it holds up in salty Detroit suburbs
I feel you may have missed the point of why the Quantum was not a huge success. It really was NOT the styling. They were fine if you liked the sort of no-nonsense, European look. Audi was just starting to experiment with the futuristic look, but the rest were considerably more plain and simple. We cross-shopped it with the Nissan Maxima, GM A-bodies, and Mercury Sable, and though others’ opinions may differ, much preferred the feel and handling of the Quantum to the competition. It was more agile than the giant, round Sable and the rickety A-bodies. Another superior area was the interior, which did seem to have more quality plastics and upholstery, especially when compared to the mouse-fur coated Mercury. The inside of the Maxima was extremely square and button-tastic.
What really destroyed the Quantum, and almost all of that era of VW (including my ’87 Scirocco 16v) was the absolutely miserable reliability. There were numerous issues, the most notable being a long trip that was cut short when the engine started billowing smoke, stranding us in a tiny town where the mechanic had never even heard of a Quantum. Fun times, indeed! That 5-cylinder seemed to have lots of problems. Our ’86 limped along until 1990, and after that, no more VWs for the family.
John,
My godfather once owned an example of the Quantum’s predecessor, a ’77 Dasher – which he always called by its proper name, the Mk1 Passat. Just like your family ’86 Quantum, its reliability was less than stellar, bordering on craptastic. Everything imaginable broke on that thing in the six years he owned it. Water pump, radiator, blower motor, exhaust, brake rotors – you name it, those were all replaced once or twice within a 4 to 5 year period. Oh yeah, and it rusted with a vengeance as well. By ’88 you could see the ground through the floorboards.
In contrast, both of my RWD Volvos – an ’86 and ’91 – happily run along with minimal maintenance. Actually, make that borderline zero maintenance. Nothing ever goes wrong with those cars, but their plastics in the interior are not like VW’s.
From Car Talk:
CALLER: “I have an ’82 VW Quantum…”
TOMMY: (instantly) “And you can’t find any Quantum mechanics?”
Oh, and one more thing, I never understood the front quarter window either. Both the Quantum and Scirocco had it, as well as the Golf and Jetta lines. Around ’88 or maybe a year before, they got rid of it on the latter two and put in a full-sized window instead, so it definitely didn’t seem to be a necessary item for roll-down clearance in the doors.
A quantum of soul-less.
I’ve always found these appealing in Syncro form, especially the facelifted models with the flush lamps (85+ I think?) and shallower bumpers which managed not to look so “nosy”. An honest car with some interesting options. We did have an ’86 Audi 5000 in the family, which was a pretty strong case against VW/Audi reliability in the mid 80’s, but it was very compelling at the same time and this one has similar foundations despite the much more angular lines.
I still see a wagon every once in a great while. It’s been a while since seeing a sedan, and I don’t even remember the existence of the 3-door–must not have sold many in the USA.
And then, of course, there’s the Quantumino:
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/blog/cohort-sighting-vw-quantomino/
The Quantum’s relative failure in the marketplace was the complete fault of Volkswagen AG’s own doing. In the ever increasing image-conscious 80’s, why would anyone choose a Quantum over an Audi 4000S? These two ads for 1984 models should tell you everything you need to know. Same standard equipment list with a/c, power windows, locks, and cruise control? Check. Same exact $12,980 MSRP? Check. Same warranty? Nope; the Audi’s is twice as long… It is truly hard to understand what Volkswagen was thinking here.
Here is the Quantum:
Not an apples to apples comparison exactly. The 4000S is the 1.8 4-cylinder, whereas the Quantum is the 2.2 5-cylinder.
Still though…a little confusing.
And if you wanted a wagon– there was no midsize Audi wagon.
And here is the Audi:
Hey Perry,
I just ran a Carfax on the pictures Quantum using the tag number to determine what year it is. It’s a 1985, and according to the preliminary report it’s a GL with the 1.8-liter four.
I didn’t know I could do that! Do you know when they updated the 1.7 to a 1.8? Prob ’84 or ’85.
Perry,
VW increased the engine size from 1.7 to 1.8 in ’84 for the standard cars – it was always a 1.8 for the GTI and GLI.
For some strange reason, the Audi 2.2-liter five-cylinder was standard in the Quantum sedan but in the wagons, the four-cylinder was the engine that powered those things. I definitely know wagons used the 1.8 in ’85 because my friend and neighbor Arthur, a certified VW authority and enthusiast, has one of those wagons. He bought it in 2003 and his now college-age son uses it as his daily driver.
I’ll tell you one thing – the VWs of the ’80s were never as good as Volvos from that decade.
Was this the generation that started self-destructing around 70K miles? With all kinds of mysterious electrical gremlins?? Or was that the newer, more curvy models?
Good looking car with nice interior, good handling and lots of room. But very expensive for the times, over priced and short on power and reliability. The best one over the long haul for durability, better MPG (and a little lower price) would have been the 4 cyl 5 speed model.
The only point here with which I would quibble is the idea that this has aged better than the Isuzu Piazza. The Piazza certainly looks dated (not surprising given that the design dates from what, 1977–78?), but it doesn’t look dumpy, which the Quantum certainly does. The wagon (Variant?) isn’t as bad as the hatch, but either way, it’s styled like a sack of grain.
Oh yeah, I’d certainly agree that the Piazza is much more attractive. I just think it’s not aged as well. The Quantum has character, but is truly bleak looking.
(six years on) I thought the Piazza/Impulse looked great back then. Today, (from photos) kind of long and pointy in front, but it’s from a million years ago. I think anyone today would be amazed at a non-supercar that’s 1,300 mm (51 in) high. I believe however that they were Chevettes underneath, so sort of the Avanti of their day.
Belive it or not, these VW Passats was considered a “upper workingclass” car in Norway. My grandfather had one, a 1984 with 1.6 liter, 4 speed manual. 75 hp, No power steering, not anything was power except for the brakes.
I have to say that an american from 1984, Caprice, LeSabre, hell even the Malibu with the fixed rear windows was a nicer and much more comfortable car to drive. Even the X-body Skylark had more power, was quieter and more comfortable than the Passat.
You americans have been very lucky. The average american car from 50s-90s was something else than the cars we could buy. Ascona 1.3? Passat 1.6? If you were lucky you were a cab driver that could write off the taxes of a slow MB 200 or 240 D.
I believe you.
With this generation Passat VW definitely started shifting the model line up market. The pricing was definitely beyond that of comparable Opels, Fords and Japanese car of the time yet Germans just loved their Passats. The Passat is to Germans what the Camry is to Americans.
That’s what I remember from the eighties: Volkswagens were expensive new, and then you still had only a steering wheel and seats as standard equipment. Everything extra did cost you extra, and all those options didn’t come cheap.
Japanese cars were cheaper when new and often had a lot of goodies standard.
One thing though: the Volkswagens’ depreciation was lower than any other comparable car, regardless who made it. The value of Japanese cars sank much faster, and more. Japanese cars also changed their styling more often, look how radically the Corolla looks have changed in the past decades.
Right on Johannes. My first car was a second generation VW Polo….you know the one that looked a bit like a little shooting brake? with those long side windows in the back and the straight down rear end?
When that was introduced back in 1981 it was the first small VW that crossed the 10.000 DM mark. I remember the uproar in the car magazines projecting that nobody would spend that type of money on a small Polo. Guess what happened? The Polos sold like hot cakes. Still do.
I remember them, they looked like a small wagon, with that vertical rear.
As a matter a fact, I still see them as daily drivers. Owned by students and such. Often in that typical flat grim VW-purple, or flat dark blue.
…and just like the Germans we say “what’s not on it can’t break down”…
right – almost “volvo-esque” 😉
Over here those Polos have all disappeared. The only 80s VW that are still visible in daily traffic are the Golf 3.
Yep, that’s the lil’ rock solid VolksWAGON alright !
Look at all that glass and the thin pillars, if you need a Parking Assist in this you’d better not drive a car at all.
My grandfather had since WW2 had Vauxhalls, but in 1986 (I think) he bought a two year old VW Passat instead of the old Vauxhall Victor (?).
In 1994 he bought his first all new car, a 94 VW Vento, 1.8 liter, 5 speed and power steering! No ABS, but a driver airbag. My grandmother still drives that car.
It’s very strange, because of the war he didn’t exactly praise the Germans, but his two last cars was German cars. Though he did like american cars, and when I got my first one, which I still has, and other american cars as well, he loved them. “The american knew how to build cars” I remember he was saying a lot of times when he rode in it with me. I’m maybe very off-topic here though 🙂
I like it when a manufacturer achieves a degree of originality whilst keeping a ‘family look’ – VW did this with this gen of Passat, Scirocco and Polo – and without making the cheapest models look like cheapened versions of the others. This degree of subtlety is almost entirely missing in the current models, I feel
Despite being a die-hard VW loyalist these have never appealed to me. If it was a syncro perhaps and I would appreciate the rarity of one with a turbo diesel, but I’d still much rather have a mk1 or mk2 Rabbit/Jetta/Golf.
I will never understand Volkswagen of America´s nomenclature.
The Passat became the Dasher, then the Quantum and now its back to Passat?
Just the like the Golf sedan became the Jetta, then the Vento and after that the Bora only to go all the way back to Jetta ???
Maybe it’s Volkswagen overall. For us the sedan was the Jetta the entire time–we never had the Vento or Bora names. Maybe in Central/South America or Mexico but not in USA/Canada.
They did, however, play games with the Golf name. The Mk1 Golf debuted as the Rabbit in Canada and the US. It switched over to the Golf nameplate for the Mk2, and stayed there for over 20 years, until switching back to Rabbit for the Mk5–but only in the USA, not in Canada. With the Mk6, it switched back to Golf, again.
Makes no sense.
you´re right Chris.
They dropped the Jetta name over here as it had a terrible reputation for being awfully square and mundane. When they tried to move the car up market they tried a different name. Didnt work. People realized that it was the same old boring Golf sedan. In the US the Jetta had a much better reputation…at times.
I had a 1.7 diesel 5 speed manual back in 88.
Fabulous car, one of the best everyday drives I ever owned.
Quick enough, comfortable, cheap, solid, roomy and reliable.
I wish I had one now.
I remember driving frequently in thick fog, and for some weird reason I could drive faster than in any other car in those conditions, still keeping on the safe side.
It got sadly warped in a crash, hit from behind: her tail was plowing the tarmac, a neat fold in the roof, the whole structure bent.
Got it back on the road, but it just wasn’t the same car, so it was eventually traded-in for my first Volvo, a 245.
I haven’t thought of the Quantum in years. It would be cool to own one now.
Parents had a used ’85 GL they bought in ’87 and owned until 1993
, when they were told by the dealer the engine block had a crack in
it and would cost nearly $2,000 to replace(block plus labor).
Great article! I loved my Quantum!
Just wanted to mention my ’83 Quantum Turbodiesel — only 35 years young…
Was a long-time owner of a diesel Rabbit, thinking about trying to “upgrade” it with a turbo, etc. — but then came across this Quantum TD GL (l believe the “Santana” name was what they used in Brazil, etc.).
It is kind of “pedestrian”, but gets a lot of looks from other drivers, I imagine just due to extreme rarity. With alloy wheels and such it actually looks almost contemporary in some surroundings. And I kind of admire the rear pillar design, it’s quite “Dasher-esque”), while having the much trimmer rear lines of a sedan.
With the 1.6TD motor it struggles a bit getting off the line, but once it hits highway speeds it’s like “warp 6, Mr. Sulu”, it’ll quickly climb right off the top of the speedometer and keep on going (“very” impressive trait to a diesel Rabbit owner).
And one hill which “separates the men from the boys”, the west side of the Eisenhower tunnel climb in Colorado, gains almost 3,000 ft. in 7 miles — I have “never” had another 4-cyl vehicle that could climb that hill without shifting down multiple gears (and a few 6-cyl cars as well); that Quantum TD motors along at 60-65 mph all the way up, in 4’th gear, and even passing 11,000 feet altitude is still not at full throttle — I can live with that…
You’re right, electrical part reliability is so-so (and the A/C system is an add-on nightmare), but other than replacing the clutch, radiator and some exhaust components it’s been mostly unstoppable for better than 9 years now (always passes emissions tests, etc.).
And even if something breaks down, the diesel Rabbit still runs (depending on how you define “runs”). What’s to complain about?
Interesting contrast, too, between the German-built Quantum and the Pennsylvania-built Rabbit (with all its Brazilian VW parts and “mouse-hide” seats). But while the Rabbit barely qualifies as a “go-kart”, the Quantum feels more like a “real car”. Reminds me of the Fiat 131 Mirafiori twin-cam I had for a number of years.
My kids have had various Golf’s & Jetta’s (even a Scirocco, I think), but still think the Quantum is the better-built car…
I miss the low belt line/tall glass area on many cars from that era. The Quantum wagon is a fine example. So many cars today have absolutely horrible sight lines and gun-slit windows.
Great article, although I don’t have much love for 80’s era VWs. The exception would be the Golf GTI.
Not many old 80’s VWs left running up here in the Great White North. Keeping one running would certainly be a challenge with next to none in wrecking yards. Much the same story for Audi models of that era.
My son had a 78, 4000 Quattro which was a terrific car no matter what the season and was certainly worth keeping. Alas, he needed money for a two year stay in Central America and the Audi went away.
If I stumbled across say a mid-eighties Golf GTI and it was complete, I’d certainly buy it for the right price and use it as a summer car.
The 2 door hatchback looks like a squared-off variant of the 412
Needs a Quantum mechanic. Pah dum pah.
(Joke credit to NPR car guys years ago)
It does show a strong resemblance to it’s GM A body competitor, especially the Celebrity wagon when it had the quad lights.
My best friends parents had a Passat/Quantum wagon with the 54 hp naturally aspirated diesel that they drove well into the nineties. I still remembered going to an amusement park two hours away with 5 people in that car. As long as the road was flat it travelled admirably at 80 to 90 mph.
To my knowledge Nissan briefly sold a version of these in Japan with the Audi 2 liter inline five and a 20V-head.
Oy, Perry, I think you are being way too hard on this car’s styling. It’s simple, clean, european, and effective. The beltline is low, lots lf.glass area and thin pillars. The body isn’t cluttered up with lots of weird curves and lumps.and bumps. It’s not strikingly beautiful but it is handsome on a way.
What killed this car was the price and lack of power. People who had paid $2000 for a beetle 10 years before were not able to wrap their heads around a 12k vw. For around 10k in 1982, you could have gotten a buick regal wagon with the 305 and around 140 hp and lots of torque and loaded to the absolute Gunwales. If you wanted to be more frugal, you could have gotten a new fwd aries wagon loaded up for around 8k with lots more power room and comfort. Plus neither the regal nor the aries had vw service records. The audi was only a little bit more. . . So people who really wanted this got the Audi version.
I have much fonder memories of the Quantum, having spent several years in the front and back seats of the Quantum-derived VW Santana taxicabs as an expat in Shanghai. VW did a pleasant facelift of the dowdy old Quantum and created the spacious China market Santana. If anything, this car is indestructible, old examples could log 200,000 or more miles and still be going strong. Sure, it had a boomy 1.8L 4 cyl engine, noisy inside with a gritty ride that was probably a result of very stiff and durable suspension bushings. But as a workhorse, the Santana/Quantum in it’s elder years couldn’t be beat.
There was nothing unique about this car except its high price. It looked like a big Rabbit after seven years of seeing Rabbits everywhere. The styling overstayed its welcome in the US and the only people interested in something like this were die-hard Deutchephile yuppies. It wasn’t a Volvo. It wasn’t a Saab. It wasn’t a BMW. It wasn’t an Audi. It was a VW that was priced in their league.
Nope – no sale.
The quantum was a nice car. It had a really nice interior, roomy and was good looking. it was probably perceived as over priced for the vw image at the time and was under powered compared to some US offerings. The coupe/hatchback was especially attractive, but in the US a hatchback meant economy, car, which, of course only hurt the image of the quantum.. towards the end those Synchro wagons were really sharp! Probably a collectors item Now.
So basically people thought it was over priced so they went and bought a Chevy citation. How did that work out? Lol.