At the recent Frankfurt Auto Show, Honda introduced an urban electric car concept called “Urban EV”. Its view of the future includes a bench seat! Is the wheel of fashion turning back to the once ubiquitous bench? Should it?
The Urban EV is a cute little city car, reminiscent of their original N600. Honda’s CEO says “a production version of this car will be in Europe in 2019.” Will they keep the bench?
View from inside seems like a little living room with a sofa and an entertainment center.
Today’s bucket seats are generally much more comfortable and supportive than the bench seats of old. But they do separate driver from passenger(s). Do you think bench seats are in our future?
With packaging that appears oriented towards interchangeability, consumers should be able to remodel their car interiors fairly easily. Going from buckets, to benches or futons, and back.
Or even orthopedic seats! Remember the ’79 Mustang Pace Car, which had Recaros? These might be appreciated today by the growing demographic of aging buyers.
If if means elimination of those consoles of asinine size, I’m all for it. Consoles the size of most New England states is a fad anyway, and perhaps this is a sign it’s finally ran its course.
It’s a joyful day. ?
You can thank crash safety for the bench going away. In side impacts, often the middle hump of the floorpan is a part of the crumple zone, and shouldn’t have a delicate meatbag sitting on it when its doing work. The console also keeps legs and everything else neatly in line. Keeping the passenger oriented to allow safety features to work is a big part of why they cut fewer bodies out of cars these days.
I never liked benches anyway. A relic of malaise and the preferences that went with it.
Interesting reasoning regarding side impacts, I would not have thought of that. It does make me wonder though, why then are rear bench seats still practically ubiquitous? Less concern for that area (many states still don’t require rear seat passengers to be belted), assumption that nobody will be sitting there, or something else? Front bench seats are also still relatively available (though I’m not sure I’d be willing to say “common” anymore) in pickups.
To market the cars as “seating 5”.
There are crash test ratings for rear seat passengers, I highly doubt this is a safety issue.
I also don’t think the floorpan hump is intended to be a crumplezone, they are designed to be rigid, in fact the whole passenger compartment is designed to be a safety cage, and it’s not a very good cage if a major structural beam collapses within. Side curtain airbags are literally there as a substitution for the intentional lack of passenger compartment intrusion in a side impact.
The safety issues come from the airbag to be effective for the front center passenger, needing a shoulder belt, and needing a head restraint which could block rearward visibility. Recall that many cars from decades past had a split bench where the center passenger’s only backrest was the unfolded armrest which wasn’t even as tall as the main seat back.
For me the ability to seat a third passenger was secondary to the ability to easily slide from one front seat to the other when tight parking made ingress/egress from the other side difficult, and having a column shifter (if automatic transmission, which is usually the case now) instead of a less convenient floor shifter which also stole much space from the console (of course, all sorts of small but funky shifters have sprouted in recent years, which bring their own problems). Maybe the best bench seat design was that used in late-’90s and early ’00s Tauruses, which double-flipped into a full-length console when the center seat wasn’t being used.
That I agree with, I just balk at the center being dangerous for being a so-called crumple zone. Lack of or inadequate restraints in that position is a different matter, but it’s not something automakers couldn’t do if customers were demanding bench seats in their cars today, airbags used to be much more difficult to integrate, which may have been the impetus to dropping front benches from the options lists in the first place.
The rear seat’s side impacts can be absorbed by more of the rear structure of the car. Front seat passengers are sitting in the middle of the open space and not against the wall, so to speak. For all you doubters, it’s not hard to find mentions of this online. The central tunnel DOES reinforce the car in that it makes it stronger against bending. It also provides a place for stuff to run through, and a place to crush which doesn’t have living things in it, which can absorb side impact while maintaining space where the seat and person are located.
I’ve seen T-bone accident cars in person, the passenger compartment intrusion is almost always above the rocker panels, dead center in the door(where, conveniently, that mandatory beam is in them), the floor is rarely buckled unless it’s a really fast crash where survivability is a roll of the dice anyway, a car with a lot or rust, or one that simply is a tin can, and even then the floorpan tends to be more folded up than the tunnel
It’s not difficult to identify crumple zones on or in a unibody, they are accordion like stampings so that specific spot will predictably crumple and absorb the energy. They’re designed specifically to absorb energy and not let as much or any transfer to reinforcement. Tunnels are not like this, it’s shaped the way it is for strength and exhaust/driveshaft/transmission routing, period. Tunnels also have a few crossmember box stampings linking it to the rocker panels, usually between pillars and under the seats. There are no crumple zones in these either, and their crucial role is to reinforce the floorpan and tunnel.
With only two seatbelts, it looks more like a loveseat than a bench, but whatever.
I think that those of us old enough to remember that our grandparents cars all had bench seats and that the cool cars had buckets are aging out of this class of car. For millennials who cannot remember ever being in a car with a bench seat, this may be a bit of retro chic that they will find appealing. Will Honda offer an IKEA edition? 🙂
Maybe Honda try to bring back the romantic side of a car, having a couple kissing at some random loving location or the drive-in theater. 😉
YMMV – I happen to fall into the “millennial” (how I detest that word) category, but my driver’s ed car was a Lumina with a bench seat – not exactly the epitome of cool. Bench seats in trucks are fine, though.
+1 on “millennial”
I hate being lumped into that category, as it’s a word more often than not used in a negative context/derogatory form.
Heh-heh — I like it. (How about the “suicide doors” on that concept car, while we’re at it ? Talk about retro . . .)
Here’s an idea for flexible yet safe seating — with the bonus of being able to accommodate all body sizes: “bookends” separating seating positions, slidable left or right, or disappearing, as needed ? Belts would (somehow) be a part of the picture, and perhaps this solution could eliminate the cumbersome child safety seat, as well ?
I hope not. I can think of only one thing a bench seat is convenient for, but a car is hardly my first choice of location for it in the first place.
I’ve never been a fan of bench seats, seeing them largely as wasted storage space for the sake of a seldom used extra uncomfortable seat. The lack of any lower center console makes the dash look unfinished and rather sloppy in my opinion.
As far as actually driving a car with bench seats, they’re hardly the most effective for holding one in place or giving much support. I like my bucket seats to hold me in place, especially when taking fast turns. The fact that many automakers now offer power adjustable side bolsters for an even tighter hold is even more relieving.
I’m not a huge bench seat fan either, but before minivans, bench seats allowed larger families to travel together. Even a compact car could carry six in relative comfort, and seat belted, on a shorter trip.
Dashes without center consoles only look unfinished if there’s a protruding center stack. Personally I hate center consoles, I’d rather just have a soft plush carpet beside be than a lumpy piece of plastic with my loose change rattling around in cocooning me in. Interiors feel so much roomier without them
I like Bucket seats though, and the funny thing with the big bolsters is they almost function the same as an armrest , defeating the only practical purpose of a console.
Your mileage may vary, but I wouldn’t go so far as to say that an armrest is the ONLY practical purpose of a console.
It makes a nice place to stash things like the access token for my parking garage, my building ID, a tire gauge – and in my convertible, a cap to cover my hairless noggin. And regardless of your views, it’s often a place to store a firearm for those who feel a need to carry one.
And while I seldom carry rear seat passengers, I’m sure there are some out there who appreciate that a console provides a simple way to deliver heated and cooled air to them.
A lot of that stuff I put in the glove box (which is easier to lean to without a console in the way!!!), many other things I’ll put in the map pockets or the passenger seatback storage compartment.
I might be stubborn but I never put anything in consoles anymore, the storage compartment is too deep and far back to reach in and find anything quickly, and after a while it just becomes the car equivelant of a junk drawer, and I am way too fastidious a person to put up with that level of disarray.
Well Brendan, thanks for blowing my millennial theory all to pieces. 🙂
Haha. I’m still unclear as to the official birth years that constitute a “millennial”, so I don’t know if I qualify, but I am old enough to remember when most larger American sedans came standard with bench seats. So in that respect, yes, I too associate bench seats with grandparent-type cars. Maybe those born in the decade after me might have different associations?
It truly is making me feel old nowadays whenever I get someone test driving a car who’s license says they were born in the 2000s. In fact, last month I sold a car to a father for his teenage daughter and it was rather jaw dropping to find that I was only a few years closer in age to the daughter than I was to the father. But that’s my “I’m getting old” talk for the day 🙂
On a similar note, I had to explain what a Walkman was to a 10 year old at work the other day!
I was describing the thrill of burning a mix to a CD-R and carrying it with you or playing it in the car, and with a quizzical look she said “I just make playlists on my iPhone.”
I am 25 but I felt ancient in that moment…
My opinion is that the usefulness of front bench seats is largely dependent on the width of the car, and whether it has a driveshaft or not. Anything above about 72″ wide on a FWD car or about 75″ wide on a RWD car/truck, I’d rather have a bench for, even if the center position isn’t used frequently.
While it’s true that benches of old did not provide much support, split bench seats, especially since about the late 80s are much better, as they are basically designed as two near-buckets and a center armrest.
Power adjustable side bolsters? I wasn’t even aware that was a thing.
I learn more about current automobile technologies from you and I thank you for it.
I’m not sure of other brands, but most new BMWs have them. It’s really nice being able to adjust what is basically the width of the seatback. I have a slim frame (5’7″, 125 lbs) and I really like being “cradled” by the seat, so it’s nice being able to bring the bolsters in tight to do their intended job effectively.
Oh, it’s got a squarish steering wheel, and fake wood, and a HDTV to keep you focused on something, anything! And that HDTV has a format that I have not seen anywhere. We need a new format because the existing formats are not screwed up enough yet.
Seriously, this is an interesting study. But I can’t imagine it rolling off the assembly line like this. The things likely to go are the suicide doors, the bench and the screen. The steering yoke may stay if the the steering ratio is go-kart direct.
How about replacing windows with HDTV screens all round? Then if you don’t like the scenery (say a blighted urban area), you can replace it with, say, the Austrian Alps. Same goes for the home; windows are a thermal efficiency problem anyway.
Once buyers stop demanding(or being conditioned to demand) “sport” in new cars benches can come back. Few people drive to the level where standard bolstered buckets need to hold them in, and with EVs and AVs they’d be more practical than ever.
With the battery pack down low, most EVs can corner pretty hard. With better tires than the usual skinnies they come with, EVs corner like crazy. But like you said, few people drive like me. 😉
It doesn’t take much of a lateral G-force to make you look for some lateral support. You will find yourself moving towards the corner of the bench and the door even when you drive slow. To me lateral support is less about sportiness and more about active safety.
Well I’m saying EVs will give you the space efficiency to make a bench physically manageable, and if you believe the narritave that AVs won’t be far behind mass EV adoption, G- force corner carving will be a lost art anyway.
Well I don’t think true benches like this concept will ever come back. But there is no reason they can’t have reasonably bolstered buckets with a jump seat in the middle like what pickups do. Some minivans do that in the middle row too.
Are front bench seats in our future? Well, in Japan, they’re in the present – they never went away – and that’s why they’re in this concept car. Front benches are common in the kei cars that dominate the JDM – and it’s amazing how much they add to the sense of space in such small, narrow cars. Not being hemmed in on the sides, you might as well be driving a midsize in some cases.
Exactly! This is the point. In a narrow car, a bench seat is not intended for a third occupant. Who wants a narrow, almost useless center console in there? I’m pretty sure these bench seats are coming back, even outside Japan. The Citroen C-Cactus has a similar concept and is doing quite well here in Europe. Regarding safety concerns, that’s nonsense. If it would be a real problem, they would put an airbag between the seats. The switch to electric cars also means completely different floorplans, and very improbable transmission humps!
I like the idea of cars with/without center console as an option or dependent of the version you buy, as in some full size pickups.
I like this idea! I know buckets technically offer more body-holding but I honestly can’t count how many cars I’ve read reviews of that “lack sufficient side support” or some such complaint.
This is not a car meant to be thrown into the twisties by a disgruntled ex-S2000 owner. Rather, I think it appeals to the increasingly non-car enthusiastic millennial as a sort of cocoon/lounge on wheels, an idea explored by the Nissan Cube and a handful of concepts like the Ford SYNUS.
The bench seat is perfect for this, whether it’s for curling up with Netflix on your smartphone while waiting for your next class or a (cramped) threesome with your swinger buddies.
As a corner-carving millennial, I still wouldn’t be afraid to drive this. Suede-like material on the seating surfaces goes a long way to prevent slip-n-sliding.
I doubt we’ll see it, for all the very good reasons mentioned elsewhere.
Honda have already shown (with the the edix) that you can fit three across the front, with each person getting their own proper seat. And the middle seat folds down into a central console thing, for those who want that. Quite a wide car though.
The height of Americans can vary widely. With a bench seat adjusted for 5 foot 2 inch driver, a 6 foot 4 inch passenger can’t even get into the car. Not in front anyway.
As some one who has always been a “bit broad in the beam”, I wouldn’t mind them returning. They may not have been the most supportive but when you came with your own “padding” sometimes they were a darn sight more comfortable!
LOL..and yes Brendan they weren’t ideal for “that” but when it was a chance at “Paradise by the dashboard light”…. I’m sure I’m not the only guy that still smiles when I see a bench seat sedan at a car show!?
I visited IAA 2017 exhibition in Frankfurt last month and had seen this concept car in person. The car isn‘t that large so the bench seat would not accommodate three persons at all.
It‘s refresheningly simpler and cleaner in appearance.
What I find horrifying is the BACKseat/shelf. Looks like the soon-to-be tested semistanding airline seats for no premium passengers.
One of my favorite features in my F-150 is the bench seat. On the new trucks Ford does it about as well as I’ve seen. Still a decent amount of center console storage when folded down and space to put my laptop bag, small cooler, or my wife’s large purse on the floor. Full seat with head restraint and shoulder belt when up. Combined with three head restraints in the rear a crew cab is a true 6 seater, though the center front passenger needs to be small due to the transmission hump.
Those completely flat seats in the Honda just aren’t realistic. But I still like that they tried.
As others mentioned above, one issue with modern cars is that most are too narrow for this. Just a week ago I had a heck of a time getting two booster seats in the back of my mom’s Edge. Essentially impossible for the kids to buckle themselves in due to how tight and low the buckles were.
It occurs to me that one of the big drivers of the console trend was the floor shifter. Consoles were sporty extras where the column shift reigned but once the floor shifter took over the console was right behind.
Today the floor shifter is an anachronism. After all, in all but a few cases it doesn’t go into the transmission right under it (as floor shifters traditionally did). Linkages and cables can allow a mechanical shifter to be placed about anywhere and the era of electronics is making mechanical control of the transmission obsolete anyhow.
So by all means, lets keep consoles in low-slung RWD cars with big transmission tunnels and stick shifts. But that class contains how many cars these days?
Never having owned an automatic car, I bristle at the insistence that manual shift is anachronistic, and while it’s certainly possible to put a manual shifter on the dash or column, I’d just as soon not. (Likewise stupid electronic parking brakes, which defeat the entire purpose of having an emergency brake!)
I also generally like consoles if they’re thoughtfully designed — mine (which accompanies a manual shift lever and proper fly-off handbrake) has an elbow rest, a two-tiered storage box, and two cupholders with a flip-up cover, all of which are very handy especially on longer trips.
On the other hand, I would certainly agree that the ubiquity of the center console is pretty silly, especially in a crossover or minivan. I’d rather designers tailored the interior layout to the application rather than push for a different nonsensical one-size-fits-all approach.
Yeah, as someone whose first car was three-on-the-tree, I have no issues with a console for a manual.
But with an automatic it’s usually just silly and a waste of space.
The bench seat does look like something you might see in your home rather than a car, plus that big screen – is this going to be one of those driverless cars where you can sit back and lounge while it is in motion? I have seen this prototype before on this and other sites – I like the homage it pays to the original Civic, and by the look of things the Austin Allegro too with the ‘quartic’ steering wheel. I’m sure once (and if) Honda builds it, it will be a lot more conventional.
Well thats very cute with a bench seat. I’m sure my butt would not be comfortable on that slab of cloth and vinyl.
The Citroën Cactus, when ordered with the automatic, has a benchseat.(seats two, but still a benchseat)
The JDM Toyota bB (Scion xB) had a split bench, column shift and unobstructed leg room.
If you don’t remember true contour free bench seats, lacking a center armrest, especially in vinyl, you don’t know how miserable they were. My folks had a ’61 Buick Special wagon that epitomized this. The seats actually tapered a bit down and back at the door, making ingress and egress a bit easier, but were simply stupid for driving. My very petite grandmother was the first owner of my parent’s Buick wagon, and she found herself sliding around on that flat bench and didn’t like it at all.
You don’t need Recaro seats and a five-point harness for driving to the grocery store, but it surprises me that Honda, a company with a reputation for good ergonomics, would model a seat that is less ergonomic than the average airport shuttle seat.
We don’t need a return to this………