The once a decade Cadillac ‘rebirth.’ By 1992, that was becoming a tradition of sorts. The Seville’s 4th generation made a bit of noise in automotive circles at launch, as there were high hopes the brand could turn the corner after the dismal 80’s. The Seville came in an attractive package, especially compared to the stale lineup Cadillac was saddled with by the early 90’s.
Indeed, the Seville was a step in the right direction. Eyebrows were raised; here was a sharply styled sedan with echoes of the ‘sheer look,’ providing a welcomed contrast in the lozenge-obsessed 90’s. Being in college at the time, I took notice; this was no ordinary Caddy. Would the brand keep the momentum going?
Well, that would take another decade or so of missteps; the rest of the lineup would remain stale, the Catera would be launched, and as the owner reviews show, GM’s quality was still subpar. And this with R & T’s commenting being charitable (gotta keep that advertising revenue). Owner sample wasn’t that large on the survey, and yet a bunch of nagging issues are apparent. This in an age where Lexus had redefined the market.
That said, without the Seville and Eldorado, Cadillac would have probably completely imploded.
As it’s rather known, GM styling vice president Chuck Jordan didn’t score many styling hits during his ’86-’92 tenure. I assume Chuck’s first few years were dedicated to fix with cladding, revised prows and extended tails the mess he inherited. The few sedans GM launched between ’90-’92 are probably a closer reflection of his original intentions, with the Park Avenue and Seville being his best efforts.
GM had a team of accomplished designers, engineers, et al; in spite of all evidence to the contrary. A lot of GM’s show cars had taut lines, drama, and dynamic shapes; taunting advanced engineering. Granted, most were teenage wet dreams, but not necessarily bad dreams. Chuck and team had teased a new direction for Cadillac since the mid 80’s with a series of show cars, and here it finally came to fruition. The Seville brought a sense of modernity that placed Cadillac back in the game, with a modern cabin and good looking lines, all with a very American style.
Now, those designer dreams had to deal with GM’s corporate culture, and here’s where dreams turned into nightmares. For all involved: designers, engineers, consumers.
Notice I said ‘good’ looking lines, not ‘great.’ As the K-Body platform had to be carried over, some structural hard points had to remain. That may explain the somewhat symmetric-in-profile greenhouse that keeps the vehicle’s shape from being truly dynamic; then, the decade old FWD platform creates some not well proportioned overhangs.
Now, to the gasket in the coal mine; engine issues didn’t appear on this survey, but we now know of the Northstar’s affinity for blown head gaskets (amid other issues). Once again, GM had promised a ‘stellar’ product to leapfrog the competition; a tour de force advanced 8 cyl. engine that performed impressively when new… and could fail catastrophically as the miles accrued. Worst, most were the result of the engine design itself, and would plague the power plant for years in spite of efforts to improve it.
That said, most of the complaints in R & T’s survey are of a minor variety. Minor being a relative term, with an owner expressing “A $50,000 car shouldn’t rattle like this one does.” Indeed, rattles that by the mid 90’s wouldn’t even exist in a Japanese car half the cost. Cadillac would remain for the faithful for the remaining of the decade, in wait for better days.
I remember going to dealer to check out the new STS/Northstar in 1995. I told salesman I would not be buying it, but I would very much like to test drive one–and he let me take it for spin.
That was the quickest car I had ever driven! Between the power and appearance, inside and out, I remember thinking, “finally, a good car from GM! Now if only they can make Chevys and Pontiacs this good…”
I remember riding with a client in his new Eldorado, right after the Northstar engine had been introduced. I found the car impressive (from a passenger’s perspective) and the owner bragged about how fast it was. If only that kind of performance could have been had with the durability of the old Cadillac V8s that lasted into the very early 80s or even the 4.5.
I had a 1995 Fleetwood. Red metallic, steel roof, light tan leather seats. That car was a tomb inside in terms of silence and ride quality, did not rattle, despite it being 15 years old when I bought it.
That barge was my long distance cruiser for 3 years, drove it from 55k to 75k, only problem I had was the A/C refrigerant leaking out, just a $200 recharge and a patch on the leak.
Im sure a fwd Seville would have drove/handled a lot nicer than my big Fleetwood, but I kind of had the impression no matter how damn nice all those FWD Cadillacs were trouble prone. My car was basically a Caprice cop car in drag lol
These still look good to me after 30 years, but they still don’t say “Cadillac.” Then in ’94, they make the Deville bloated and dated like the Fleetwood Brougham instead of enlarging on the Seville.
After all the problems with the aluminum HT4100 in the 80s, they really had no excuse for not getting the Northstar screwed together right. Taking a dozen years (2004) to finally fix the problem was an even bigger crime. OTOH, I was able to buy a 3 y.o. 2004 Deville for less than a third of its original list because of the engine’s reputation.
I had no idea the HT4100 had wet cylinder liners. How dumb is that? Fine for a all cast iron diesel…Not so fine for a aluminum block with iron liners…
I think it was a mistake to switch from the 4.9 liter to the smaller DOHC Northstar. As the Germans by then all had outgrown their inline sixes they had sort of standardized on a DOHC V8 in the 4 liter range. Lexus and Infiniti of course followed suit. Meanwhile Cadillac was alone in offering traditional American V8 power delivery, torque peak more than 1000 rpm below the Germans and Japanese, teamed with front drive. A unique offering that gave the buyer more choice. There was no need to start a me too movement, leave that to Japan.
Now if that generation of Seville could have gone RWD and reestablished the size difference with Deville, say a 2008 CTS with a standard 4.9 V8 in 1992, world beater.
A pushrod engine would have been a non starter with the conquest sales Cadillac wanted. The existing buyers would also would accept it, if it weren’t a fragile POS.
I remember a GM engineer defending the 3800 in the luxury and near luxury cars in his portfolio. “It’s the best value.” But it wasn’t what they wanted in their cars.
The problem Caddy had though was itself walking away from the customers it had. To the point that in 1994 the Deville became an austere and conservative trim group on a Seville platform. This at a time when the Deville was by far their best seller. Is the buyer going to notice the extra stiffness, the lack of the little trim extras and understand he is being disrespected, of course.
As far as conquest sales, read the many comments here and ask yourself? Is someone who hates you because of his politics and daddy issues going to give you a chance? There was just no chance of that, no matter how much Bruno Sacco liked your Seville.
As far as the 90s 3800 in a lower class of car. It worked better than the other domestic 3.8s copied from it. Also, I would argue than the 90 degree V6s in Acuras and Audis, where they had in their way short changed on displacement, at the cost of automatic transmission performance. The import lovers will say well, you should have got the stick, so they do not have to think about the failure.
It was “abused customer syndrome”. GM had sold so many bad engines, that even their most loyal customers didn’t trust them and insisted on ye olde Buick 3800.
Lexus and Infiniti were the first to bring four-cam V8s to market as standard premium luxury car engines. When the LS400 and Q45 showed up, BMW offered SOHC I6s and V12s. Mercedes offered SOHC V8s with larger displacements and much less power. The Japanese were leaders from the start. The Germans had to step up their games to compete.
Cadillac really needed two car lines to both keep the aging traditionalist happy & to fight the Eurrcars for younger buyers. A 4.9 powered FWD line: Eldo, Seville, Deville, Fleetwood & an NS w/ all-wheel drive ETC, STS, DTS, FTS. The traditional Cadillac owner was not happy with the high cost (labor-engine out) of NS and Euro-buyer did not respect cadillac’s reasonable prices, less than rock solid (vs. German) construction & front wheel drive. This owner survey is very positive considering R&T and its readers are among the most Euro biased out there. As for the NS it was a great engine until “lifetime”Dexcool (97-up), which destroyed the small fine threat head bolts. The post 2000 have bigger bolts, 2004/5 fixed w/ coarse thread bolts. CHANGE YOUR COOLANT EVERY TWO YEARS.
I had a ’95 SLS as my daily from 2009-2015 that had been in the family since 1998. It was an excellent car to drive, and didn’t rattle even to the end. It did have a few assembly errors and/or trim items whose attachment wasn’t sufficient to keep attached. It had some parts bin items which I felt weren’t satisfying, especially the then-ancient GM steering column. It was ultimately done in by the need for engine-out replacement of some rusted out freeze plugs, an expensive repair which wouldn’t have guaranteed immunity from any of the other possible engine-out Northstar troubles. During my years driving it, it did require $1,000+ repairs twice and $500+ repairs 6 times. It was expensive to keep going, but it went to its grave with the same head gaskets it came with.
All of that said, I’d say that the used ownership experience was as good or better than I’d expect from a 15-20 year old luxury car, regardless of brand. Luxury brands are known for being expensive to keep at that age, with Lexus being a notable exception. I would say that the driver of a Mercedes, BMW, or even Volvo of similar age and mileage would’ve been fighting the same kind of things that I did: sensors, coil packs, and suspension wear items. I don’t see many of them around, but I do see them.
When everything was on point, though, it was a superb drive. Very comfortable seats, solid body, excellent brakes, and good FWD handling were good attributes to have when covering miles. Brisk acceleration and appealing sounds from the engine were even better. During the years I had it, I sure considered it to be cooler than I was, and I definitely miss it. Was it perfect? No, but I sure guarantee that it was leaps and bounds better than many of the comments will give it credit for.
These are very plain looking cars. Not Cadillacs. Embracing the modernist, monochrome look was refreshing for a bit – but not now. These cars lack details that make them stand out. Those engines were lemons. By trying not to offend, Cadillac styling during this period pulled back too far and their appeal at the time was what they were not – traditional Cadillacs. The problem is that there isn’t anything really there beyond not being traditional. Not making a statement, isn’t why people buy Cadillacs.
Sure they weren’t the old 1980s, but they weren’t much of anything.
Wow. Just another copy/paste article to show the disdain for Cadillac and American brands in general. Sad.
I was selling these along side Buick’s, GMC’s and Honda’s. Did the Northstar have some issues? Yes, but the vast majority of them would have 100K or more with few if any issues. You can find a lot of them out there yet today running super with 200K + on the clock.
Rattles? This article says they had more rattles than most import brands at half the price? Really? Maybe the writer should have been working next to me with the Honda’s. They were some of the noisiest cars and rattle they did. If you opted for the automatic, you had the joy of massive vibrations through the floor and steering wheel that would be so bad that the entire car would buzz. Yup, quality alright! As for costs? Lexus has not and is not some super low cost brand to own. Talk to some of the owners or past owners. Lastly, how about comparing these Cadillac’s to Volvo, MB, BMW, Jaguar, Infinit and Lexus when it comes to ownership costs?
These Seville/STS’s were a huge hit for Cadillac and we sold the heck out of them. People liked them and yes they were more reliable with the 4.9 V8. But with the proper care and upkeep, even the NS 4.6 V8 would run the miles with few issues and performance that was stellar. Oh well, I guess if I wish to read positive articles about GM products, I need to keep looking. It sure doesn’t seem to be on this site.
I think you may have possibly missed the part that the article posted was an OWNER’S survey. Every respondent did purchase the car, it appears that a number seemed to regret it.
There are plenty of positive articles about GM cars on this site. I believe I myself posted one yesterday. But there is also plenty of fodder for the other side, which based on GMs market share trajectory seems to not necessarily be inaccurate. If you are simply looking for glowing accolades of all things GM, then their corporate newsletter might be a better outlet to read.
Feel free to write and submit an article about any car you might like to write about, it’s not difficult to do and provides a creative outlet. It can be positive, it can be negative, however it should be rooted in reality, otherwise the readership may provide counterarguments. Every carmaker has the odd lemon or two, some have the misfortune of harvesting (or perhaps nurturing?) an orchard of them. To simply say that every Honda with an automatic is a rattly and buzzy mess flies in the face of what all too many Honda owners on this site have found to not be true and if anything, diminishes your own credibility more than that of Honda as a manufacturer. Sure they have their problem cars, but it simply isn’t the vast majority and generally they are well designed for their purpose and last for the long haul.
Jim: I appreciate what you say, but with just over 12 years of selling Honda’s along side the Buick, Cadillac and GMC’s, It’s not like I just had one or two or three bad experiences with Honda. Every single 4 cyl Honda with an auto (this from 1988 to 1995 at least) did exactly the same thing. What I found in those 12+ years of dealing with Honda buyers was that they always had an excuse or “logical” reasoning why they still got the Honda even with it’s lack of refinement. When I was back at that same dealership from 2007 till 2011, the Honda’s had improved some, but still lacked in so many ways.
As for the survey being form owners? Yes, I did catch that. I’m sure the number of respondents for that survey is/was quite small compared to the overall number of Cadillac buyers who were quite happy and didn’t have major issues. But let’s fast forward to 2022 where I’m now located in a different state (unfortunately that’s not American brand friendly) and working with both Volvo and Mazda. Costs to repair the Volvo’s are sky high and they have tepid reliability at best. Mazda isn’t much better and both show that in the JD Power and even Consumer Reports. All GM brands have done and do well in those.
Oh well, it’s just me putting on loud speaker that I feel the articles on here seem to be biased towards certain brands for sure.
GM’s reliability is supposedly better today than in the past, which isn’t saying a whole lot. I was a GM service advisor in 2005-2006 and with the exception of the trucks, the cars were junk. They would have expensive repairs right out of warranty.
Much of GMs quality problem was due it its high overhead. Going bust in 2007 did much to reduce costs, hence better reliability.
The present CEO has really turned the company around to show excellent profits.
Canucknucklehead: On your comment below about Cadillac not trying to be BMW: I agree 100%. I feel that was the time (when they decided to chase the Germans) that Cadillac lost it’s way.
As for the repairs and the cars being junk: I just can’t agree one bit. I’ve been working with/around GM cars from 1988. I have owned many, my family has owned many and still does, I’ve sold tons of them and there’s also a little thing called JD Powers that would all beg to differ with what you say. Heck, even Consumer Reports, who has always hated American brands, has recognized GM (especially Buick) for making very good cars. As for JD Power, this isn’t like CR and just the past few years. JD Power has placed Buick quite high or even at the top ever since I’ve been working in this business. Cadillac has moved way up with them as well. And JD Power is survey results oriented based on the owners.
Finally, not only have I purchased many new GM vehicles, but I’ve also purchased many older and higher miles ones as well. The most recent was a 2006 Buick Lucerne CXL V8 (Northstar) with 150K on the clock. Outside of mostly routine things, the previous owner loved the car and so did I. I got it for a fun second car, but sold it a year later as I was able to make money on it. Anyhow, I now work at a Volvo and Mazda store and I can tell you that in 2022, both these brands have a long way to go to be at the level of the current GM products.
Like I said, GM’s quality has improved greatly since the belly-up thingy.
I have been burned by GM like no other brand. I’ll never buy another one.
I’ve seen this whole “chasing BMW” and I don’t entirely agree with it. I think their goal was to show that an American car using American technology can compete with Mercedes and BMW. These new Cadillacs use Corvette V8 power. Combined with great handling and braking they did eventually prove it. The cars were even raced in Europe with a great showing.
But you will never get a Mercedes or BMW fan to consider a Cadillac. They are to passionate of their own brands. Plus of course even Mercedes and BMW are now changing their focus to CUV’s
Bob G:
My comment about chasing after the German (imports in general) is directly from the in person and online training I went through with Cadillac over the years. Back in 1988, the “competitive comparison guide” from Cadillac was mostly up against brands such as Lincoln (#1), Chrysler and even Buick/Olds in some cases. In the early 90’s, they began to use MB and Lexus along with Lincoln and Chrysler. This of course was with the exception of the Allante and STS Seville where they compared those more to the imports. This was a transition Cadillac made in which they told us they were going after the import buyers. Dealer and sales people constantly said that those buyers would not cross over and look at Cadillac’s. But GM/Cadillac wouldn’t listen and that’s (IMO) when Cadillac took the wrong turn.
> The once a decade Cadillac ‘rebirth.’ By 1992, that was becoming a tradition of sorts.
Let’s catalogue Cadillac’s “rebirths” during my lifetime:
– the downsized ’77s and ’79 Eldorado
– the push for efficiency in the ’80s – diesels, FWD, V8-6-4, Cimarron, HT4100, Buick V6s, a second round of downsizing. Reliability problems from hell, not to mention image problems from mini-me cars that looked like cheaper GM products.
– correcting course, adding back some of the length and bulk they took off earlier in the decade, with more traditional styling to go along with it. Helps retain former Caddy buyers while further repulsing the increasing numbers buying European or Asian luxury cars
– more import-like style and performance, along with further upsizing with the ’90s lineup; the Northstar debuts.
– the Art & Science design language and a return to RWD, starting with the CTS.
– Cadillac is the new BMW: sharp styling, tight steering, and great chassis tuning; too bad about the rental-car-grade interiors.
– The Electriq era.
> The 93-96 Seville was a step in the right direction
The original ’75/76 Seville was a step in the right direction. Cadillac has had too many halfhearted “steps in the right direction” without fully following through afterward since then to be taken seriously as the “standard of the world” they once truly were. Hardly any of Cadillac’s “steps in the right direction” panned out in the long run.
The current Blackwing CT4 and CT5 with manual transmissions are the first Caddys I could see myself owning since…. a very long time. After decades of trying, Cadillac has built a better BMW, just as the real BMW abdicated their role as “the ultimate driving machine” focusing on gadget-laden crossovers rather than road feel and a sporty driving experience. Meanwhile, Tesla has become the standard-bearer in its class, and has opened the door for startups like Lucid and Rivian, both with outstanding first efforts. Now Cadillac is shifting their focus to a new design language (again) and building on GM’s Ultium EV platform. Will they finally follow through on the promise of their latest concept car, the Celestiq? I’m very impressed with it, but it’s a big stretch to expect buyers to fork over $300K for a car that usually sells in the five-digit range, and most of their (usually excellent) concept cars of the last two decades never made it anywhere near production.
So many rebirths…
What a shame Cadillac seemed unable to build on any of them and carry that momentum forward.
I think you forgot the one that Zigged. Or did it Zag? You know, the Opel Omega Catera…
Are people buying the Blackwing stuff? I wonder how it’ll hold up. BMW as you said does seem to have changed, their main focus seems to be making profits rather than fun cars now. But there really aren’t many places you can even enjoy the uber-powerful stuff anymore, and are you really going to a trackday in a Caddy? Probably not, tootling along in the carpool lane you might as well be in an Accord.
Any $300k car is not a volume model by default and thus not indicative of anything else that the brand may produce. They’ll give a few to a couple of rappers and maybe pay some teenage heaththrob “influencers” and in the process turn off just as many as they may have turned on. Good luck with that one, it’s DOA.
50k with rattles such a nice noise so cheap, my daily was nearly 70k new and has a lovely diesel rattle, I didnt pay that much the new was well worn away before I bought it but that noise remains intact, you cant hear it inside but I guess you cant have everything.
This was one of those efforts GM made in the area that got to 85 or 90% of what the design needed to be. I found these really attractive and loved the idea of the V8, and it was a hot one. And it was far more original than what Lincoln was doing then.
But.
The engine was just a head scratcher, with its baked-in weaknesses. The owners complained of low resale value – that had not been a Cadillac problem in forever, but the used car market is a pretty good judge of cars, and when one so attractive and well-conceived gets dinged at trade it, it means lots of people have suffered from the mechanical problems.
Cadillac lost its brand cache around the time I was born, and when I was in my teens they made tasteless, frumpy cars for old butts. They’ve been trying to regain their caché for my entire life (I’m 40) but for someone like me who never understood that they were anything but as described above, I wonder what’s the point? I also don’t understand why there are still Cadillac diehards. Someone tell me why.
Didn’t realize these dated back all the way to ’93. I forgot how long Cadillac has been trying to compete with European dynamics and styling.
The body came out in MY ’92 with the 200 hp 4.9L, the Northstar in ’93 on the STS.
They can make as many cramped, hard-riding sedans as they want, as long as they have one that’s truly roomy and comfortable. The old Cadillac ride was been gone 25 years.
I never understood why Cadillac wanted to be BMW.
Cadillacs are about cruising down the Interstate in total, isolated comfort.
I had a two year old ’94 STS, bought with 28,000 miles. Mine was black in and out, with chromed ’96 wheels and I had a moonroof installed at purchase. This was my dream car and it was impressive; in looks, space, roadability, and performance. The sound of the engine was ferocious under acceleration. During it’s first years it garnered a lot of attention everywhere I went. Mine was well assembled, and the wood and leather and sleek dash made for a pleasant cabin. my only gripe was that the carpet looked a bit cheap.
I kept mine for almost another 100,000 miles over almost ten years. The last third of my ownership was when the problems started, the most serious was the engine oil leak.
Overall I was impressed by the car, and thought that Cadillac was on the rise.
These were fast cars, it felt like my current ’06 Mustang GT.
The sound of the engine was ferocious under acceleration.
That is true of most Cadillacs I’ve driven, so it must have been intentional. They wanted you to know when you floored it, but the auto journalists always complained. One of their best dash designs ever, completely different from the older, chrome-encrusted ones. My 04 Deville’s was based on it but not as clean.
I still have my 1995 Seville STS. It’s diamond white with dark blue interior. Has 134k miles on it and drives perfect. No rattles or anything. Drives like it did new.